Quoted: So it looks like the above individuals are as "guilty" as I am, yet, you don't seem to mind their 'transgressions'. Justin

Exactly.

Quoted: Quoted: So it looks like the above individuals are as "guilty" as I am, yet, you don't seem to mind their 'transgressions'. Justin Exactly.

That's what I was looking for.

Well, it seems like the photo initally belonged to Varg, a German member of the HKPto.com forum.

Quoted: A German member of this board named “Varg” posted it way back when and his post got dumped by the mods because that pic was never intended to be public. I think HK likes to keep secrets and/or us in the dark. Here is what varg told me in a PM. “ Hej! Not a mutiny, just a PM,i don`t want to piss off the moderators. Here`s the link to the pic and a short article (sorry, only in German) of the HK45. It was in the November issue (if i recall right) of the Oberndorf H&K plant newspaper. Of course i scanned and posted it immediately at HKPro, but the thread was deleted, because the HK45 was kind of confidential, and the pic shouldn`t even have been in the plant newspaper..... So, i don`t want to post it again, but here`s the link for you:”

Care to comment?

Quoted: Well, it seems like the photo initally belonged to Varg, a German member of the HKPto.com forum. Quoted: A German member of this board named “Varg” posted it way back when and his post got dumped by the mods because that pic was never intended to be public. I think HK likes to keep secrets and/or us in the dark. Here is what varg told me in a PM. “ Hej! Not a mutiny, just a PM,i don`t want to piss off the moderators. Here`s the link to the pic and a short article (sorry, only in German) of the HK45. It was in the November issue (if i recall right) of the Oberndorf H&K plant newspaper. Of course i scanned and posted it immediately at HKPro, but the thread was deleted, because the HK45 was kind of confidential, and the pic shouldn`t even have been in the plant newspaper..... So, i don`t want to post it again, but here`s the link for you:” Care to comment?

Wow, you put alot of research into this didn't you.



Did I say I actually took the photo?

I'm hosting the photo you snagged without asking. Hence my problem with you using my bandwidth without asking. I posted a thread over on HKPro asking about the HK45 this summer. Mr Vickers told me about the HK45 during a carbine/pistol class, but he did not have a picture. I knew those guys are HK fanatics, so somebody would come up with one. One of the fine members of HKPro provided that photo to me.

I have no problem with anybody else using it, but I draw the line at letting you use my bandwidth. You have trolled every HK thread since March. Now you start one of your own? Hell, you have even insulted Larry Vickers himself. Doc set you straight on that one and saved me the trouble. You even take a few cheap shots at HK in this thread.

Host it yourself and move along.

My God the melodrama.

Quoted: Quoted: Well, it seems like the photo initally belonged to Varg, a German member of the HKPto.com forum. Quoted: A German member of this board named “Varg” posted it way back when and his post got dumped by the mods because that pic was never intended to be public. I think HK likes to keep secrets and/or us in the dark. Here is what varg told me in a PM. “ Hej! Not a mutiny, just a PM,i don`t want to piss off the moderators. Here`s the link to the pic and a short article (sorry, only in German) of the HK45. It was in the November issue (if i recall right) of the Oberndorf H&K plant newspaper. Of course i scanned and posted it immediately at HKPro, but the thread was deleted, because the HK45 was kind of confidential, and the pic shouldn`t even have been in the plant newspaper..... So, i don`t want to post it again, but here`s the link for you:” Care to comment? Wow, you put alot of research into this didn't you. Did I say I actually took the photo? I'm hosting the photo you snagged without asking. Hence my problem with you using my bandwidth without asking. I posted a thread over on HKPro asking about the HK45 this summer. Mr Vickers told me about the HK45 during a carbine/pistol class, but he did not have a picture. I knew those guys are HK fanatics, so somebody would come up with one. One of the fine members of HKPro provided that photo to me. I have no problem with anybody else using it, but I draw the line at letting you use my bandwidth. You have trolled every HK thread since March. Now you start one of your own? Hell, you have even insulted Larry Vickers himself. Doc set you straight on that one and saved me the trouble. You even take a few cheap shots at HK in this thread. Host it yourself and move along. My God the melodrama.

Whoa.  Hold it there.


1.  According to the URL of the offending photograph (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/HK45.jpg), it's being hosted by phoobucket.com, not your own personal website.

2.  

Quoted: Did I say I actually took the photo?

Yes.  And apparently, you have a very short lived memory:

Quoted: Thanks for stealing my photo.

Then:

Orginally Posted By VA_Dinger: Hence my problem with you using my bandwidth without asking.

