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Posted: 9/8/2010 4:49:35 AM EDT
Long Island Man Arrested For Defending Home With AK-47

Says Many Gang Members Were Coming After His Family

UNIONDALE, N.Y. (CBS 2) — He was arrested for protecting his property and family.
But it’s how the Long Island man did it that police say crossed the line.
He got an AK-47 assault rifle, pulled the trigger and he ended up in jail, reports CBS 2’s Pablo Guzman.
George Grier said he had to use his rifle on Sunday night to stop what he thought was going to be an invasion of his Uniondale home by a gang he thought might have been the vicious “MS-13.” He said the whole deal happened as he was about to drive his cousin home.
“I went around and went into the house, ran upstairs and told my wife to call the police. I get the gun and I go outside and I come into the doorway and now, by this time, they are in the driveway, back here near the house. I tell them, you know, ‘Can you please leave?’ Grier said.
Grier said the five men dared him to use the gun; and that their shouts brought another larger group of gang members in front of his house.
“He starts threatening my family, my life. ‘Oh you’re dead. I’m gonna kill your family and your babies. You’re dead.’ So when he says that, 20 others guys come rushing around the corner. And so I fired four warning shots into the grass,” Grier said.
Grier was later arrested. John Lewis is Grier’s attorney.
“What he’s initially charged with – A D felony reckless endangerment — requires a depraved indifference to human life, creating a risk that someone’s going to die. Shooting into a lawn doesn’t create a risk of anybody dying,” Lewis said.
Grier said he knew Nassau County Police employ the hi-tech “ShotSpotter” technology in his area and that the shooting would bring police in minutes. Cops told Guzman he was very cooperative.
Grier also said he was afraid the gang outside his house was the dreaded MS-13. And Nassau County Police Lt. Andrew Mulraine, head of the gang unit, said MS-13 has 2,000 members in the county.
“They’re probably the most organized. They almost have a military hierarchy within the gang, so they are the most organized gang we encounter on a daily basis,” Mulraine said.
You may think a person has the right to defend their home. But the law says you can only use physical force to deter physical force. Grier said he never saw anyone pull out a gun, so a court would have to decide on firing the gun.
Police determined Grier had the gun legally. He has no criminal record. And so he was not charged for the weapon.
That ShotSpotter technology pinpoints where a gun has been fired within 35 feet. Police said it also detected two other shootings in nearby Roosevelt that night.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 5:18:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:21:04 AM EDT


Eh... a lot of people never look at the total cluster that is the GD forum.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:41:32 AM EDT
Never fire warning shoots and what do ya expect out of NY.....
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:49:35 AM EDT
Isn't that headline a bit deceptive?

It makes it sound like the specific type of rifle used (an AK), had some special bearing that made this story newsworthy.

But all I read was that a guy unlawfully discharged a weapon in a metro area, and was arrested for it. Happens everyday in major American cities/metro areas.

I guess I don't "get it". Why is this newsworthy? Just because it unnecessarily has "AK" in the headline?
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:00:38 AM EDT
Thats the only reason why this story made the headlines is because the guy used an AK...

Its just one more bit of info to help the anti-gunners fuel their plans for another attempt at an Assualt Weapons Ban....

Next time they bring it up, this incident will surely be mentioned about how he used an "AUTOMATIC" Assault rifle in a crime, even though I dont think he had done anything wrong except I agree with a previous poster in that you shouldnt fire a warning shot....if you are going to pull a firearm, whatever kind it is, you better be prepared to use it for what its intended for, because if you feel it needed to brandish/display a firearm, you must seriously think your life, property, or family is in grave danger of harm or worse, so better be ready to shoot more than grass
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:51:41 AM EDT
Hey Susie, he didn't get arrested for using an AK.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 11:05:26 AM EDT
Originally Posted By FS2000GUY:
Thats the only reason why this story made the headlines is because the guy used an AK...

Its just one more bit of info to help the anti-gunners fuel their plans for another attempt at an Assualt Weapons Ban....

Next time they bring it up, this incident will surely be mentioned about how he used an "AUTOMATIC" Assault rifle in a crime, even though I dont think he had done anything wrong except I agree with a previous poster in that you shouldnt fire a warning shot....if you are going to pull a firearm, whatever kind it is, you better be prepared to use it for what its intended for, because if you feel it needed to brandish/display a firearm, you must seriously think your life, property, or family is in grave danger of harm or worse, so better be ready to shoot more than grass


He was using the proper SOP for escalation of force, in the army you display the weapon, then fire a warning shot, and finally neutralize the enemy threat.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 11:53:24 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Stizout:
Originally Posted By FS2000GUY:
Thats the only reason why this story made the headlines is because the guy used an AK...

