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Posted: 3/26/2006 4:53:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 5:37:36 PM EDT by Lxpony]
Went to the a friends gun club yesterday and we did some skeet shooting then headed over to the machine gun range to do some close-quater blasting of shit. This guy is there with a SAR1 who had just put a G2 FCG into it. He said he "thought" the disconnect spring was correct but he wasnt sure if it was the front site detent spring or not... so he puts in a 30 round clip and starts shooting it- about 10 rounds in he lets out a 4-5 round fully auto burst. Me and my buddy look over at him and he looks over at us. He says "shit- I was wondering if that spring was not the right one for the disconeect". He said it is too soft so the hammer wasnt being locked back into place by the disconnect cause it's spring was not stiff enough. Well- good thing we were at a machine gun range and no one else was around. It was unpredicatable though at when it would go full auto and it never went full auto for more then 5 rounds- but wow was it wild. He said we was gonna take it home and put the correct spring back into the FCG.

Has anyone else ever done this accidently or otherwise
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 4:56:45 PM EDT
Um... No. And I'd never admit to it on a public internet forum if I did.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:02:27 PM EDT
Better watch out because the BATF will now rule the incorrect disconnector spring as a machine gun, just like they did with the shoe string!
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:07:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gunz4me:
Better watch out because the BATF will now rule the incorrect disconnector spring as a machine gun, just like they did with the shoe string!



shoe string????
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:08:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 5:21:01 PM EDT by blackbag223]
youre welcome
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:13:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 5:20:35 PM EDT by gunz4me]

Originally Posted By Lxpony:

Originally Posted By gunz4me:
Better watch out because the BATF will now rule the incorrect disconnector spring as a machine gun, just like they did with the shoe string!



shoe string????



ATF Letter - enlarge to read!

ETA: If I ever saw someone doing that at a public or private range, I would ignore the fool and/or leave if he tried to talk to me. Sorry, but I would not want to be associated with anyone doing this.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:14:53 PM EDT
Where exactly does the 30 round "clip" go?



Couldn't resist.

Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:16:26 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:28:18 PM EDT
Not only illegal....but very unsafe...hammer is allowed to fall on the firing pin out of battery....very bad....wouldn't catch me playing that game. Can someone say 911 calling.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:31:07 PM EDT
the gun was SLAMFIRING. it WILL eventually fire out of battery. and someone WILL eventually get hurt. he had a timebomb in his hands, not a machine gun.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:34:44 PM EDT
LOL I read that ATF thing and still can't figure out how the shoestring would work.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 6:14:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BUSHMAN15:
Not only illegal....but very unsafe...hammer is allowed to fall on the firing pin out of battery....very bad....wouldn't catch me playing that game. Can someone say 911 calling.



Actually, in the AK action, a slam fire is pretty safe. But not recommended, of course.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 6:15:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chris_1522:
LOL I read that ATF thing and still can't figure out how the shoestring would work.



As the bolt flies forward the last few mm, it pulls the string which pulls the trigger...again and again until the mag's empty.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 6:28:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 6:29:42 PM EDT by jimtash9]

Originally Posted By BUSHMAN15:
Not only illegal....but very unsafe...hammer is allowed to fall on the firing pin out of battery....very bad....wouldn't catch me playing that game. Can someone say 911 calling.



Not really because the AK bolt and firing pin have a built-in safety. The firing pin doesn't protude from the back of the bolt until the bolt is turned and locked into battery so all the hammer is doing is just riding the back of the bolt. It cannot fire out of battery.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 6:56:05 PM EDT
For the record, John McGaw or however you spell it, specifically stated that malfunctioning firearms would never be prosecuted as illegally converted machineguns... The ATF has everyone so afraid of their power that you all think a broken firearm is a machinegun and therefore illegal... Enough to make you sick.


I guess the statement I read earlier this morning is true. Paraphrased, "We no longer have a Republic, we now have rulers and we fear at the mere footsteps of their approaching" or something like that. Really sad.