Orignally, you stated that the photograph actually belonged to you, and now (after it has been established that the photo actually belongs to someone else), you claim your gripe is that I used your bandwith, not your photo, without your consent or proper recognition.  Get it straight man.


3.  

Quoted: Hell, you have even insulted Larry Vickers himself. Doc set you straight on that one and saved me the trouble.

Enough with the lies.  You either have me confused with another member or you're just flat out lying as usual.  Luckily, I vaguely recall this incident although the name of the thread escapes me.  Care to post a link so that we can see for ourselves the evidence of your lies firsthand.  In fact, I'll find the thread myself.  I don't take these charges lightly.  I cannot belive that you would stoop so low you miserable little...


4.  

Quoted: You even take a few cheap shots at HK in this thread.

Man, you are really desperate.


ETA:  Here we go you lying son of a bitch: lightfighter.net/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/1931084651/m/8151045461/r/8141092561#8141092561.   You wrote that I insulted Mr. Larry Vickers, that's a hefty fucking charge that I take very seriously.  I have the utmost respect for Mr. vickers and the rest of the Army Special Forces community.  You are an incredible piece of shit.  I cannot belive that you would stoop so low but I should've known not to put it past you.

and we're off to the pit

I cannot believe you are taking this so far.

Personally, I think you must be touched in the head. You also seem to be taking advantage of the Internets safety & anonymity. You would not be bowing up like this if we were just across a dinner table. Well, at least not without consequences.   Calling my mother a bitch is unhealthy at best.

What in the hell does the Lightfighter thread have to do with this? You lost me dude. If I remember correctly your little jab at Mr. Vickers was on an ARFCOM thread. It was just one of the many you have personally helped to F**k up. Doc posted a reply directly to you stating you were lower than a snails balls. Hell, if I remember correctly Doc has posted more than one public flaming of you. Lumpy has also flamed you many times. I have personally flamed you so many times that I now qualify to have you stuffed and mounted over my fireplace. A smart man would learn to keep his trap shut by now.

Lying about it now will not help you. All anybody has do is a "HK416" search to see your behavior in every single thread. It has been a disgrace to ARFCOM.

Since you seem to be a little slow. I will make it easy for you.

(http://img.photobucket.coM/albums/v74/va_dinger/HK45.jpg)

NOTICE THE VA_DINGER IN THE URL? I'M HOSTING THE PHOTO YOU USED WITHOUT ASKING. That makes this photo mine. If you want to use my bandwidth, ask for it or at least give me credit. I would have told you to get lost, but it would have saved you the embarrassment of another public Internet beat down. How many times have you been banned already?

You’re too easy. It's like beating up a 5th grader. I almost feel guilty.

ALMOST

Now shut your trap and let the thread move on.

Quoted: I cannot believe you are taking this so far. Personally, I think you must be touched in the head. You also seem to be taking advantage of the Internets safety & anonymity. You would not be bowing up like this if we were just across a dinner table. Well, at least not without consequences. What in the hell does the Lightfighter thread have to do with this? You lost me dude. If I remember correctly your little jab at Mr. Vickers was on an ARFCOM thread. It was just one of the many you have personally helped to F**k up. Doc posted a reply directly to you stating you were lower than a snails balls. Hell, if I remember correctly Doc has posted more than one public flaming of you. Lumpy has also flamed you many times. I have personally flamed you so many times that I now qualify to have you stuffed and mounted over my fireplace. A smart man would learn to keep his trap shut by now. Lying about it now will not help you. All anybody has do is a "HK416" search to see your behavior in every single thread. It has been a disgrace to ARFCOM. Since you seem to be a little slow. I will make it easy for you. (http://img.photobucket.coM/albums/v74/va_dinger/HK45.jpg) NOTICE THE VA_DINGER IN THE URL? I'M HOSTING THE PHOTO YOU USED WITHOUT ASKING. That makes this photo mine. If you want to use my bandwidth, ask for it or at least give me credit. I would have told you to get lost, but it would have saved you the embarrassment of another public Internet beat down. How many times have you been banned already? You’re too easy. It's like beating up a 5th grader. I almost feel guilty. ALMOST Now shut your trap and let the thread move on.

What the fuck is wrong with you?  You accuse me of insulting Mr. Vickers yet you cannot even produce a link to this alleged insult when challenged.  The burden of proof is on you, dipshit.

