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Posted: 1/19/2006 12:18:58 PM EDT
There's this guy in Poland who wants to buy my M14 walnut stock. We agree on the deal and he has paypal "send" me the $, except he uses his credit card and paypal won't let me get the money unless I upgrade my account and pay their fees. NFW on that! This is the first time I ever received money via paypal.

So the Polish guy is wigging out thinking I backed out of the deal. He has a decent command of English, but not enough to understand my explanantion. He emails paypal and they just tell him I refused to accept the payment, which is true, except I refused it because of paypal's rules. I suggest he use his bank account, but can't do that with paypal in Poland.

Anybody have any suggestions?

Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:24:38 PM EDT
i think there are western unions in poland. i don't know how it works from country to country though.

Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:27:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 12:29:36 PM EDT by Stottman]
Welcome to the world of international trading...

You should of figured out all the ins and outs of the payment method you were using... Not after the fact. In my opinion, you are at fault here. Even by backing out, you are probably going to screw the dude over because his credit card will still charge him some fee for an international transaction.

ETA-

Paypal only takes a percentage of the payment, no upfront fees.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:27:35 PM EDT
Up-grade your Paypal account and add the 3% charge for using it.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:30:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JOHNO:
Up-grade your Paypal account and add the 3% charge for using it.



Unless it was agreed upon before hand, I think it would be screwed up to ask him for the fees after the fact.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:32:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stottman:
In my opinion, you are at fault here.



i have to agree.

paypal has a user agreement in place. you're required to agree to the terms and conditions of that agreement before you're allowed to register.

if you didn't read the agreement, but still accepted the terms and conditions, i understand your frustation but refuse to sympathize.


you can either request a money order or you can upgrade your account.

just make sure you ship with some sort of tracking number if you use paypal, because if you don't, all he has to do is say it never got there, and get his money back. he'd be screwing you over using the user agreement to his benefit.

i highly recommend that if you wish to continue using paypal, you actually read the document to which you've already agreed. might learn a thing or four.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:46:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Stottman:

Originally Posted By JOHNO:
Up-grade your Paypal account and add the 3% charge for using it.



Unless it was agreed upon before hand, I think it would be screwed up to ask him for the fees after the fact.

Most definatly on this deal,but for future transactions.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:49:48 PM EDT
Tough crowd here. I guess there's gonna be one pissed off Pole because there is no way I'll pay the pricks at paypal one dime.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:53:40 PM EDT
Everytime you receive money via Paypal they take a cut.
The cost of doing business. Think of it as overhead and make the buyer pay the fees.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 12:58:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 12:59:06 PM EDT by arcom]
According to paypal, I can receive money free if the sender uses his bank account or paypal balance, but not via his credit card.

Paypal and I go waaay back to the shit they pulled in California for which they paid dearly, went under and had to be bailed out by eBay.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:02:40 PM EDT
I just went through the same bullshit. I just started selling things again on eBay, and while I accepted Paypal, I just had the basic account like you. I had several payment come in via CC, and when I saw what was what, I denied one, and e-mailed the other guy to explain.

The fuckin guy gave me a ration of shit, because I don't want to have to pay an extra 3% on top of the eBay listing fees and final value fees. He said to save myself $1.00, he'd have to purchase a M.O. for $1.50, and a stamp.

I explained to him again, how when you add up ebay fees and then extra Paypal fees, it adds up. But I dodn't explicitly say that I won't take CC payments on Paypal. Then I also learned that on the basic account you can only receive so much in payments each month. So I bit the bullet and upgraded. Now I will accept Paypal payments at the total cost with shipping plus 3%...

Some guy also told me eBay won't allow you to skate on fees by passing them to the bidder. I told him you couldn't pass eBay fees onto the bidder, but nowhere does it say you can't pass fees charged by a payment method onto the bidders.

