There used to be a thread where people shared actual encounters or uses of CCW's...What happened to that thread(s)?

This one?

Derp.

Yea it used to be stacked, I guess I missed it.

Every time I've checked.

Every time.

For a couple years now.

There was an older one though, one from years back.

Anyone have the link to the story about the fella on a date with his woman, had the kidnappers in the panel van try to jump him. I think he had a 1911 Officer model in a daytimer carry. Anyone know what I'm talking about?

Something like that. It was a good story. Another fella with a 1911 IIRC.

That story was from Glocktalk and was copied to ARF. I, however copied it to my PC for later reference

Note below, 

A guy and his lady friend are walking down a street aftereating a nice steak dinner on Friday night. The area is busy and the only
parking available was a nice walk away, not a problem on a beautiful October
night.
 
So the guy, who has had a lot of firearms courses, notices avan slowly driving the other direction on the street. The guy notices the deep
gurgling sound of the exhaust, but really doesn't think much of it. Then he
notices a couple of thugs crossing the street; said guy is uncomfortable
because he and his lady friend seemed to get too much attention from the guys
crossing the street. One of those "it just doesn't feel right" type
of things.
 
So the couple continue walking toward the parking garage,when the guy notices the gurgling sound of that van slowly passing by them.
Then the guy, who regularly uses windows to watch his 6, notices the two thugs
that crossed the street coming up behind them. One of the thugs is clearly
holding his right hand suspiciously around his belt buckle area. Then said guy
notices the van stopped on the side of the street just ahead and the 2 thugs
behind them are getting closer.
 
Guy tells his lady friend that they are going to duck intoany open business they see, but there were not any available. Just as they were
coming up on the van, 2 ****-eaters jump out of the van and block the sidewalk.
Guy draws his Kimber .45, and moves to engage the thugs 5 feet behind them; the
intention was to go to low ready and size up the situation. The two from the
van did not appear to be armed and one behind them was already spotted as
armed.
 
So guy turns and starts to shout at the two thugs on footwhen the armed one begins to pull a revolver (S&W .38 special). Guy had the
jump because the thugs in the rear did not see him remove his pistol from his
daytimer style carry.
 
The guy always, always, always shoots failure drill (twoshots to center of mass followed immediately by one shot to the head) at the
range and trains at least twice a month.
 
As the BG (Bad Guy) #1 pulls the pistol, the guy puts tworounds COM (Center Of Mass) and moves up and puts one in the eye area. There
was absolutely no reaction to the chest shots in the BG. The second thug turns
to his falling comrade and tries to get his pistol, as guy puts 2 slugs in his
COM and one in the side of the head, guy didn't know he hit BG #2 with the
first 2 rounds. The second thug didn't have time to get turned around to face
guy, and didn't go down from the two to the chest, so the guy puts one is the
side of his head. Both third shots, at 5 feet, were very messy. Luckily for the
guy, the second thug did get his hands on the pistol (a fact that would greatly
help him in the future). So after the two in the rear were neutralized, guy turned
to check on the two from the van who had started moving his way. When guy
turned to engage them, gun at low ready, they turned and ran to the van got in
and the van sped off.
 
The thugs were linked to other rapes and 2 abductions ofsimilar method, and had sheets as long as your arm. (funny how that wasn't
admissable in court) The thugs from the van looked more pissed than scared, and
guy would encounter them later in life. Turns out they were members of the
Gangsta Disciples. The Gangsta's don't take lightly to seeing their bros being
shot down in the street.
 
The aftermath: Said guy was charged with manslaughter (thejury was given other options too) and was found not guilty by a jury of his
peers. Deliberations took less than 3 hours. Some of the city council PERSONS
believed that failure drill represented too much force and guy should have not
made the last shot on the BGs. Of course, if he had not made the third shots in
the failure drill, the thugs would be alive today. So city council PERSON, pressures
the DA and viola, the decision is made to charge him.
 
The cost to the guy to stay out of prison was $18,000+. Thatworks out to be $3k per shot, or $9k per BG.
 
The situation doesn't often end as well in his dreams, as itdid in real time, but he never can quite get it behind him. He carries a
strange sense of guilt.
 
The girlfriend that guy was trying to protect, broke up withhim 3 weeks later. She just never could get over it and could not understand
the violent nature of his counterattack. She dumped him, which broke his heart,
but she was a very good witness for his defense, and for that he is eternally
grateful.
The follow up encounters (turns out during a trial, it isn'thard to get the home address of the defendant) with the Gangsta Disciples were
a little better; and no charges were placed in those instances.
 
The morals of the story: Live with what happened, or withwhat may have happened- his girlfriend being abducted..... It is better to be
tried by 12 than carried by 6. When the SHTF, you fall back on your training in
automatic mode. So train well and often.
 
By the way: Best $18,000 I ever spent.
 
Yes it did happen. October 1998. The whole thing exhausted alot of my savings, and some credit card debt that has since been paid for. The
PD (Police Department) Commander on the scene allowed me to go home that night
and to come in the following week with a lawyer to make a statement. Everything
was clear and obvious to them that night, some officers even commended me.
 