Flamed by Lumpy196 (Chris) and DocGKR (Dr. Roberts) many times?   WTF are you talking about?  Lay off the drugs man, they're really having a detrimental effect on your thinking abilities (or maybe you just have a naturally shallow gene pool).  Again, you want to fabricate random cliams, then back them up with evidence (in this case, a link).  The only time that I can recall Dr. Roberts chastised me directly was in the follwing discussion (www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=247119&page=22)  with the exact words:

Quoted: So if I understand correctly, you want me to just freely post this information that cost many man hours of time and significant monetary investment so a bunch of strangers can take it and rip it off?

Now, being that I'm somewhat familar with your pathetic MO, I know you'll be quick to lie again and quote the follwing excerpt from Dr. Robert's comment so allow me to save you the trouble:

Quoted: My post above was intended to get some of the folks here thinking.  Truly valid information is hard to come by.  This type of information is often restricted and is very time consuming and costly to obtain.  In short, it is VALUABLE.  If an organization has funded certain tests, they may not wish that information revealed publicly for a variety of reasons.   Many folks do not seem to realize the enormous costs involved in both time and money in correctly gathering, interpreting, and then publicly releasing even a small bit of this type of valuable information.  One would think that the general public might be appreciative or even grateful to receive such priceless gems of data, but as we have seen demonstrated so many times, this is not the case.  In fact, as this is the internet and freedom of speech is cherished, it is very easy for inbred Billy Bob Sperm Breath to come along and post just about any comment he wants without a shred of evidence to back up the purported veracity of his statements.  Billy Bob and others of his ilk think nothing of churlishly bashing hard earned accurate data and repeating hosts of erroneous gunporn lore and other BS.  The other tedious aspect is the incredible laziness shown by many people in not doing some basic research or sleuthing prior to asking questions, making comments, or offering advice.  Is it any wonder why widely acknowledged, proven experts like Ken Hackathorn, Larry Vickers, Pat Rogers, Duncan MacPherson, and others generally choose not to participate?

I am guilty of what I have highlighted in blue.  For those of you that are not familiar with that particular discussion, the excerpt highlighted in red was in response to a member who blatantly challenged the scientific data provided by Dr. Roberts and proceeded to accuse him of pushing the 6.8 SPC because he stood to gain some sort of monetary compensation.  Now, just like the coward before us today, VA_Dinger, this above mentioned member (referred to as Billy Bob Sperm Breath) neglected to include any factual data or evidence supporting his claim just as VA_Dinger has done today.

So much for that flame that you were referring to:

Orignally Posted By CitySlicker: Dr. Roberts, What else can I say other than I apologize and it won't happen again? I will see to it that I do some cursory research before bombarding you with questions. Thank you for your time. Regards, Justin

Quoted: No problem Justin, my comments were not solely directed at you--it was just an opportune moment to vent.  Take care.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=247119&page=22

Notice that I have the dignity and confidence to man up and acknowledge my error whereas you on the other hand just edit your comments as evidenced in that same thead:

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The USMC is soliciting a 6.8 carbine. Things going on with the Air Force too. Not exactly but at the industry briefing, USMC stated that they were looking at the 6.8 as combat round.  Can't say anymore than that.   Same for USAF.   Sorry,gag request. Isn't this the same thing we heard about the Coast Guard and .499 a few years ago? Look how that turned out.

Follwed by what you like to refer to as a 'flame' wonderfully executed by none other than Paul Leitner-Wise:

Quoted: No dickbreath, this was an INDUSTRY briefing.

But curiously, your comment can no longer be found on that page.  It was removed by you three days later and replaced with:

Quoted: Edit - Not one of my better days.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=247119&page=18


And there we have it sports' fans, the work of a true coward.  Instead of owning up and facing it like a man, you retract your comment like the gutless coward that you are.

But you know what entertains me most about you, the fact that you're a wannabee poser with no practical expereinece yet who thinks he knows it all.  Case in point: www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=17&t=252659.  In this thread, you chastise npd233 for not supporting the tactical reload doctrine and you continue to do so as evidenced here:

Quoted: Is npd233 the "Tactical Reload" genuis who helped kill the HK mag thread?

www.ar15.com/forus/topic.html?b=1&f=130&t=401022


The funny thing is that npd233 is a law enforcement officer and depends on his weapons, training, and doctrine to preserve his life on a daily basis and thus makes his decisions with considerable thought and effort since his life depends on it.  

Quoted: While I understand and can even appreciate the theory of tac reloads, you won't catch me trying to find somewhere to stash a semi emptied magazine. It's purely a personal decision based on my desire to survive.

He has taken all of this into account and decided not to execute tactical reloads, and that's where you step in.  You, who has absolutely zero practical firearms experience, and yet spouts off like an uber tactical sage.  What's your excuse?  "I learned in a class.  I was taught by (insert subject matter expert here).  You don't know what you're talking about.  (Insert BTDT guy's name here) told me so."  Your actual quote:

Quoted: I have brains enough to trust the experts who taught me these facts. You can believe whatever you like.