Fuck that, I ain't eating an additional 3% to make it easier for the bidder...I have sent out shitloads of M.O. with stamps I purchased over the years....cry me a fuckin' river...
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:06:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By arcom:
According to paypal, I can receive money free if the sender uses his bank account or paypal balance, but not via his credit card.

Paypal and I go waaay back to the shit they pulled in California for which they paid dearly, went under and had to be bailed out by eBay.



Yes, but if you upgrade to a "Premier", or what they should call a "Premier Cornholing" account, they will charge you 2.9% + $0.30 for every transfer of money to you, not just the CC ones, plus international fees are even higher.

Unfortunately I have to say to arcom...since you didn't specify that, your probably SOL...if neccessary, upgrade to a Premium, and just explicitly say "I will accept Paypal, but will add 3% of the total cost, since that is what they charge me...International fees are a bit higher..."
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:08:47 PM EDT
The problem with paypal is that once you upgrade to accept credit cards they charge you 3% of EVERYTHING, not just credit card transactions.

Once I upgraded to accept payment for a deal so I wouldn't screw over the buyer. Anyway, I found out I always had to pay 3% so I decided to revert back to the old way. When I did that paypal said I could never upgrade again. Now I try to always advertise for non-cc paypal only.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:12:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Nate7out:
The problem with paypal is that once you upgrade to accept credit cards they charge you 3% of EVERYTHING, not just credit card transactions.

Once I upgraded to accept payment for a deal so I wouldn't screw over the buyer. Anyway, I found out I always had to pay 3% so I decided to revert back to the old way. When I did that paypal said I could never upgrade again. Now I try to always advertise for non-cc paypal only.



Wait till you have some guy give you a ration of shit because he has to buy a frickin M.O. and stamp because you don't want an extra 3% taken out of you sale....
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:18:39 PM EDT
The 3% has nothing to do with it. If paypal would just give me the money, less 3%, I'd be happy. But force me to upgrade my account? Sorry.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 1:31:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 1:32:18 PM EDT by pzjgr]

Originally Posted By arcom:
The 3% has nothing to do with it. If paypal would just give me the money, less 3%, I'd be happy. But force me to upgrade my account? Sorry.



Well, thats what I thought too, I mean, fine, charge me 3% on CC payments, but its their way to force you into upgrading, which is really downgrading.

I hate Paypal with a passion...but it does make doing business on the net easier, unfortunately...

ETA I also love the way everything is instantaneous with Paypal....except when you want to transfer YOUR money into YOUR bank account, so you can really access it. That takes 3 to 4 days....can you say float?
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 2:11:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

Originally Posted By Nate7out:
The problem with paypal is that once you upgrade to accept credit cards they charge you 3% of EVERYTHING, not just credit card transactions.

Once I upgraded to accept payment for a deal so I wouldn't screw over the buyer. Anyway, I found out I always had to pay 3% so I decided to revert back to the old way. When I did that paypal said I could never upgrade again. Now I try to always advertise for non-cc paypal only.



Wait till you have some guy give you a ration of shit because he has to buy a frickin M.O. and stamp because you don't want an extra 3% taken out of you sale....


there's a slightly hidden rule there, when you accept Paypal as payment on Ebay auctions you must accept credit cards and are not allowed to upcharge to compensate for their fees. i came across this somewhere on my Paypal account overview, don't remember where.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 2:28:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By kami211:

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

Originally Posted By Nate7out:
The problem with paypal is that once you upgrade to accept credit cards they charge you 3% of EVERYTHING, not just credit card transactions.

Once I upgraded to accept payment for a deal so I wouldn't screw over the buyer. Anyway, I found out I always had to pay 3% so I decided to revert back to the old way. When I did that paypal said I could never upgrade again. Now I try to always advertise for non-cc paypal only.



Wait till you have some guy give you a ration of shit because he has to buy a frickin M.O. and stamp because you don't want an extra 3% taken out of you sale....


there's a slightly hidden rule there, when you accept Paypal as payment on Ebay auctions you must accept credit cards and are not allowed to upcharge to compensate for their fees. i came across this somewhere on my Paypal account overview, don't remember where.