My initial intentions were to confront them while in the lowready, and hopefully shout them off. As I turned around, the BG had his hand on
his gun and was pulling it. I am sure that if he had seen my gun sooner, he
would have it pointed at me. And there is the possibility that he drew because
he saw mine, but had he stuck his hands up or ran off, I would not have shot.
That and their priors convinced the PD that I had acted properly. There were 3
witnesses approaching from behind the van ****-eaters that saw what the van
did, and the whole thing. They told the police that night, I had to do it. When
they blocked us in, I had no choice but to act.
 
I was handcuffed and locked in a patrol car for a while,where I puked up that fine steak I had just eaten. Odd feeling when it is over.

 
The DA prosecuted under political pressure. I did not spendany time in jail, because it was only after the political pressure did the DA
decide to prosecute. I surrendered and had bail arranged before we went in. The
PD were really nice to me, and they even indicated they thought I was getting a
****ty deal. The Assistant DA that handled the case did not seem to be too
interested in getting a conviction. The investigating officers were better
witnesses for me than the state. She (assistant DA) allowed my lawyer to seat
my dream jury (some code words there) and she let him get some stuff out. At
one time my attorney indicated that she wasn't pushing it because of the way
she conducted herself.
 
Girlfriend: Leslie was a nurse and one of those "Icould never hurt anyone" types; I am a nurse and we heal...blah blah blah.
Another long story. She did not know I was armed that night, or most nights we
were together. I found out early that she didn't warm up to guns, so I didn't
push it. No huge loss, the timing is what hurt. With all else going on, the
last thing I needed was her breaking up. It was not until the trial that I
really knew what she would do on the stand. What she did on the stand was
enough to settle it for me. I hold no grudges against her, never did. But I
won't date another nurse.
 
As far as the terminal ballistics of the .45. In classes myfailure drill from concealed holster generally run in the 1.5 to 2 second area.
I doubt any handgun caliber will create adequate results in less than two
seconds. I just opened up like I had trained to do. I was going with the 3rd
shot, unless the guy was on the ground out of it. When I say there was no
reaction to the first two rounds, I meant his head was still where I expected
it to be. I never have planned to stop and fully asses the vital signs of an
attacker. My plan has always been to do the failure drill if the pumpkin was
there and it was. It all happens so fast, you wouldn't believe it.
 
Since I was innocent, I can still carry.
 
As for the follow up visits from the Gangstas, I prefer notto get into that right now. Very long ugly stories. On 2 possibly 3 (the 3rd I
spotted them and called the police and kept riding around the parking lot, the
police came and ran them off so I don't know what their intentions were or if
they were there to visit me) different occasions there were young gentlemen
waiting for me when I got off work, once was an attempt to kick in my front
door while I was home. I highly recommend the Remington 870.
 
I moved after the initial incident, and the phone companymessed up and my 'unlisted' number got listed. So I moved again. A Lt. with the
gang squad said that after a while, the membership would turn over to the point
they would forget about me. That officer was at my trial and alerted me to
potential retribution. There were Gangstas at my trial. Relatives of the
deceased I guess. I currently live in another city with an unlisted number. It
has been 4 years, so I hope the follow up visits will cease. Everyday when I
step out to get in my vehicle, I stop and scan the parking lot real good. My
experiences have served to give me an edge and to keep me on my toes, and to
keep me awake at night. Better than the alternative.
 
If I may offer one piece of advice to anyone who willlisten:
 
If you are ever involved in a shooting, resist all urges tolook at the guy after he is down. Move out of the area, and don't ever look at
them. You want to remember them as a threat, not as a corpse.
 
Just don't say a word after it happens. Tell the officersyou will cooperate, but you are in no condition to make a statement. Every word
you say will cost you money.
 
If you are in the right, and it was a good shoot, you won'thave much of an attorney fee. Just for one to meet with you and go in to make a
statement. Your range will probably know a good lawyer for this purpose.
 
I would be willing to bet most pro gun lawyers will allowyou to pay as you can.
 
My problems came from politics. Basically, a democratcouncil woman did not like the idea of me engaging her constituents. Other than
that, the PD would not have recommended charges. I thought I was free and clear
until an investigator called me and told me what was going on. He suggested I
retain a lawyer and to give him, the officer, the lawyers name so we could
arrange a time for me to come in and surrender myself. That made it a lot
smoother.
 
Cooperate with the PD as much as possible. If it is obviousyour shooting was just, they won't push you for any answers. In fact, they may
even suggest that you not say anything without a lawyer present.
 
The officers on the beat see what happens to victims and areusually glad when the intended victim gets the upper hand.
 
White man defends against young black males. Black femalecouncil member with a mouth like Cynthia McKinney. White District attorney, in
the south in a city with a predominately black population. Draw your own
conclusions.
 