And:

Quoted: Maybe you should contact Blackwater, 10-8 Consulting's instructors, E.A.G. Tactical (Pat Rogers), Thunder Ranch, etc, etc, etc, because each of them teaches the tactical reload. You must know more than all of them.

It's amazing, when politely advised to STFU by Tweak, you still kept going:

Quoted: that is a way, it is not the way

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=17&t=252659&page=5

You have absolutely know fucking real world experience yet you run your mouth like there's no tomorrow.  You counsel and chastise people who face a very real threat of being engaged and possibly (God forbid) dying on a daily basis when the gravest danger you face is slipping tripping over your own abdominal flab while on your way to grab another ice cream from the fridge.  You're nothing more than a wannabee.  You spend thousands of dollars in gear and classes when you have zero chance of ever using it (case in point: that $1,800 S&B Short Dot, developed for Tier 1 military assets and law enforcement personnel, not obese, uber takitkool slobs).  and then you have the audacity to criticize others who actually stare danger and death every day and go back asking for more every time.

Why don't you go practice your tacitcal reloads in case you have to engage the Swanson delivery guy for being late or worse yet, you're home is invaded by droves of killer zombies.

When you get some real world experiece (read: never), maybe then someone will give two shots about what you think.

Go fuck yourself 'cuz I'm done with you.

Justin

Dude, your too much.

So much time wasted researching to end up with nothing more than BS. Your comments only make you look like the know nothing fool that you are.

I know your kind of slow, but Billy Bob Sperm breath is YOU Notice Doc stated that his reply wasn't ONLY meant towards you. That just means it was ALSO meant for a few of the other morons in that thread. Your also conveniently forgetting about the time Doc flamed you for the LAV comment. I understand why you try to forget it, it was moronic to the say the least. If I remember correctly it had something to do with the S&B short dot being “Not all that”. Trust me, I know better than to question Doc on anything. He is the man.

My edit was out of respect for Paul and for no other reason. I have grown to respect him so I edited out my comment. I did not want another flame war. You know the kind you love. It seems to be your only purpose on ARFCOM.

Feel free to contact me anytime you want to school me. I'm sure we can work something out, but sadly that would mean you would have to step away from the keyboard. I would love to hear your opinion on Tac reloads and 28 round loading. Oh, I forgot you probably do not even own a mag. Maybe you could list the pistol/carbine classes you have attended? How about your military service? How about your IDPA experience? Why don't you list the firearms you own or the optics/accessories you have experience with? I would love to hear about your "Real World Experience".

Your insults are childish and moronic and that’s being kind. I might not be in the best shape of my life, but your insults are moronic. Is that the best you can do?

It sounds more like jealous rage to me.

My advice would be to go buy and AR and actually shoot it. You will be a better man. Talking about something you do not do is moronic.

I also like the silly lies about your obvious trolling. One search ARFCOM search of "HK416" will highlight everything about you that needs to be said.

Judging by the rage displayed in your reply, I think it's time to clear that spot above my fireplace.

Thanks for making me laugh. I needed it tonight.

You wrecked your own thread with this stupid shit.

this is like watching whos a bigger baby then they are thread

Fight! Fight!

Just stopping by is there any new inforamtion on this weapon, or is this thread just in the duimps?

The excitement for the HK45 has temporarily lessened. Alot more has been focused on the P3000 that was shown at the Paris Milipol show.

A new revised HK45 has been produced, but so far I have not seen any new pictures.

Quoted: The excitement for the HK45 has temporarily lessened. Alot more has been focused on the P3000 that was shown at the Paris Milipol show. A new revised HK45 has been produced, but so far I have not seen any new pictures.

Yeah I saw pics of the P3000 (essentially a full size P2000), but it didn't do too much for me.

I'm looking forward to the HK45.

Quoted: Quoted: The excitement for the HK45 has temporarily lessened. Alot more has been focused on the P3000 that was shown at the Paris Milipol show. A new revised HK45 has been produced, but so far I have not seen any new pictures. Yeah I saw pics of the P3000 (essentially a full size P2000), but it didn't do too much for me. I'm looking forward to the HK45.

Really? I really liked the styling of the P3000 and I have a sneaking suspision that the HK45 will look similar.

Either way, I'm already saving my cash for the HK45!

I can't believe you guys wasted so much time trying to flame each other.  Seriously, get something better to do.  Who cares who was right?  This is a forum on a WEBSITE.  Move on.