Aww, shit, them bastards....
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 2:59:33 PM EDT
I sometimes sell stuff over the net, and accept paypal, but I always explain that I cannot take cc payments by paypal, it has to come out of paypal acct or their checking acct. I still get paypal payments by cc, but just refuse it and email the sender to explain again. I'v never had anyone bitch about it when I point out that I explained this in the previous email.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 9:21:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By arcom:
Tough crowd here. I guess there's gonna be one pissed off Pole because there is no way I'll pay the pricks at paypal one dime.



Well, remind me not to sell or buy anything from you. You gave the guy your word. The fact that you didnt research your payment method is not his fault. And like I said, the guy is going to have to pay his CC for the international transaction fee anyway.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 11:31:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By kami211:

Originally Posted By pzjgr:

Originally Posted By Nate7out:
The problem with paypal is that once you upgrade to accept credit cards they charge you 3% of EVERYTHING, not just credit card transactions.

Once I upgraded to accept payment for a deal so I wouldn't screw over the buyer. Anyway, I found out I always had to pay 3% so I decided to revert back to the old way. When I did that paypal said I could never upgrade again. Now I try to always advertise for non-cc paypal only.



Wait till you have some guy give you a ration of shit because he has to buy a frickin M.O. and stamp because you don't want an extra 3% taken out of you sale....


there's a slightly hidden rule there, when you accept Paypal as payment on Ebay auctions you must accept credit cards and are not allowed to upcharge to compensate for their fees. i came across this somewhere on my Paypal account overview, don't remember where.



True, if you require the customer to cover the 3% then you lose all rights if the deal goes bad and you're ripped off, basically. Paypal will simply look the other way in that case and you're on your own.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 4:06:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/20/2006 4:08:20 AM EDT by ArmedFerret]

Originally Posted By pzjgr:
ETA I also love the way everything is instantaneous with Paypal....except when you want to transfer YOUR money into YOUR bank account, so you can really access it. That takes 3 to 4 days....can you say float?



can you say free paypal debit/atm card?

never once have i had to wait for access to funds in my paypal account any longer than it takes me to find an ATM.

any type of funds transfer from one bank to a different one takes 3-4 business days to complete. it's part of the financial industry...that's just the way things happen. banks hold the electronic funds for a few days to make sure that there's nothing legally questionable about the amount of money, the source, and that the funds are actually real.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 4:55:27 AM EDT
Just upgrade and cancel after the transaction. IMHO you owe it to the pole.

We all may not agree on liking or disliking paypal, but using them makes deals a whole lot easier. ie .. I don't have to go to the PO - purchase MO, purchase postage, my valuable time. Selling stuff - I don't have to wait around for a money order that may or may not come. I can then deposit the funds right into my checking account-takes a couple days. This makes it worth 3% to me.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:56:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:

Originally Posted By pzjgr:
ETA I also love the way everything is instantaneous with Paypal....except when you want to transfer YOUR money into YOUR bank account, so you can really access it. That takes 3 to 4 days....can you say float?



can you say free paypal debit/atm card?

never once have i had to wait for access to funds in my paypal account any longer than it takes me to find an ATM.

any type of funds transfer from one bank to a different one takes 3-4 business days to complete. it's part of the financial industry...that's just the way things happen. banks hold the electronic funds for a few days to make sure that there's nothing legally questionable about the amount of money, the source, and that the funds are actually real.



Well, thats what I did...but you can only get the ATM/Debit card IF you upgrade to a Premium account...they get you coming or going.

I decided the hassle wasn't worth it, so I upgraded. It is nice to get your money fast, and be able to transfer/spend right from your computer.....
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 6:20:26 AM EDT
guess i've been with paypal for going on 8 years now, and back when i first joined you could get the ATM card without being a premier member.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:01:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Stottman:

Originally Posted By arcom:
Tough crowd here. I guess there's gonna be one pissed off Pole because there is no way I'll pay the pricks at paypal one dime.



