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Posted: 4/17/2020 10:07:16 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I received the same letter about a week or so ago. Looking forward to the follow up letter  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The link has been broken for a few weeks. Your best bet is to email them via [email protected] Be sure to include your name, address, phone number, email address, and amount you're willing to pay. I put $10, though they will not charge you anything. Example: Dear FOIA Officer, I request that you provide me with all information found in the Army File of the Department Of Defense (DOD) Small Arms/Light Weapons Registry for M17 pistol (NSN: 1005-01-661-7317), serial number TF00XXXX. I am willing to pay up to $10 for the processing of this request. Please inform me if the estimated fees will exceed this limit before processing my request. I am seeking information for personal use and not for commercial use. Thank you for your consideration, John Doe 123 Main Street Beverly Hills, CA 90210 Phone: (213) 867-5309 Email: [email protected] UPDATE 02APR2020: Received the following from Ft. Belvoir: This letter is in response to your Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request dated 2 March 2020. You are seeking information from the Army File of the Department Of Defense (DOD) Small Arms/Light Weapons Registry for a M17 pistol (NSN: 1005-01-661-7317), serial number TF0000XX. Your request is being processed in accordance with Title 5 United States Code 552, The Freedom of Information Act. Your request was assigned case numbers FA-20-XXXX/ FP-20-XXXXXX. Please be advised this office serves as the referral point and policy office for the Department of the Army Freedom of Information Act. Requests for information and documents under the purview of the Army are referred to the proponent agency for appropriate handling and the proponent of the requested records in accordance with Army Regulation 25-55, The Army Freedom of Information Act Program. After conducting research, we are referring your request to the following activity for processing and direct response to you. Office of the Assistant Secretary Of the Army, Acquisition, Logistics, And Technology ATTN: ASA(ALT) SACO 103 Army Pentagon Room 2E533 Washington DC 20310 Email: [email protected] You may check the status of your Freedom of Information Act request by going to https://www.foia.army.mil/facts/casestatus.aspx and entering FP-20-XXXXXX in the Control Number box. Please note that once your request is received at the next agency(s) listed above it will be assigned a new Control Number that you will have to use to track the status of your request. If you have any questions regarding the processing of your request, please contact that activity. I received the same letter about a week or so ago. Looking forward to the follow up letter I just received the same email response, as you two did. I'm however unable to check the status of my FOIA due to getting an "access denied." Additionally, did you both email that referenced email as well? The way I read my response is: they acknowledged (& are processing) my request and bumped it down the line to the appropriate people, that they will update my case numbers when there is an update within that new agency. |
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Posted: 4/17/2020 1:41:07 PM EDT
[#2]
Anyone know the holster designation for a M17 with PAiL and DPP? The light option drop downs don’t include the PAiL on Safariland. Thanks in advance.
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Posted: 4/17/2020 4:49:46 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Anyone know the holster designation for a M17 with PAiL and DPP? The light option drop downs don’t include the PAiL on Safariland. Thanks in advance. I don't think it exists yet. The Pail holster I've seen online was a 7TS variant without an RDS variant. http://soldiersystems.net/2019/02/07/sneak-peek-new-holster-for-modular-handgun-system-with-pistol-aiming-light/ Since there's no big Army/DoD issue pistol optic I don't see there being a Pail compatible RDS holster being made yet. I think we'll see the M17/18 XVL2/RDS combo before the PAIL/RDS combo. |
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Posted: 4/17/2020 9:11:42 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We are using a unique custom designed 8 degree reflector which gives you 5000 candella the same candella a 300 lumen light gives you which is what it was tested against. Lumens is just a number candella is how far it will throw that light in lgrunt terms. The spec for this product from the Army was that a soldier had to be able to tell what someone had in their hands in a pitch black enviroment at 25M that was the test for both white light and IR Illuminator It was tested in the tunnel at the Army night vision lab at Ft.Belvoir VA 
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Posted: 4/19/2020 8:37:51 PM EDT
[#5]
Does anyone know if the TF serial numbers of the surplus pistols sold to civilians stay consecutive or if they will (or already have) restarted The serial numbers?