If I may add:
 
A black officer handcuffed me, apologized for having to doit but it was procedure and he would face disciplinary action if he didn't.
 
The same black officer uncuffed me, told me it appeared tobe a justified shoot and acknowledged I did what needed to be done, suggested I
get an attorney and reminded me of my right to remain silent. Told me not to
worry about the puke in the car, was very considerate and kind.
 
Both black and white detectives for follow up meetings, andto take my statement; all had same mindset with regard to it being a justified
shoot. It was the black detective that called and told me they would not
recommend charges.
 
A black Lt on gang unit gave me feedback and 'intel' aboutwhat to expect from the gang in the future and how to handle it. He also gave
me his card, cell phone number and pager number if I ever needed his help. So
the problem for me was a politician.
 
In any situation, the DA is the ultimate decision maker todecide if charges are placed. Usually the DA is or was a politician and they
cannot discount a return to politics at some time in the future. When the DA
gets a lot of nasty attacks, it will influence his opinion. I don't know what
made him decide to go through with it, but for some reason he did. Politics
being the way they are, never doubt anything. Do what you have to do, make sure
you are in the right, and be ready to support it. Luckily it is the jury that
has the last say. In Membabwe (Memphis), you have to consider who will be on
your jury. (hint hint.)
 
I got the gun back after about a month. I had others so Iwas able to carry.
 
Good question about the reload, that is a situation that hasbugged me since.
 
The daytimer carry has a stretchable strap for an extra mag.I usually put one in the strap and have another stacked beside it, floating
free. When it is zipped, the mag stays secure. It was a dreadful situation
after I fired 6 of 9. The daytimer was on the ground, not completely unzipped
and it would have been a struggle to quickly reload. I often wonder if I would
have had the presence of mind to ration the next 3 rounds, glad I didn't have
to do it. Technically, the floating magazine could have fallen on the ground
around my feet if I had totally unzipped the daytimer, but the I didn't take
the time to do that. I have adjusted my carry method since. I still carry the
1911, with the 2 extra mags, I keep a mag in my left trouser pocket, and have a
Glock 19 or a Walther P99 on my ankle, usually the P99. I used a handy stitch
to create a pouch in my pocket that holds the mag vertical and high so I can
get it quickly. In the slacks I wear, it works pretty well.
 
The daytimer carry does have that drawback, but we went to arestaurant where alcohol was sold (this point was never pursued by the DA) and
without the daytimer, I would not have felt as comfortable carrying in a no
carry zone. It was a trade off of smooth use vs. discrete in an area that is
illegal to carry in. I still carry the same way now, I just keep an extra mag
in my left pocket. I also dry fire with that rig.
 
In hindsight, I think a 9mm would have been as effective,considering I had to go the full 3 rounds, and I would have been able to have
the additional rounds. That is one reason I am going to be fighting for the
sunset of the magazine capacity ban. www.awbansunset.com
 
I have never gotten in the debate of .45 vs 9mm because theyare both adequate if properly used.
 
Another thing for you folks to take away from thisexperience. I always have my girlfriend on my left because of the potential for
using the pistol. The thing I never went over with Leslie was that if I draw,
she should start running to a safe place. So tell your wife, gf, significant
other, whatever, when the gun comes out, run away from the fight and run for
help/safety. Don't worry about me, RUN. That was something we never covered,
and we should have. I cover that now.
 
For what it’s worth: whenever I have a new acquaintance, wego over these things. For those that resist, I tell the story and show them my
'legal' file, and they warm up to the fact really well.
 
There is really no telling what to expect after a situation.You may go home and sleep, or you may go to jail. Get the business card of a
good lawyer from your range (if they don't have a referral lawyer, encourage
them to find one and develop a relationship with him), keep it in your wallet
next to your permit, or write the lawyers name and number on the back of your
permit. Don't discuss it with the police. Tell them you want to speak to a
lawyer, that should suffice. Every word you say will cost you money and
heartache. The less you say, the less you have to repeat. Spending the night in
jail is better than saying something that will haunt you in the future. IMO,
the vast majority of police officers will determine quickly that you acted
properly and will not press you. My problem was from politicians.
 
I would like to add some things to your preparations.Deprogram yourself from the brainwashing your parents did on you. Get the idea
"I never want to have to kill another human being" out of your head.
Those thugs aren't human. Ending a thug life is nothing like ending a human
life, don't confuse the two. "Thou Shalt not Murder" is different
from "Thou Shall not Kill". The logic of knowing that won't help
much, but any little bit helps. My parents put that idea in my head, and I
guess it is good for a teenager to hear, but when you are a law abiding adult,
you don't want that program in your head.
 
When you shoot at the range, shoot at the people targets,not just circles and dots
 
I think I would want my wife well trained, but I want her torun in any event, unless she is boxed in. Of course she won't want to run, but
it will be piece of mind for you. Who knows, seeing her take off may distract
the BG's, or she can run 10 feet and then engage them, then they have two
defenders. You may want to get an expert opinion, I am no expert, on that situation.