Well, remind me not to sell or buy anything from you. You gave the guy your word. The fact that you didnt research your payment method is not his fault. And like I said, the guy is going to have to pay his CC for the international transaction fee anyway.



+1

The paypal no guns policy is risk management, not political. Upgrade and pay the 3% and get over it.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:06:00 AM EDT
F*** you payapl! they cut me off because one of my buyer used terms like 'Glock parts' on the message section.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:10:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By coolhand:
F*** you payapl! they cut me off because one of my buyer used terms like 'Glock parts' on the message section.



how is that paypal's fault? they have a set of rules to which you agreed when you registered to use their service. if your buyer was stupid enough to get you caught violating their own policy for their private company, how exactly is that THEIR fault?
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:12:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By arcom:
Tough crowd here. I guess there's gonna be one pissed off Pole because there is no way I'll pay the pricks at paypal one dime.



Once again someone wants something for nothing ... ...
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:48:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:

Originally Posted By coolhand:
F*** you payapl! they cut me off because one of my buyer used terms like 'Glock parts' on the message section.



how is that paypal's fault? they have a set of rules to which you agreed when you registered to use their service. if your buyer was stupid enough to get you caught violating their own policy for their private company, how exactly is that THEIR fault?



It’s their business and I guess they could do whatever they want… I’m just mad because they discriminate us just because we like guns.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 7:52:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By coolhand:

Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:

Originally Posted By coolhand:
F*** you payapl! they cut me off because one of my buyer used terms like 'Glock parts' on the message section.



how is that paypal's fault? they have a set of rules to which you agreed when you registered to use their service. if your buyer was stupid enough to get you caught violating their own policy for their private company, how exactly is that THEIR fault?



It’s their business and I guess they could do whatever they want… I’m just mad because they discriminate us just because we like guns.




they aren't discriminating against us solely because we're firearm enthusiasts. their user agreement isn't written by some average joe who cleans the toilets. it's written by a horde of lawyers--lawyers who have already had to settle numerous claims against paypal that because they allowed so-and-so to buy gun parts off the web, that person's idiotic and blatantly illegal acts were somehow paypal's fault. they put the clauses regarding specific firearm parts and knives in there to protect themselves. equate it if you will to the recent legislation prohibiting lawsuits against firearm manufacturers for the acts of an individual who misuses their product.

it's sad that they have to do it (i.e. it's sad that people would actually attempt to hold them responsible for the illegal acts of an individual), but it's a sad fact of life. they have to cover their own asses because nothing in the law currently does.

i know a lot of people don't like it, and i may not agree with it, but i UNDERSTAND WHY they do it. if i were in the same position, i'd probably do something similar to protect my own interests too.

now be a man and stop hiding in wells. you'll end up like Timmy and Lassie will have to save your ass.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 8:46:24 AM EDT
I upgraded my account to do the CC thing just to screw over the PayPal Network. I love selling gun stuff and using PayPal. Yeah, they get their 3% + .30 per transaction but just knowing that I'm doing something that they don't like is worth it...


SCREW'EM

Oh, I have the buyer use "other wording" so it won't appear as a "GUN" transaction.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 8:58:39 AM EDT
LOL...I hate PayPal but sometimes its just to damn convient. I used payPal last night for an AK accessory and I said it was for flowerss yuck yuck. Of course the guys wife might go ballistic if she sees it LOL...hope not. To me its more like getting over on those dumb anti gun freaks LOL...
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 9:03:47 AM EDT




now be a man and stop hiding in wells. you'll end up like Timmy and Lassie will have to save your ass.



lol yor're funny man.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 9:35:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By coolhand:




now be a man and stop hiding in wells. you'll end up like Timmy and Lassie will have to save your ass.



lol yor're funny man.



i contribute when, where, and how i can.


life's too rare to spend it not smiling.
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