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Posted: 1/14/2006 5:53:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 4:29:08 PM EDT by millsusaf]
My friend and I were working on a set of twins today. One of the girls didn't want to get undressed, and I think we bent her block.

Now in English.

One of the builds didn't want to give up it's barrel pin. In the process of bending a couple of punches, 2 sockets and a lot of cussing I think we bent the rear sight base. I tried to convince it to straighten out but so far it hasn't worked. Any suggestions? Would we be better of getting a new rear sight base? Thanks



Edited: for correct parts description

edited : see below

Link Posted: 1/14/2006 7:03:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/14/2006 7:16:04 PM EDT by Morning_Wood]
Just looks tilted to me. Could be tilted on the barrel or whole barrel could be turned, you'll have to be the judge of that, but it should be easy enough to fix, just knock out the RSB pin first

BTW, thats the rear sight base, not the gas block. Unless you are talking about the gas block, but I don't know why you would be beating on that. Also note that canted front sight bases are a common issue in certain romy guns coming from the factory.
Link Posted: 1/14/2006 7:51:09 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Morning_Wood:
Just looks tilted to me. Could be tilted on the barrel or whole barrel could be turned, you'll have to be the judge of that, but it should be easy enough to fix, just knock out the RSB pin first

BTW, thats the rear sight base, not the gas block. Unless you are talking about the gas block, but I don't know why you would be beating on that. Also note that canted front sight bases are a common issue in certain romy guns coming from the factory.



I certainly hope the barrel isn't turned, after breaking all that crap; we still don't have the barrel pin out.

You are completely correct, I stand corrected, it is the rear sight base. Does the RSB pin push out left to right?

Link Posted: 1/15/2006 4:27:57 AM EDT
its bent
it will cause you nothan but probs from now on
replace it

as for the barrel pin drill it
its not worth your time or effort
you can buy a new 1 for 4 bucks prolly about 1/4 the price of the tools you killed trying to get it out HA HA !!!

so if you add that up
$20 ruined tools
$40 in time spent $10 hour X 2 people for lets say 2 hours
$15 rear site base
time to replace rear site base ahh hell i think you get the idea

drill out the pin with a bit about 2/3 pin size
NO PILOT HOLE
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 4:31:13 AM EDT
What process were you using to remove the barrel pin? Hammer,vise,press? I have pressed 3 out with a press; 2 came out hard with a bang; the other came out REALLY hard with a LOUD bang! Once that pin lets go it's smooth sailing from there.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 4:37:38 AM EDT
btw just thought i would add
i wasnt being a smartass well mayb alittle
but ive always said we learn best from our mistakes

and ive personally done this oshit so i know how ya feel
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 6:37:42 AM EDT
andyrv672wl

We tried a vise with a big hammer and beating the crap out of it. When that didn't work we laid it on the concrete (with wood under it) and beat the crap out of it again. When that didn't work we put it in the 12 press, which is when we started messing up tools.

socandyman

You are completely correct. A new RSB and barrel pin is in order. With the combined time we spent on it we could have bought 2 more parts kits. After the first 45 minutes it was a challenge. hahaha
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 9:16:24 AM EDT
Did you try an air hammer? First soak it in penetrating oil overnight.
I do mine with an air hammer, comes right out.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 10:04:40 AM EDT
I haven't tried an air hammer yet, but I just bent a grade 8 bolt.



I see a drill bit in the future of this one.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 11:35:20 AM EDT
I was havnig problem like this until I bought some PB blast. I just sprayed it down and let it sit overnight.
This was my first barrel pin removal but I worked on it for two days and I was convinced it wasn't moving. I managed to get it moving by putting the whoile setup in a vise and tightening it with a steel bar. I broke the vise, but the pin moved. Since you have a press, I didn't. I would lube that thing up and let it ist. Trust me..it will work. I broke two vises and bent three punches before I did this.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 1:57:12 PM EDT
PB Blast is your friend.....

In fact I have a polish barrel sitting in a cup of PB Blast as we speak..planning to pop her tomorrow on lunch.
Link Posted: 1/15/2006 5:55:42 PM EDT
millsusaf: I live near Spartanburg; I would be happy to help you get that pin out; email me at Andyrv6av8r@wmconnect.com
Link Posted: 1/16/2006 10:47:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Blueclawz:
PB Blast is your friend.....

In fact I have a polish barrel sitting in a cup of PB Blast as we speak..planning to pop her tomorrow on lunch.



After bending and breaking some more tools this morning we went and got some PB Blast.

How long can you leave a stubborn part in that stuff? I won't have time to work on it until next weekend and don't want to come back to it and find everything eaten away.
Link Posted: 1/16/2006 11:46:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/16/2006 11:52:40 AM EDT by HUNGARYAN]
PB blaster, not a problem, leave the parts in as long as you wish.

It is not going to dissolve your parts, however it is an extremely good penetrant.

Sometimes I even use it when I am cleaning something funky, for instance my "new to me" Yugo sks.

One thing though,

PB is great stuff for stuck (as in rusted) components, but if a pin is in a serious interference fit situation, I seriously doubt that any amount of penetrating type composition will help you out.

Like Socandyman says, drill it out.

Link Posted: 1/16/2006 1:34:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/16/2006 2:46:37 PM EDT by millsusaf]

Originally Posted By HUNGARYAN:
PB blaster, not a problem, leave the parts in as long as you wish.

