Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 12/11/2005 5:56:10 PM EDT
I was thinking of getting an Arsenal SFC, then putting on a rail system of some sort. Then, I saw the KTR. This gun seems to be exactly what I am looking for. It has a forward rail, thumb safety, AR style sights, and a reciever rail. I did see that it is essentially a Saiga rifle though. What quality do saiga rifles (not shotguns) have? The finish, reliability? What about the mag well? I noticed that it had no dimples, so is it like the WASR?

BTW, when can I get my AMMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 6:04:01 PM EDT
Saiga anything has a very decent rep as well manufactured........

saiga questions....go to Saiga12.com
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 8:21:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Death_006:
I was thinking of getting an Arsenal SFC, then putting on a rail system of some sort. Then, I saw the KTR. This gun seems to be exactly what I am looking for. It has a forward rail, thumb safety, AR style sights, and a reciever rail. I did see that it is essentially a Saiga rifle though. What quality do saiga rifles (not shotguns) have? The finish, reliability? What about the mag well? I noticed that it had no dimples, so is it like the WASR?

BTW, when can I get my AMMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



I should have my new Kreb's KTR-03S tomorrow if UPS brings it on time.

The new batch of KTR-03S's aren't build on Saigas anymore (not more Saigas imported yet). They are built with Arsenal U.S. made Bulgarian receivers with mag dimples, at least from the pics in the latest special Surefire-sponsored issue of Guns and Ammo. They have an 8 page full color spread on the new KTR-03S. It is sweet. I have a few converted Saigas and I have to say that they are the best AK's out there quality-wise for the money. It will be great to compare this KTR to them. It also seems to have a U.S. made M4-type contour barrel with an AR FH. At the very least the U.S. parts are: (3) FCG, buttstock, pistol grip, forearm (rail made by krebs), gas tube, front sight block/gas chamber, etc. Not all of these are on the ATF's "10 or less" parts count, but it is interesting info.

I was planning on making my own KTR-style AK out of a Saiga or VEPR that I already have, but pricing the parts alone would bring me to around $900 and I still wouldn't have a nice triple rail, railed dust cover, AR style sights, and a left side thumb safety. If the barrel, gas tube, trunion, front sight block/gas chamber, dust cover, etc. are all U.S. made Kreb's parts, then this rifle is surely a deal for $999. Brian Krebs told me that they make most of their own parts in house like the front sight base, AR sight, dust cover rail, forearm rail, etc. That must cost a fortune.
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 10:50:41 PM EDT
Ugh, I want one soo bad. I had to buy that Surefire mag a week ago so I could drool on it...
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 1:14:33 PM EDT
Kreb's rifles are top notch !!!


Link Posted: 12/12/2005 1:43:29 PM EDT
Some day I hope to have one.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 2:28:21 PM EDT
Picked it up today and it is sweet! Trunion under barrel has Izhmash marking (arrow in triangle). Receiver is U.S. made, IIRC is says U.S. Armory, TX or something like that. Came with 3 full length rail covers too. Sights are amazing, well worth even $300 over a stock AK. Dust cover is very solid, no movement at all. Left side thumb safety moves right side safety/selctor lever. AR style FH has no vents on bottom so it will act as a muzzle brake. This thing is quite a bit lighter than my converted Saiga AK-104, at least .5-1 lb. lighter. I'm in the middle of finals, so probably no pics or range report for at least a few days. If I could only own one AK, it seems that it would either be a KTR-03S or a highly modified VEPR K. Now I need to get an ACE skeleton folder and slap it on there instead of the fixed polymer stock. This rifle is worth the $999 when there are plently of other AK's out there selling for $500-$1000 which don't have all the "improvements" that this has and that are built from very used kits in many cases. I am not an AR guy at all, but this KTR-03S is the best compromise between the two.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 3:42:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By hartzpad:
at least from the pics in the latest special Surefire-sponsored issue of Guns and Ammo. They have an 8 page full color spread on the new KTR-03S. It is sweet.



I bought that issue of G&A hoping for some good info on the guns inside. Turns out it was just a giant bunch of gun porn. Most of the articles contained descriptions that merely told you stuff you could surmise about the gun from a line drawing, and quoted the usual "gun numbers" without any useful info about evaluating them as combat weapons. In fact, they could have just used the pictures, and tossed the articles, and I still would have bought the issue.

In all fairness, the article about trauma treatment was very good, if a bit simplistic. But if you're a layman that's good.



I was planning on making my own KTR-style AK out of a Saiga or VEPR that I already have, but pricing the parts alone would bring me to around $900 and I still wouldn't have a nice triple rail, railed dust cover, AR style sights, and a left side thumb safety. If the barrel, gas tube, trunion, front sight block/gas chamber, dust cover, etc. are all U.S. made Kreb's parts, then this rifle is surely a deal for $999. Brian Krebs told me that they make most of their own parts in house like the front sight base, AR sight, dust cover rail, forearm rail, etc. That must cost a fortune.