For example if you have a surplus civilian sold TF001000 (I do not just as example) will that always been the 1000th M17? Or will the army start serial numbers from “1” again on the updated series? Thank you |
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Posted: 4/19/2020 9:48:15 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does anyone know if the TF serial numbers of the surplus pistols sold to civilians stay consecutive or if they will (or already have) restarted The serial numbers? Consecutive |
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Posted: 4/19/2020 10:22:40 PM EDT
[#7]
Wow surprising answer thanks for reply. I figured they’d restart at s/n “1” with the new series
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Posted: 4/19/2020 11:01:42 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wow surprising answer thanks for reply. I figured they'd restart at s/n "1" with the new series |
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Posted: 4/19/2020 11:31:54 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IIRC, they're up over either 100k or 150k delivered to the military. Oh wow. Cool to know then that the ones sold back to civilians will forever be the first few thousand M17s if they aren’t ever going to restart the serial numbers. Now if I can just find one for sale in that $1200 range |
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Posted: 4/20/2020 8:49:18 AM EDT
[#10]
NSN for Safariland holsters
PAiLl R/H Tan model number ZA9568 NSN:1095-01-679-5575 PAiL L/H Tan model number ZA 9568 NSN: 1095-01-679-5586 Pail R/H Black model number ZA 9568 NSN:1095-01-679-5589 PAiL L/H Black model number ZA 9568 NSN: 1095-01-679-5595 You may need to contact Safariland to get these Holsters for Safariland with PAil the first number is the Part number starts with ZA second NSN |
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Posted: 4/20/2020 8:07:44 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I just received the same email response, as you two did. I'm however unable to check the status of my FOIA due to getting an "access denied." Additionally, did you both email that referenced email as well? The way I read my response is: they acknowledged (& are processing) my request and bumped it down the line to the appropriate people, that they will update my case numbers when there is an update within that new agency. For all those waiting on FOIA, I have received two emails. One was from FT Belvoir on 12FEB telling me that my FOIA request was forwarded to Redstone Arsenal, and the next email came on 8APR from Redstone telling me that they are overwhelmed with M17 request and that it would be sometime before I received anything definitive on my request. Being a .mil/.gov guy who deals with Redstone regularly myself, I know anyone who’s able to telework there is doing so. Being at home, drinking all day with a laptop is no where near as efficient as sitting in your office with 2 screens in front of you, so I’m not expecting anything anytime soon 
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Posted: 4/26/2020 9:12:49 AM EDT
[#12]
Sorry, don't want to read all 37 pages so can someone tell me if the M17 surpluses have all been released or are more coming?
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Posted: 4/26/2020 9:50:23 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sorry, don't want to read all 37 pages so can someone tell me if the M17 surpluses have all been released or are more coming? I believe all of them are now in the wild. |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 10:16:46 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sorry, don't want to read all 37 pages so can someone tell me if the M17 surpluses have all been released or are more coming? Yeah as tothemax noted, they are all out in the open. As in, ads like GB or personally being sold. You won't find them off any online retailer, also likely not in any local gun store, what so ever. Being apart of the bum rush to find one when they were just flooding the market was a cool thing to be apart of. |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 11:32:46 AM EDT
[#15]
Thanks for the info. That's what I assumed. I half ass tried to get in on the initial release but these things were selling way to fast.