It is not going to dissolve your parts, however it is an extremely good penetrant.

Sometimes I even use it when I am cleaning something funky, for instance my "new to me" Yugo sks.

One thing though,

PB is great stuff for stuck (as in rusted) components, but if a pin is in a serious interference fit situation, I seriously doubt that any amount of penetrating type composition will help you out.

Like Socandyman says, drill it out.




Cool, then the other barrel pin (in my parts kit) should just slide right out (hopefully).

After this morning, I am releasing all ownership of this "problem". Today I only worked on making jigs and laughing at my poor friend while he struggled. There was nothing I could do any better than he was trying to do and since he wouldn't listen to me to leave it alone and put it in the JB Blast, I gave up.

My friend tried to drill out the "problem" barrel pin today. I think he broke 4 or 5 titanium drill bits trying to drill it out. Every time he would get close, he would break one. Then he tried to flip it over and meet the hole on the other side. Naturally that never worked. It was a mess.

If the PB Blast doesn't help "release" this pin, I think our only other option is to mill it out. There are at least one piece of a drill bit in there and a part of a punch that he broke off. The barrel is brand new (at least it had the paper spiral down it), and I hate to just trash it. But then again he has already destroyed enough tools to equal the cost of a replacement barrel.

What a day!

Does anyone know if I can use my harbor freight drill press with a mill bit to mill out all the crap in that hole? I think I read one time that it wouldn't work very well, but I am not sure. Thanks

Link Posted: 1/17/2006 5:25:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mcook76:
I was havnig problem like this until I bought some PB blast. I just sprayed it down and let it sit overnight.
This was my first barrel pin removal but I worked on it for two days and I was convinced it wasn't moving. I managed to get it moving by putting the whoile setup in a vise and tightening it with a steel bar. I broke the vise, but the pin moved. Since you have a press, I didn't. I would lube that thing up and let it ist. Trust me..it will work. I broke two vises and bent three punches before I did this.



Fact is , you can promise all you want but their are romy barrel pins out there that will not come out with out drilling them out. I had one kit like that ....I tried a vise, an air hammer , and a press all to no avail and the pin was soaked in kroil.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 4:42:49 PM EDT
Update for those who care: After soaking the second kit in PB penetrator for almost 2 weeks, the barrel pin still would not come out in the press.

My friend is conveniently in Hawaii for "work", so I get left to deal with this crap while he drinks girly drinks on the beach. LOSER!

I tried to drill it out, but the drill bits/punches he lodged in there just ate up my bit like nothing.

So I decided to cut the front trunnion and rear site base off. Naturally I didn't get any arguments from him since he wasn't there.

It took me less than 20 minutes to cut off both. I wish we would have done that a long time ago!

Here is what is left.



Link Posted: 1/27/2006 4:49:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 4:51:31 PM EDT by millsusaf]
After soaking the third kit in PB pentrator for almost 2 weeks also, the barrel pin would not come out it either. I bent 2 grade 8 bolts trying to get it out.

Screw it!

So I decided to drill it out. Unfortunately I didn't have it as square as I thought I did. Upon flipping the barrel over I found this . . . .



Can this front trunnion be saved, or should I just buy another and cut my losses?

AK's are a pain in the ass! I like them but give me a AR to build any day of the week. I can only hope it gets better from here, I sure can't imagine it getting much worse.


Oh, and thanks for the advise about the air hammer. That made taking the rivets out much quicker.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 5:18:40 PM EDT
Well, I would have found a place that does EDM work and I would have taken it to them to remove the pin. It beats havin to get another trunnion and doin the headspace game.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 6:15:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bryan666999:
Well, I would have found a place that does EDM work and I would have taken it to them to remove the pin. It beats havin to get another trunnion and doin the headspace game.



EDM, what is this?
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 6:42:42 PM EDT
the trunnion is junk
you need a new 1
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 8:26:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By socandyman:
the trunnion is junk
you need a new 1



I fully plan to headspace these, but how will a new front trunnion effect my headspace? Since a lot has already gone wrong, what will go wrong with putting a new front trunnion on? Thanks
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 8:29:04 PM EDT
prolly nothang
most headspace fine when you change out parts
but you do need to check
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 8:42:04 PM EDT
I have been looking around, and front trunnions are more than I thought they were. I haven't found anywhere that has them for less than $50. Is there somewhere I am missing?

For that I might as well get another parts kit.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 9:08:22 AM EDT
what the hell did you do?didn't you try to heat the trunnion a little bit under pressure? good luck with that build! R1150R
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 10:53:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2006 10:57:32 AM EDT by millsusaf]

Originally Posted By R1150R:
what the hell did you do?didn't you try to heat the trunnion a little bit under pressure? good luck with that build! R1150R



My friend and I had three goals when we started this project . . . . . . well four actually.

#1 - We wanted to see how difficult we could make it.
#2 - We wanted to see how many tools we could ruin.
#3 - We wanted to spend the most amount of money for what is supposed to be a "cheap build".

And the fourth goal which was very distant in our minds:

Was to actually build three functioning rifles.

Except for the fourth goal (which if you recall isn't really that important) I think we have done a fantastic job meeting or exceeding all of our other goals.




Edited to add: Heat . . . huh, never thought about that. Oh well there is always next time.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 11:51:52 AM EDT
i think if i was you
and a trunnion is 50 bucks i would part out the kit
and buy a new 1 :)
you will get most your cash back and then you can start over fresh
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