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Posted: 8/19/2003 5:32:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2003 9:00:07 AM EDT by Tate]
Got a mail today stating that the mags are in and available for ordering now. $11.99 per.

Black polymer 30 round Bulgarian magazines in 7.62X39 cal. Buy 100+ for .50 off, 250+ for $1.00 off, 500+ for $1.50 off, and 1000+ for $2.00 off each magazine.

Anybody in DFW area want to go in on a joint buy? I could take 50 of them, personally.

JK charges $6.74 to ship one mag - at least to me - $8.99 to ship four mags. So shipping looks reasonable if you get more than a couple of mags.

I'll have friends with a table at the September Market Hall show (very good Dallas fun show). I would think that I should be able to sell these for $15 with no problems. I'm not suggesting $15 per for people interested in going in on the buy with me - actual price and percentage of shipping, of course.


Opinions?

Anyone in DFW inteested in going in on some mags? Posted this in the Texas Hometown forum too - I want mags!
Link Posted: 8/19/2003 5:49:10 PM EDT
I'mnot in DFW, but I'm close enough. I might be in for 10.
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 2:37:32 AM EDT

Did they include a URL in the mail? I was on the list, but didn't get the mail... and the mags are not on teh website.
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 8:49:07 AM EDT
Yes, they did, DG. A link to a site not reachable from their site as far as I can tell.

Link Posted: 8/20/2003 10:30:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 11:17:05 AM EDT


duh - I didn't think to post it.

Link they sent me was twice that long.

And he one they mailed to me was sooooooooper DOOOOOOOPER secret.

Link Posted: 8/20/2003 4:32:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2003 4:32:53 PM EDT by mindtrix]
Personally I wouldn't deal with Joeken. I've heard some bad stories about them. I guess thats why they are called joeken, as in, "we are just joke'n, we don't actually have that in stock" ;)
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 4:56:10 PM EDT
Joeken is a complete F'n mess. I ordered 2 Hesse receivers in May. They immediately billed my CC and said they'd ship in 2 weeks. 4 weeks later I get a call from them saying that they only have receivers with trunions and trigger guards installed. No thanks, that's cool, just refund my money. Now it's almost September and I'm STILL trying to get my money. I've literally called 6 times and even spoke to Joe, who seemed nice enough, but now two weeks after speaking to him and getting a bunch of apologies and a promise that it would be fixed, I'm still out almost $100 they've had for over 3 months. It's in the hands of my credit card company now. Buyer beware...this could be a quick way to raise money, becuase I'm nearly positive that they'll bill you the moment you place your order, and the mags may or may not materialize.

take care,
Tec

P.S. I got the waffle email too, and it just pissed me off even further.
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 9:32:19 PM EDT
Thanks for the heads up, fellas - I'll lay low for now and let someone else be the guinea pig.
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 9:52:06 PM EDT
I'm going to be ordering 10+ of these here in a couple of days...

I've purchased from JoeKen in the past, successfully.

Here's what worked for me:

When I called to make my order, I asked for Joe specifically (don't think Han was there at the time).

I told Joe that I had seen a LOT of bad publicity about his business, which tried to defend.

I replied that I was still interested in doing business with him, but that I felt there was a lot of truth to the numerous complaints about order's being placed, charged, and not shipped for large amounts of time.

I said that I was going to be watching my credit card on-line, and would be calling for shipping confirmation EVERY DAY as soon as my car was charged. If, after 5 business days, I didn't have valid tracking information in my hands showing that something was being shipped to my place, I'd cancel the order, file fraud charges with my credit card company, and take things from there.

He didn't have much to say after that, but still wanted my business, and wanted to prove the naysayers wrong.

I placed my order. Two days later my card was charged.

I started making my daily phone calls (sometimes more than once in a day, because I got the runaround from a couple of the flunkies there), and as of the 5th day, I had tracking info that my order was shipped.