So what was the average price on release? Debating whether I want one enough to pay the "you missed out sucker" price? |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 11:42:38 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks for the info. That's what I assumed. I half ass tried to get in on the initial release but these things were selling way to fast. So what was the average price on release? Debating whether I want one enough to pay the "you missed out sucker" price? I think MSRP was 799? People were paying less or more. Depending on source. |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 11:58:36 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think MSRP was 799? People were paying less or more. Depending on source. Yup. I paid $620 for my first and $1500 for the second. I had to pay the Gun Broker premium to get sequential serial numbers. |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 12:03:05 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think MSRP was 799? People were paying less or more. Depending on source. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Thanks for the info. That's what I assumed. I half ass tried to get in on the initial release but these things were selling way to fast. So what was the average price on release? Debating whether I want one enough to pay the "you missed out sucker" price? I think MSRP was 799? People were paying less or more. Depending on source. Prices were the luck of the draw really, some dealers didn’t know what they had and sold at $700 others knew and sold at $1200. Sportsman’s warehouse sold a ton for $700. There was a dealer that listed 20 on GB for $700 and sold out so fast they cancelled the auctions and said it was an accident listing them so cheap then resisted higher later. You aren’t going to find one for less than $1100-1200 now unless you find a private seller needing fund ASAP. Lower serials command a higher price. If you want one, I would set aside $1300 and search around. If $1300 is to rich, I would say you missed the boat. |
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Posted: 4/26/2020 12:24:33 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you want one, I would set aside $1300 and search around. If $1300 is to rich, I would say you missed the boat. Fair enough. Thanks again |
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Posted: 4/28/2020 4:30:22 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Prices were the luck of the draw really, some dealers didn’t know what they had and sold at $700 others knew and sold at $1200. Sportsman’s warehouse sold a ton for $700. There was a dealer that listed 20 on GB for $700 and sold out so fast they cancelled the auctions and said it was an accident listing them so cheap then resisted higher later. You aren’t going to find one for less than $1100-1200 now unless you find a private seller needing fund ASAP. Lower serials command a higher price. If you want one, I would set aside $1300 and search around. If $1300 is to rich, I would say you missed the boat. I'd say that as of right now, if you can find one for $1300 you should feel lucky. The way these are trending, they are gonna keep climbing upward. Today's "you missed out sucker" price is tomorrow's deal. |
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Posted: 4/28/2020 10:45:02 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'd say that as of right now, if you can find one for $1300 you should feel lucky. The way these are trending, they are gonna keep climbing upward. Today's "you missed out sucker" price is tomorrow's deal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Prices were the luck of the draw really, some dealers didn’t know what they had and sold at $700 others knew and sold at $1200. Sportsman’s warehouse sold a ton for $700. There was a dealer that listed 20 on GB for $700 and sold out so fast they cancelled the auctions and said it was an accident listing them so cheap then resisted higher later. You aren’t going to find one for less than $1100-1200 now unless you find a private seller needing fund ASAP. Lower serials command a higher price. If you want one, I would set aside $1300 and search around. If $1300 is to rich, I would say you missed the boat. I'd say that as of right now, if you can find one for $1300 you should feel lucky. The way these are trending, they are gonna keep climbing upward. Today's "you missed out sucker" price is tomorrow's deal. They are a rare collectible, an actual Military issued firearm and some of the first pistols sent to the Army for testing and use. That’s a good trifecta to have to see price rise continually for years. I wouldnt be surprised in the least to see these pistols reach $3000-$5000 within the next 10 years. |
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Posted: 4/28/2020 12:48:37 PM EDT
[#22]
Any chance the early issue M18’s will be surplus’d as well? Were any issued with the FDE controls?