Quoted: I can't believe you guys wasted so much time trying to flame each other.  Seriously, get something better to do.  Who cares who was right?  This is a forum on a WEBSITE.  Move on.

Shhh... I think everyone has moved on.

The thread is now just quietly biding its time until the next infusion of HK45 info.

tag,,,to get some popcorn

Quoted: Quoted: I can't believe you guys wasted so much time trying to flame each other.  Seriously, get something better to do.  Who cares who was right?  This is a forum on a WEBSITE.  Move on. Shhh... I think everyone has moved on. The thread is now just quietly biding its time until the next infusion of HK45 info.

I could not agree more.

I cannot wait for the production HK45 to finally surface at SHOT. Judging by the caliber of the guys helping to design it (Hackathorn and Vickers) and the first hand reviews you can read from the pro's on 10-8, I think this pistol is worth getting excited about.

I understand that HK had the production model on display at the Internal State Security Exhibition, Milipol 2005 (Paris, France) a few weeks ago, but I have not been able to find any photos as of yet.

This is the photo that a HKPro board member emailed me a few months ago:




Please except my apologies for the little outburst. It needed to be done before he attempted to turn this into another HK flame thread. He has a history of trying to bad mouth HK to gain points on another industry forum. He has done the same exact thing in every HK416 thread for the past six months. It's not worth going into further. Let’s just move on.

The new 45 looks great but I couldn't imagine liking my Tactical 45 and USPc 45 more than I already do. It would be nice to have a "normal" rail for those few times I would mount a light. I have the GGG adapter on my Tactical and it stays in the nightstand with a light until I take it to the range to practice.

The only gripe I had with my compact was the trigger. I bought it with both an LEM (installed) and a Var 1 trigger group. I like the idea of the LEM for my carry piece but an 8lb trigger pull was a bit much. All of that was remedied when I found a link by Bigbore over at HKpro (credit where credit is due ) showing how to reduce the pull to less than half. $9 worth of springs and 15 minutes and the result is a totally new gun.

User changeable backstraps are a great idea. I love my Magpul pistol grip for exactly that reason but since I have large hands, the existing USP line works will for me. In fact I put on a palm swell grip to fill in that area.

By in large, it's good to see HK moving forward. Hopefully they make an adjustment to their price points.


Bomber

I was hoping to find some actual info about the HK 45 in this post. 2 of the 3 pages were dedicated to the effing photo...wow

I don't know either one, but judging only from this thread, both Va_Dinger and CityClicker are...  nevermind.  

HK45 huh?

Quoted: I don't know either one, but judging only from this thread, both Va_Dinger and CityClicker are...  nevermind.   HK45 huh?

Maybe you should research Cityslicker's past trolling of HK products before you pass judgement. You might have a different opinion about my reaction to him starting this thread & some of his comments in it.

This is a photo of the new P3000 from the HK booth at the Milipol 2005 Internal State Security Exhibition held in Paris, France.

I got the photo from a German website that I could not understand.



I wonder if the HK45 is going to closely minic any of the design points of the P3000?

Quoted: I wonder if the HK45 is going to closely minic any of the design points of the P3000?

It will! At least the accessory rail.

I like and dislike the idea of interchangeable side grips. They would be a plus for personalization, but they look easy to lose or even break. I hope I'm wrong though.

Quoted: I like and dislike the idea of interchangeable side grips. They would be a plus for personalization, but they look easy to lose or even break. I hope I'm wrong though.

Time will tell about their durability, but it is a step-up from having to choose your pistol based on hand size+shape or pay a gunsmith to swap parts (1911).

Quoted: I like and dislike the idea of interchangeable side grips. They would be a plus for personalization, but they look easy to lose or even break. I hope I'm wrong though.

If they are as durable as the average handgun plastic grips, I don't foresee them being a problem.


I'm looking forward to buying an HK45.

I'll hold out for one done up in 'Tactical' mode.  They gotta do it.

.

WOW the 3000 looks great.

I know it's most likely the angle from which the photo was taken, but the grip angle on the P3000 just looks wrong to me. Too straight and too tall. I'm a fan of a HK pistols and can wait to see what details SHOT reveals

Quoted: I know it's most likely the angle from which the photo was taken, but the grip angle on the P3000 just looks wrong to me. Too straight and too tall. I'm a fan of a HK pistols and can wait to see what details SHOT reveals

It's the same angle at the P2000.

.


Bigfeet

ETA:  Removed any talk that might drag out the argument after reading the full thread  HK wants to make a new gun, I say bring it on!  Change is like kryptonite to some people here.