There was one small, very minor issue with my order (wrong part shipped) when it arrived - Joe actually called me up about 3 days after the package had arrived (I sent email about the mis-shipped part) to verify that everything was OK. He immediately shipped out the correct part, as well as two or three 4-mag magpouches for free, and told me to keep the wrong part (a pistol grip). The new part and the mag pouches showed up about 5 days later.

Did I go to more work than I should have? Yes, but it was worth it for what I got, and how much I paid for it.

Do I think that Joe is trying to screw over his customers? No. I think that Joe quite possibly didn't think things through when his business started getting busy, and is/was pretty disorganized. I think that he's made (and continues to make) a real effort in how he handles his business, and he's trying to negate the bad publicity they've received.

I don't think his forum on ak-47.net and how he moderates it is the right thing to do (complaints are often deleted, and complainants are threatened with libel/slander lawsuits (standard operating procedures for that entire website)), but, overall, I give his business a rating of "slightly above average".

The biggest (and to me, only real issue) is the organization/customer service - for as much business as he seems to do, it seems like he's not putting any effort into the place, letting his few employees handle everything, and that they're making a mess of things.

Not how I'd run it, but...

To me, the good outweighs the bad - it just requires a little bit of work to get the good. If you don't want the hassle, it's your choice.

I honestly believe that Joe is trying to do right by everyone that he's pissed off - it just takes some time, and you can't please everybody.

(And, for those of you that hate ak-47.net and all of it's sponsors, no, this was not solicited by JoeKen or anyone associated with them - this is my personal opinion.)
Link Posted: 8/20/2003 10:53:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2003 11:10:38 PM EDT by WildWes]

Originally Posted By kythri:(And, for those of you that hate ak-47.net and all of it's sponsors, no, this was not solicited by JoeKen or anyone associated with them - this is my personal opinion.)


I don't hate ak47.net, their sponsers and have never personally done business with Joeken...

But it's far beyond me to have to threaten a vendor with tracking info and a potential for a cancelled order including fraud charges.

For what? (At the risk of being "banned" here as well), What? a few mags, and pouches?

I'm not trying to assault your post kythri, just way too much work in making a simple order expecting simple delivery. I could rattle off at least 6 worthy vendors and post url's of reputable dealers who ship what they sell.

Even more individuals who've sold parts on the boards.

I provide labor for what I sell. My labor.

Shit, give me a few dozen boxes of mags and pouches? I'd ship overnight and eat the loss.Especially if my reputation was on the line.(Oh yeah, working with a phone, computer and garage helper-monkey as opposed to real work? Sign me up!)

(Of course, moderating your own forum on Gunsnet has it's priveledges. Guaranteed failure.)

Pre-edit edit: JMHO...

Link Posted: 8/21/2003 12:23:01 AM EDT
AK-47.net trader rating system is a crock. JOEKEN has received negative ratings which are deleted. Hmm, sounds familiar, deja vu.
Link Posted: 8/21/2003 4:12:46 AM EDT
I ordered from JoeKen early on and got good service and great stuff - mags/kits/bayonets. I think they just got to big to fast. I haven't tried ordering on line, I like talking to a real person. I ordered 10 waffles yesterday and talked to Han who seemed to be on the ball. I'll post how my dealings this time turned out.
Link Posted: 8/21/2003 3:40:02 PM EDT
Yesterday was my first time ever dealing with Joeken, I ordered (5) waffle mags online, and used my Credit card, the email I got last night said that they would email me as soon as the mags were shipped and my card was charged. Then I came back to this post and found all the negative replys, got a little worried and checked my card several times and found no charges, so then I figured well they havent shipped them because they probably arent in stock, So I hurryed and called them, spoke to Hahn, told him I was calling regarding my online order for the Bulgarian Waffle mags, he paused and I asked if they shipped yet, he paused, uh no, I asked, Are they in stock?, uh well we're taking pre-orders, uh we should have them sometime next week, I told him I wanted to cancel, he was affirmed that he would cancel it, and I told him I wanted an email confirming, and I got that within 5 minutes of getting off the phone with him. Im sorry but Im not buying items that aren't in stock, I'd rather just buy from another source that doesnt have all these issues, I can't afford to be gambling, I will make sure I post if my card gets charged...Next time I'll research before I throw my CC# out there...
Link Posted: 8/21/2003 4:00:48 PM EDT
don't worry billc even i ihad to learn this leason the hard way.
john
Link Posted: 8/21/2003 5:22:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WildWes:

Originally Posted By kythri:(And, for those of you that hate ak-47.net and all of it's sponsors, no, this was not solicited by JoeKen or anyone associated with them - this is my personal opinion.)


I don't hate ak47.net, their sponsers and have never personally done business with Joeken...

But it's far beyond me to have to threaten a vendor with tracking info and a potential for a cancelled order including fraud charges.

For what? (At the risk of being "banned" here as well), What? a few mags, and pouches?

I'm not trying to assault your post kythri, just way too much work in making a simple order expecting simple delivery. I could rattle off at least 6 worthy vendors and post url's of reputable dealers who ship what they sell.



Hey, that's cool - I don't see it as an assault at all.

When I made my purchase at JoeKen, I hadn't discovered ARFcom yet - I was using ak-47.net, but was getting disillusioned with how things were handled. I had seen other vendors selling what I had purchased, but for significantly higher prices (at the time).

I purchased 3 Bulgy 74 kits, 18 74-mags, and appropriate other US parts (AK-74 brakes, pistol grips, forearms and FCG).

Now, looking back, I wish I had discovered this place first, and that K-Var was selling some things that they have now (US-made Warsaw-Pact size furniture. I hate the NATO-length buttstocks with a passion!).

I wish I knew about the RSA FCGs.

I'm currently sitting on 3 sets of ?Hesse? FCG's, and a few other assorted parts that I purchased from JoeKen that I wouldn't purchase now.

Their price, at the time, on the Bulgy kits made the hassle worth it, in my opinion.

I do agree, wholeheartedly, I should not have had to deal with the BS involved, but I knew what I was getting into when I made the decision to purchase from them.

Just wanted to give others the information needed to make an intelligent decision on whether or not to do business with JoeKen - like I said, I'm going to be purchasing some of these Bulgy mags from them - we'll see if everything is cool.
Link Posted: 8/22/2003 4:13:40 PM EDT
Just an FYI, the mags have cleared Customs, but JOEKKEN does not have them yet. They are on a train, and at least a week or two away from arriving at JOEKKEN's warehouse.
Link Posted: 8/23/2003 7:46:45 AM EDT


<snipped>

I don't think his forum on ak-47.net and how he moderates it is the right thing to do (complaints are often deleted, and complainants are threatened with libel/slander lawsuits (standard operating procedures for that entire website)),

<snipped>

(And, for those of you that hate ak-47.net and all of it's sponsors, no, this was not solicited by JoeKen or anyone associated with them - this is my personal opinion.)



Here comes dumb question #124. Why would anyone hate ak-47.net and their sponsors? What did they do to encourage such animosity? Do they threaten people with lawsuits for speaking their minds or something? I joined over there too, should I leave before the cops show up? Not that I intend to say anything bad..

Sorry if I'm ruffling some feathers.....

Link Posted: 8/23/2003 8:49:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Montag:
Here comes dumb question #124. Why would anyone hate ak-47.net and their sponsors? What did they do to encourage such animosity? Do they threaten people with lawsuits for speaking their minds or something? I joined over there too, should I leave before the cops show up? Not that I intend to say anything bad..

Sorry if I'm ruffling some feathers.....




A lot of people over here came from AK-47.net after getting banned for speaking opinions that differed from the staff/moderators or sponsors.

AK-47.net covered a gunsmiths ass when complaints started rolling in about lack of contact/broken promises or ship dates. They deleted any post with any negative comment to about this person, and banned anyone that made such a post from their boards.