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Posted: 4/28/2020 1:59:45 PM EDT
[#23]
Pew
 
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Posted: 4/28/2020 8:26:48 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryVery cool, but I’m surprised how light the color is on this set up (would still buy  )
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Posted: 4/28/2020 9:45:43 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Any chance the early issue M18's will be surplus'd as well? Were any issued with the FDE controls? The details were ironed out on the M17 contract with these pistols and the M18's came later. I believe it was only in the last several months that the Marines started taking delivery of them while the Army has been fielding the 17's since late 2017. |
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Posted: 4/28/2020 10:09:08 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Any chance the early issue M18’s will be surplus’d as well? Were any issued with the FDE controls? My heart says "shut up take my money" but my brain says "nah I would hope they learned from their OG mistake lol"" |
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Posted: 4/29/2020 8:57:04 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My heart says "shut up take my money" but my brain says "nah I would hope they learned from their OG mistake lol"" Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Any chance the early issue M18's will be surplus'd as well? Were any issued with the FDE controls? My heart says "shut up take my money" but my brain says "nah I would hope they learned from their OG mistake lol"" |
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Posted: 4/29/2020 9:34:12 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Our resident Sig person on here said an M18 Commemorative is in the works though. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any chance the early issue M18's will be surplus'd as well? Were any issued with the FDE controls? My heart says "shut up take my money" but my brain says "nah I would hope they learned from their OG mistake lol""
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Posted: 4/29/2020 4:13:03 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. Any time-frame estimates? |
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Posted: 4/29/2020 6:17:28 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Got a question. I understand the issued M17/M17 Commemorative/320 M17 differences. What exactly would the M18 Commemorative be able to do to differentiate itself from the 320 M18? Essentially slide and barrel markings? Understandable if that's not something you can comment on. |
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Posted: 5/12/2020 1:08:47 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryHow much? |
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Posted: 5/16/2020 7:17:35 PM EDT
[#32]
Anyone have a lead on where I can get a anti-tamper disassembly lever?
 Attached File |
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Posted: 5/17/2020 5:02:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Is the M17 essentially a Full sized slide and carry sized frame?
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Posted: 5/17/2020 5:25:18 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dana1972: Is the M17 essentially a Full sized slide and carry sized frame? The size configuration yes, fullsize slide with carry grip module. It also has other features like the safety and optics cut. |
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Posted: 5/17/2020 5:42:53 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TCBA_Joe: The size configuration yes, fullsize slide with carry grip module. It also has other features like the safety and optics cut. Thanks Joe. Thinking about picking up the Bravo model. I have so much FDE already but digging the look of this. |
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Posted: 5/17/2020 5:57:53 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dana1972: Thanks Joe. Thinking about picking up the Bravo model. I have so much FDE already but digging the look of this. The Bravo does look nice. Tbh, I have 2 M17s and I wish one was a Bravo model. |
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Posted: 5/18/2020 12:04:34 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dana1972: Thanks Joe. Thinking about picking up the Bravo model. I have so much FDE already but digging the look of this. Yeahhhh but it’s not a true M17, lol. |
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Posted: 5/19/2020 2:02:15 PM EDT
[#38]
anyone looking for a consecutive set? pm me two sets of numbers to choose from
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Posted: 5/22/2020 5:34:34 PM EDT
[#39]
I thought I would share my Frankenstein M17 Commemorative pistol. It was a Sig factory rep demo gun. Somehow during it's time with him, the M17 slide got swapped out with a P320 M17 slide and barrel. (there is probably a P320 M17 ex-demo pistol out there somewhere with an M17 slide) It ended up at my local Sig LE dealer. I got it for $435 (it only had the one 17 rd. mag, I added the two 21 round mags). It has the original box and some of the papers/extras. I could not pass it up at that price, far cheaper than a new P320 M17. It is in excellent condition overall. Here are a couple of pictures.
 Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 10:54:41 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought I would share my Frankenstein M17 Commemorative pistol. It was a Sig factory rep demo gun. Somehow during it's time with him, the M17 slide got swapped out with a P320 M17 slide and barrel. (there is probably a P320 M17 ex-demo pistol out there somewhere with an M17 slide) It ended up at my local Sig LE dealer. I got it for $435 (it only had the one 17 rd. mag, I added the two 21 round mags). It has the original box and some of the papers/extras. I could not pass it up at that price, far cheaper than a new P320 M17. It is in excellent condition overall. Here are a couple of pictures. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/312/DSCF2841_JPG-1428058.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/312/DSCF2842_JPG-1428059.JPG I doubt it was ever a demo gun - probably a parts gun cobbled together by LE division (or someone else) and sold fo the dealer. Great price, no matter. Good snag. |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 12:39:52 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I doubt it was ever a demo gun - probably a parts gun cobbled together by LE division (or someone else) and sold fo the dealer. Great price, no matter. Good snag. Not disagreeing with you, I can only go by what the dealer told me, they are a Sig LE dealer. It is a correct M17 commemorative serial number and the box has the commemorative labels on the end of the box. I am happy with it, as it gives me an M17 surplus configured shooter for a fraction of the current price. 
