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Posted: 3/27/2002 4:59:55 PM EDT
Hi Folks,

I'm having some trouble with Ciener 22lr conversion kit I recently purchased used for my Glock 19. I get a lot of light strikes
from the firing pin. After the first trip to the range, I stripped it down and cleaned it very well, thinking that was the problem. But the problems got worse, if anything. It only fires about 30% of the rounds on the first strike. Most need 2-3 hits from the striker. This is constant across 4 brands of common 22lr ammo (40 grain LRN & JHP).

It is supposed to have a new set of springs from Ciener in it, but the problems persist after the recommended 500 round break-in period for the springs. The springs were replaced by Ciener because the previous owner had the same problem with light strikes. Ciener chalked her problems up to having a 8lb trigger because it was her duty weapon. I have factory 5.5lb trigger.

Does anybody have any suggestions about how to fix the problem?

Thanks in advance!
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 5:15:42 PM EDT
If all else fails, I would send it back and have them try it themselves. I think they had a lot of false starts on the Glock kits before they were released for sale. Do you get a good "snap" when the trigger is pulled? I wonder if the firing pin is too short? If you were around Cleveland/Lorain, I could try it on my 19 and take a look see.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 5:50:25 PM EDT
Hi Anothergene,
The kit has already been sent back to Ciener by the original buyer, and they claim it works
"perfectly" with high velocity 40 grain stuff like I've been using. My best guess right now is that there are subtle differences between the old & new (rail mount) frames. I have a new one, and I imagine that the kit was developed using the old style.
The firing pin "looks" long enough, if I push it forward by hand. It projects well past the breech face, much farther than the depth of the light impacts I'm seeing. It may be that the case isn't seating well. I'll keep playing with it. I was hoping that maybe this was a common problem that someone knew a quick fix for.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 6:06:28 PM EDT
Mines a 2nd generation frame. What was the original owners? If you were up this way, you could try it on mine. Or submit it to the gunsmith forum to make Kurt the gunsmith aware of it. Good luck on that!
Link Posted: 3/29/2002 9:49:24 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/29/2002 10:00:30 AM EDT
Hi Guys,

Thanks a lot for the info. Kurt, I'll go to work on the firing pin tonight and try it out at the range tomorrow. Anothergene, I'm down in Kent, so I may take you up on the offer sometime if I still have problems.
Link Posted: 3/29/2002 5:12:31 PM EDT
Thanks for the help Kurt !
Link Posted: 3/30/2002 8:16:18 AM EDT
Hi Kurt,

Oh well, I tried my newly "sharpened" (I cut the striking surface at least in half) firing pin at the range today with no luck. I still get 6-7 light strikes out of every 10 round mag. I think my next move is to find a way to polish the channel in which the firing pin lies. I already tried polishing the firing pin with a Dremel and jewelers' rouge, but it is still very rough ("grainy") sliding into place. If I can figure out a way to do the same thing to the channel, I'll go for it.
Link Posted: 4/1/2002 1:38:13 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/3/2002 6:45:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fizassist:Hi Kurt,

Oh well, I tried my newly "sharpened" (I cut the striking surface at least in half) firing pin at the range today with no luck. I still get 6-7 light strikes out of every 10 round mag. I think my next move is to find a way to polish the channel in which the firing pin lies. I already tried polishing the firing pin with a Dremel and jewelers' rouge, but it is still very rough ("grainy") sliding into place. If I can figure out a way to do the same thing to the channel, I'll go for it.



Jeweler's rouge probably won't help much if there are rough machining marks inside the channel. You may have to go down to 240 grit sandpaper, then up to 320, then 400, then 600. Lose the jeweler's rouge -- it's intended to polish brass and soft metals and will only make steel red. Get some stainless steel polish and it will give much better results.

It sounds like the striker spring is too weak.
Link Posted: 4/3/2002 6:57:30 AM EDT
Kurt,

No, the firing pin isn't held in place with a pin. It is held in much like the real Glock, with the spring guide fitting in a cup at the very rear of the slide. It will advance far enough if I push it manually.

Ken,

I will try to find something rougher to polish up the slide. You were right; the jewelers' rouge only worked on the firing pin, not the slide.

My newest target is the firing pin spring. I think it's actually too heavy. The gun is really sloppy when coming into battery. I think the firing pin spring overpowers the recoil spring, pulling the slide slightly out of battery and resulting in poor contact between the cartridge and the slide. I'm leaving the firing pin spring fully compressed for an extended time to see if that solves the problem.

Thanks!
Link Posted: 4/4/2002 6:32:47 AM EDT
That was the best clue yet, out of battery due to a too strong firing pin spring...hmmm. On a Ruger MKII you can hold the bolt in place with two thumbs while firing, I wonder if you can try that on your conversion...holding the slide in battery as you are firing it, just to see if that in fact is the problem. (not to be done with any other caliber). I remember using, just to try out, a ball point pen spring on a High Standards firing pin. It worked but you couldn't rapid fire it because it rebounded a bit slower. Maybe look for a less powerful spring to test out, if you cant get the Ciener spring to fatigue?
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 7:45:18 PM EDT
Hi Guys,

Sorry I haven't given an update. I've been going slightly nuts trying to get ready for a presentation next weekend.

I've had the firing pin spring compressed for several days, and it looks like that did the trick! I haven't had a chance to get to the range, but the slide locks up much better now and the firing pin consistently leaves solid strikes on empty cases. I should have the right balance between the recoil & firing pin springs now, and I think that reducing the striking surface of the firing pin gives you a lot more margin of error when trying to get the spring tensions right. Thanks a lot for all the suggestions!

P.S.

For all those considering the Ciener kit, I have to admit that I'm not very happy with it in general even though it seems to be working now. I think it has a very limited life; steel just tears the hell out of aluminum. My factory slide lock has already carved out a millimeter or so of the aluminum slide, just from (manually) locking the slide back. Also, the aluminum recoil spring guide is getting really chewed up by the locking lug on the barrel.
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