They continued to lie about this person, and give the impression that everything was alright.

This person has now been raided and sanctioned by the Kansas Attorney General, and only now has AK-47.net lifted the veil on this matter, in an attempt to now cover their asses for aiding and abetting a criminal.

The AK-47.net forum allows sponsors to censor discussion related to said sponsors. Certain vendors over at that site have what appear to be great trader rankings, yet these numbers are artificially inflated, because negative ratings are deleted, and users who gave these rankings are banned.

Users are constantly threatened with libel/slander for posts they make expressing their lack of satisfaction with a particular vendor(s) (since they can't get ahold of the vendor(s) damn near any other way save for the public forum).

All in all, if you're looking for the "best" site for AK chat/forum/info, it'd probably be wise to look elsewhere.

There is some good information to be found over there. It's just hard to find at times, because it usually gets deleted before you can read it.

Whether or not you should leave is your choice. I'm still a member, yet I don't post over there. I rarely go over there and read anything, because I can usually find the answers I need here.
Link Posted: 8/23/2003 10:04:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By kythri:

Originally Posted By Montag:
Here comes dumb question #124. Why would anyone hate ak-47.net and their sponsors? What did they do to encourage such animosity? Do they threaten people with lawsuits for speaking their minds or something? I joined over there too, should I leave before the cops show up? Not that I intend to say anything bad..

Sorry if I'm ruffling some feathers.....




A lot of people over here came from AK-47.net after getting banned for speaking opinions that differed from the staff/moderators or sponsors.

AK-47.net covered a gunsmiths ass when complaints started rolling in about lack of contact/broken promises or ship dates. They deleted any post with any negative comment to about this person, and banned anyone that made such a post from their boards.

They continued to lie about this person, and give the impression that everything was alright.

This person has now been raided and sanctioned by the Kansas Attorney General, and only now has AK-47.net lifted the veil on this matter, in an attempt to now cover their asses for aiding and abetting a criminal.

The AK-47.net forum allows sponsors to censor discussion related to said sponsors. Certain vendors over at that site have what appear to be great trader rankings, yet these numbers are artificially inflated, because negative ratings are deleted, and users who gave these rankings are banned.

Users are constantly threatened with libel/slander for posts they make expressing their lack of satisfaction with a particular vendor(s) (since they can't get ahold of the vendor(s) damn near any other way save for the public forum).

All in all, if you're looking for the "best" site for AK chat/forum/info, it'd probably be wise to look elsewhere.

There is some good information to be found over there. It's just hard to find at times, because it usually gets deleted before you can read it.

Whether or not you should leave is your choice. I'm still a member, yet I don't post over there. I rarely go over there and read anything, because I can usually find the answers I need here.



I'd say you already found it.
Link Posted: 8/23/2003 10:17:42 AM EDT
HOLY SPAM BATMAN!!!

I woke up this morning with six emails from sales@JOEKEN.com and one from wafflelist@Joeken.com

RE: Your application, RE: You inquiry, RE: details, RE: RE: My details, RE: Approved, RE: THANK YOU!

Most of them simply were simply:
"Dear Valued Customer,
Thank you for your interest in our products. I will respond to your inquiry as
soon as possible. If you have not been to our website yet, the address is:
www.joeken.com
Give me a call if you have any questions. We are open 9-5 Monday-Friday
Mountain Standard Time (please keep this in mind if you are on the East coast).
Phone # 1-928-289-6429
Send requests for catalogs and FFLs to our PO Box:
JoeKen Firearms
PO Box 773
Winslow, AZ 86047"

But at least one of them had an attachment that was evidently stripped off by my virus protection.

FWIW worth, I have probably only been to the Joeken website twice in my life, and I have NEVER ordered from them or emailed them for info. So I have no idea how they got my email addy, perhaps AK-47.net is giving out our info to their valued sponsers???