Considering how much they cost to build, they are priced well. Problem is, 1K+ assault rifles aren't really appealing. I think the AK doesn't scale well to the modern feature-based economy. I think some of the design factors that made it ideal for the Soviet "economy" handicap the scalability of the design. So the utility vs. cost curve really starts to plateau first at around $400-$500 and again at $1K. Ever notice how all the "High AKs" such as the KTR, Beryl, Sako, Galil, and even the SIG 550 cost so darn much? You could even dump the XCR in there too. All of them are expensive not just in the US but in their home countries as well.

Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:04:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/12/2005 6:05:29 PM EDT by Burke888]
I searched the forums and found this thread after looking for a tactical AK. This seems to be EXACTLY what I want. It combines the adaptable features that make the AR great, while maintaining a simple, reliable AK operating system. I was thinking of the 7.62 version, but I have not noticed a 7.62 with the improvements made on the 5.45 model?


*yes, just 2nd post, long time lurker, first (er 2nd)-time poster*h.gif
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 6:58:55 PM EDT
Hartzpad, which caliber did you get? Either way I am supremly jealous.
Link Posted: 12/12/2005 7:12:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CFII:
Hartzpad, which caliber did you get? Either way I am supremly jealous.



7.62 of course. All of my AK's are 7.62 besides the bried stint I had with a 5.45 VEPR K. I love the 7.62's. I'll have some pics of it most likely on Wed. You'll have to wait until then. It is a sweet rifle.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 9:32:45 AM EDT
snapped some quick (and unfortunately dark) pics of my new KTR-03S



Link Posted: 12/14/2005 9:34:55 AM EDT
Gey hartzpad, does the dust cover have a hinged front, or does it look like a standard cover with a rail on it? I emailed krebs, and they said the railed cover on it wont fit on a normal ak47. Enjoy that rifle, I want one reallllly bad.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 9:39:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By CFII:
Gey hartzpad, does the dust cover have a hinged front, or does it look like a standard cover with a rail on it? I emailed krebs, and they said the railed cover on it wont fit on a normal ak47. Enjoy that rifle, I want one reallllly bad.



It is a standard AK dust cover with the rail attached with 5 threaded hex screws into the rail from the inside of the cover. It is 100% solid and is actually kind of tough to remove at first. They have a wedge on the rear of the Kreb's rear sight base that the dust cover rail fits under and it really wedges it tight every time you put it back on, works really well. Because the KTR has this different rear sight base, the gas tube is longer and normal AK parts like a dust cover are not interchangable. This thing feels great, very light and great sights. I'm going to sell my Saiga AK-104 conversion because this one is that much better and lighter.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 1:31:02 PM EDT
Did you order from R-Guns, or another source? I only see the model with the VLTOR on their website, and it's $1225. I would buy the fixed stock rifle if I could get for $999 like it says on the Krebs site.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 1:35:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gov-t_mule:
Did you order from R-Guns, or another source? I only see the model with the VLTOR on their website, and it's $1225. I would buy the fixed stock rifle if I could get for $999 like it says on the Krebs site.



$999 from R-Guns when I backordered it in October, seems they want $1,025 for it now, still a good deal. Shipping is only $10 IIRC.

www.rguns.net/009_53.html
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 2:30:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CFII:
Gey hartzpad, does the dust cover have a hinged front, or does it look like a standard cover with a rail on it? I emailed krebs, and they said the railed cover on it wont fit on a normal ak47. Enjoy that rifle, I want one reallllly bad.



What did Hartzpad ever do to you to call him ghey?
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 3:40:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By hartzpad:
snapped some quick (and unfortunately dark) pics of my new KTR-03S

images.snapfish.com/34577%3B5523232%7Ffp336%3Enu%3D3243%3E934%3E9­58%3EWSNRCG%3D3233393%3A%3B66%3A%3Cnu0mrj

images.snapfish.com/34577%3B5523232%7Ffp336%3Enu%3D3243%3E934%3E9­58%3EWSNRCG%3D3233393%3A%3C2%3C%3B6nu0mrj



That receiver is not a Saiga, do you know what it is?
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 4:00:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Belloc:

That receiver is not a Saiga, do you know what it is?



Like I posted above, Kreb's used to build the KTR-03S's from Saigas, but not anymore. My receiver is marked "Armory USA, Houston, TX" w/ mag dimples. Very clean.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 6:21:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Thekatar:

Originally Posted By CFII:
Gey hartzpad, does the dust cover have a hinged front, or does it look like a standard cover with a rail on it? I emailed krebs, and they said the railed cover on it wont fit on a normal ak47. Enjoy that rifle, I want one reallllly bad.



What did Hartzpad ever do to you to call him ghey?



H and G are right next to eachother...

Top Top