Its just one more bit of info to help the anti-gunners fuel their plans for another attempt at an Assualt Weapons Ban....

Next time they bring it up, this incident will surely be mentioned about how he used an "AUTOMATIC" Assault rifle in a crime, even though I dont think he had done anything wrong except I agree with a previous poster in that you shouldnt fire a warning shot....if you are going to pull a firearm, whatever kind it is, you better be prepared to use it for what its intended for, because if you feel it needed to brandish/display a firearm, you must seriously think your life, property, or family is in grave danger of harm or worse, so better be ready to shoot more than grass


He was using the proper SOP for escalation of force, in the army you display the weapon, then fire a warning shot, and finally neutralize the enemy threat.


In a military engagement that maybe SOP, in a US Police force situation, i dont know of any SOPs that have been written for a warning shot. When trying civilians for actions with firearms the prosecutors always look to how the local police would have handled a situation to decide whether or not to press charges.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 12:03:45 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 12:31:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Stizout:

He was using the proper SOP for escalation of force, in the army you display the weapon, then fire a warning shot, and finally neutralize the enemy threat.



There are states and municipalities where warning shots are flat out illegal.

Nice try though.

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 1:38:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Originally Posted By Stizout:

He was using the proper SOP for escalation of force, in the army you display the weapon, then fire a warning shot, and finally neutralize the enemy threat.



There are states and municipalities where warning shots are flat out illegal.

Nice try though.



He was nice considering. If I had 20 gang members in my front yard threatening to kill me and my family there would be no warning shots.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 3:08:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 3:18:18 PM EDT by CopM4]

Warning shots are for TV .......

............ Move to Texas.
We know how to deal with people like them
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 3:14:20 PM EDT
In NY, there are no warning shots in an urban setting since you own the bullet once it leaves the barrel and have no control over what it hits or does.. NY is not that keen on guns in the first place, so they set the threshold pretty high for passing the sniff-test for the use of deadly physical force.

You start with verbal warnings and commands and the standard 911 call.. You fire your weapon center-of-mass ONLY if you fear for your life, or the life of another, to prevent death or serious physical injury resulting from the actions (including arson) of another or a third party...

You have to remember the key word here: FEAR. The key phrase: PREVENT DEATH OR SERIOUS PHYSICAL INJURY INCL. ARSON. The key numbers:911.

As the situation is unfolding, make every effort to dial 911 if possible and if you DO discharge the weapon, be ready to sell the story to the DA and 12 other people who are in that jury box. Oh, yeah... get a great lawyer.. you will need it.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 5:43:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CopM4:

Warning shots are for TV .......

............ Move to Texas.
We know how to deal with people like them



NY needs to take the Texas POV

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:20:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FS2000GUY:
Originally Posted By Stizout:
Originally Posted By FS2000GUY:
Thats the only reason why this story made the headlines is because the guy used an AK...

Its just one more bit of info to help the anti-gunners fuel their plans for another attempt at an Assualt Weapons Ban....

Next time they bring it up, this incident will surely be mentioned about how he used an "AUTOMATIC" Assault rifle in a crime, even though I dont think he had done anything wrong except I agree with a previous poster in that you shouldnt fire a warning shot....if you are going to pull a firearm, whatever kind it is, you better be prepared to use it for what its intended for, because if you feel it needed to brandish/display a firearm, you must seriously think your life, property, or family is in grave danger of harm or worse, so better be ready to shoot more than grass


He was using the proper SOP for escalation of force, in the army you display the weapon, then fire a warning shot, and finally neutralize the enemy threat.


In a military engagement that maybe SOP, in a US Police force situation, i dont know of any SOPs that have been written for a warning shot. When trying civilians for actions with firearms the prosecutors always look to how the local police would have handled a situation to decide whether or not to press charges.


I wasn't Army; I started life in the Marines, and then went Air Force. But I have never, ever, in my entire military career, ever in a single instance heard of anyone being told that the first response is a warning shot. If that is true, it is pure, unadulterated bullshit; if you pull the trigger, it had better be aimed center mass. I highly doubt that my Army brothers and sisters are being tought this.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:29:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dskeet:


Eh... a lot of people never look at the total cluster that is the GD forum.


So let's move this one to the GD too.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 6:31:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 6:31:42 PM EDT by dalesimpson]
This seems like more of a GD discussion than an AK technical discussion to me.
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