Eitherway, they might be accidentally handing out viruses to those on their email list, so don't open any of their attachments...
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 11:37:19 AM EDT
I pre-ordered 10 waffle mags from Joeken's website 8/20. Did it before seeing this post. If they charge my card before they are ready to ship they will have hell to pay.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 6:04:32 PM EDT
wow thanks for the heads up on JOEKEN.... I was thinking of getting the there Bulgarian AK74. If anyone has any info on these ak's it would help out.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 6:17:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By airborne_trooper:
wow thanks for the heads up on JOEKEN.... I was thinking of getting the there Bulgarian AK74. If anyone has any info on these ak's it would help out.



Don't do it, chances are, it's a Hesse rifle.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 6:32:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/24/2003 6:33:07 PM EDT by AJjer_Bullets]

Originally Posted By HKocher:
HOLY SPAM BATMAN!!!

I woke up this morning with six emails from sales@JOEKEN.com and one from wafflelist@Joeken.com

RE: Your application, RE: You inquiry, RE: details, RE: RE: My details, RE: Approved, RE: THANK YOU!

But at least one of them had an attachment that was evidently stripped off by my virus protection.



"RE: Approved" is supposed to be one of the email titles used by the latest "worm" type virus. It likely sent itself to you from Joeken, having reached them from an email to them. It hides itself in attachments.

Link Posted: 8/24/2003 9:18:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mbsk01:
Don't do it, chances are, it's a Hesse rifle.



It is.

Well, correction - I think it's actually a "Vulcan" rifle, which is one of Hesse's alter-egos.

I was disinterested in it, because they use a US-made forearm that doesn't have the cleaning rod hole drilled, so they don't (or didn't) include the cleaning rod.

I also have seen several pictures of Hesse-built AK's that have some serious issues...
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 9:43:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AJjer_Bullets:
"RE: Approved" is supposed to be one of the email titles used by the latest "worm" type virus. It likely sent itself to you from Joeken, having reached them from an email to them. It hides itself in attachments.




That's what I figured...

Still, that doesn't answer how Joeken got my email addy. I've never ordered from them or emailed them. I don't even post on any AK boards, except for occasionally on this one.

However, I do have a AK-47.net profile, so I'm pretty sure they are the ones that are giving out my email to their sponsers.

I don't know about you guys, but it pisses me off that the forum owners there would give out the private info of their users to the sponsers. Pretty low, but I guess I shouldn't expect much from them...
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 9:56:33 PM EDT
I've been battling all of these stupid worms/virii at work, but I haven't taken a lot of time to read up on much more than how to get rid of it/how to prevent it.

I do know, however, that a number of these types of worms/virii will actually take a message from an infected person, send to a person in the infected's address book, and spoof the headers as coming from another person in the infected's address book.

So, quite possibly, those emails came from someone else - someone that has you and JoeKen in their address book.
Link Posted: 8/24/2003 11:29:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By kythri:
I've been battling all of these stupid worms/virii at work, but I haven't taken a lot of time to read up on much more than how to get rid of it/how to prevent it.

I do know, however, that a number of these types of worms/virii will actually take a message from an infected person, send to a person in the infected's address book, and spoof the headers as coming from another person in the infected's address book.

So, quite possibly, those emails came from someone else - someone that has you and JoeKen in their address book.



I believe Kythri is correct. As much as I'd enjoy slamming Gunsnet.net, I don't think I've ever gotten an e-mail from their releasing my info. Without going and checking, I do think they list that it's not their policy to stoop that low.

As far as JoeKen's Bulgarian 74's go, the price would be very tempting if not for the original threads posted here. Perhaps a Team AR15 member could dig the reviews out of the archieves? From what I recall, the kits weren't built with matching #'s, and something about fake plastic rivets...
Link Posted: 8/25/2003 2:08:46 PM EDT
Has anybody actually received any Bulgarian waffle mags from joeken?
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