Now, would I believe that ATF would not try to prosecute a broken or malfunctioning firearm? I look back at two raids initiated by ATF and people died. Not on my life would I trust them.

Can we have our Republic back now?
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 8:10:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Schulze:

Actually, in the AK action, a slam fire is pretty safe. But not recommended, of course.



Can you explain why it's relatively safe?
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 8:21:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BUSHMAN15:
Not only illegal....but very unsafe...hammer is allowed to fall on the firing pin out of battery....very bad....wouldn't catch me playing that game. Can someone say 911 calling.



can someone say a-hole
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 8:26:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DigDug:
Um... No. And I'd never admit to it on a public internet forum if I did.




+1 Having a full auto illegaly is not worth it. Bubba will be calling your name.



It is sick how people have to worry about a broken firearm and the BATF. Even if they would not prosecute it is obvious they have a totalitarian reputation.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 8:41:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gunz4me:

Originally Posted By Lxpony:

Originally Posted By gunz4me:
Better watch out because the BATF will now rule the incorrect disconnector spring as a machine gun, just like they did with the shoe string!



shoe string????



ATF Letter - enlarge to read!

ETA: If I ever saw someone doing that at a public or private range, I would ignore the fool and/or leave if he tried to talk to me. Sorry, but I would not want to be associated with anyone doing this.



Does this mean that by wearing sneakers to the range i am in posession of parts to illegally manufacture a machinegun?
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 8:57:14 PM EDT
my SAR-1 would double and triple. the soft metal of the hammer was chewed up. I replaced the FCG and the problem went away.

I could have been a neet party trick, but you never knew when it was coming.

Link Posted: 3/26/2006 11:00:43 PM EDT
An AK cannot fire out of battery because the recoil spring is always forcing the bolt carrier and bolt forward, and the bolt carrier cannot blow out so to speak b/c any shoots out of battery will just force the action backwards like it normally would................assuming the AK is built correctly.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 11:13:04 PM EDT
One of my AR's I traded for emptied the mag after being rebuilt by a gunsmith when he took it to the range to test fire. He had tightened the pistol grip and apparently the grip screw was too long causing the rifle to slam fire. It was corrected by grinding down the grip screw before it was returned to me.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:53:15 AM EDT
I had a trigger job performed on my SAR1 that ended in the same result. Gently squeezing the trigger would result in shoulder bump fire for so many rds and then a failure from a light hit.

I replaced the whole trigger assembly with a G2.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:29:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 9:32:43 AM EDT by Schulze]

Originally Posted By samtechlan:

Originally Posted By Schulze:

Actually, in the AK action, a slam fire is pretty safe. But not recommended, of course.



Can you explain why it's relatively safe?




Originally Posted By jimtash9:


...The AK bolt and firing pin have a built-in safety. The firing pin doesn't protude from the back of the bolt until the bolt is turned and locked into battery so all the hammer is doing is just riding the back of the bolt. It cannot fire out of battery.



.................................................................................................



Originally Posted By ak4784:
An AK cannot fire out of battery because the recoil spring is always forcing the bolt carrier and bolt forward, and the bolt carrier cannot blow out so to speak b/c any shoots out of battery will just force the action backwards like it normally would................assuming the AK is built correctly.



No, any shots out of battery in any gun will rupture the case and result in a KB. What the carrier is doing is irrelevant. The AK is safe because the firing pin is not accesible to the hammer until the bolt is already rotated into the locking lugs. The only way it could KB is if the firing pin is rusted forward.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 10:20:03 AM EDT
Not Ak related but I remember reading about the early Tec-22's having some issues. The rumor was that you could stick a cigarette butt behind the trigger and do mag dumps all day.
Link Posted: 3/29/2006 10:28:18 AM EDT
Actually, I had a tec 22 that was the only weapon I ever put a hell fire on that really worked well, you could literally empty entire clips with one pull.

Too bad it wore out after 500 rounds, and the factory wanted almost as much to fix it as is cost.

Garbage.

I just dug it out the other day, if anybody wants to buy a parts gun.
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