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Posted: 6/2/2020 9:48:03 PM EDT
[#42]
I thought these were finished so I was SHOCKED to see one hit the gun store today. Not a trade in, straight from a distributor. Picked it up quick.
Are there more still coming? Anyone in the know? |
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Posted: 6/2/2020 10:50:43 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I thought these were finished so I was SHOCKED to see one hit the gun store today. Not a trade in, straight from a distributor. Picked it up quick. Are there more still coming? Anyone in the know? I think they are all out in the open... |
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Posted: 6/16/2020 8:08:41 AM EDT
[#44]
4+ months after submitting my FOIA request, I heard back. One of mine doesn’t have much of a record. Just date going to the army and then back to Sig. second went to the 101st which is kind of cool.
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Posted: 6/16/2020 10:25:07 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 4+ months after submitting my FOIA request, I heard back. One of mine doesn’t have much of a record. Just date going to the army and then back to Sig. second went to the 101st which is kind of cool. I would wager the one without any transfer history other than Anniston looks NIB? |
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Posted: 6/16/2020 11:35:25 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would wager the one without any transfer history other than Anniston looks NIB? Yes sir. You’d be correct. Looks pretty much NIB. |
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Posted: 6/18/2020 3:14:57 PM EDT
[#47]
I've seen only a few of these that have a number sticker/label with what appears to be some kind of coating over top of it. Anyone know what it means?
When I previewed my post, the images appears, when I posted the reply.. only the link shows... 
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Posted: 6/18/2020 3:26:17 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've seen only a few of these that have a number sticker/label with what appears to be some kind of coating over top of it. Anyone know what it means? When I previewed my post, the images appears, when I posted the reply.. only the link shows... https://i.imgur.com/RzTFXbX.jpg That’s the pistol number in the set that unit received. 12, 13, 14, etc. Probably has super glue over the top of it to keep it from coming off. |
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Posted: 6/18/2020 5:35:48 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s the pistol number in the set that unit received. 12, 13, 14, etc. Probably has super glue over the top of it to keep it from coming off. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've seen only a few of these that have a number sticker/label with what appears to be some kind of coating over top of it. Anyone know what it means? When I previewed my post, the images appears, when I posted the reply.. only the link shows... https://i.imgur.com/RzTFXbX.jpg That’s the pistol number in the set that unit received. 12, 13, 14, etc. Probably has super glue over the top of it to keep it from coming off. +1 I’ve seen this shirt of thing firsthand. It just keeps the arms room guy from having to print up new labels every 2 days . This is why most just use a sharpie or paint pen...
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Posted: 6/18/2020 5:44:03 PM EDT
[#50]
Finally received my FOIA letter in the same 4ish month timeframe mentioned above. My pistol has very little history, which is evidenced by it’s like new condition. Came to the Army on 6NOV2017 and went back to Sig on 24APR2019. Other than that it sat at Anniston, AL. My pistol has little wear with only slight handling marks to speak of. The 21 round mag is brand new, presumably as new as the pistol (?), but the other mags are used and have armorers/unit markings on them (can’t remember what at this time, as it’s buried in the safe at this point).
No overseas service is fine with me, as it was the luck of the draw with these early release guns. If it were is used condition i would shoot and enjoy it as any other pistol, but i suppose I’ll just let it stay tucked away for a while and pick up a commercial version for fun... |
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