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Posted: 2/1/2006 8:42:01 AM EDT
I just picked up a Stag Arms lower and cannot seem to remove the front pivot pin. I can push it slightly back and forth with finger pressure and have tried a hammer, although not very forcefully. Should I just hit it harder? Since the end is flat, I worry about marring the receiver.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:13:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 10:14:05 AM EDT by caneau]
Is this with the upper on or off? If your upper is still on, try moving it around while applying pressure on the pin. If it's off, a rubber mallet or a plastic punch (ADCO sells them) might be the way to go. Also, you can use a metal punch if you put a shop cloth or two between the punch and your lower to protect it from getting scratched up.
A blast of CLP or a few drops of a good lubricant also might help. If your upper is not on, what's probably happening is that either your front takedown detent spring is too strong, the detent is out of spec, or the detent hole in your takedown pin is drilled too deep.

Hope this helps. If unsuccessful, post back and we'll go from there.

ETA: Make sure your takedown pin is alligned in the lower too. Mine has a nasty habit of rotating and getting stuck.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:52:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 11:02:03 AM EDT by Dano523]


To drift the pivot over to remove the upper without mar'g the surface of the pin, I use a golf tee as the punch. The tee tip will blow up long before any damage is done if the pivot is seized in place.

As for completely removing the pivot from the receiver, Don't!!!!!! The detent is spring loaded, and will be lost into orbit as soon as the pivot pin clears the receiver. But if you just must, pull the pivot pin as far as it will glide, then use a 1/32 punch to press in on the detent (threw the small hole in the pivot), as you pull out the pin.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:02:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 11:30:24 AM EDT by flesheatingvirus]
I haven't even bought the upper yet. I had the idea for the plastic punch, but it did not end up well. (note to self, pens are not strong enough for punchesheA golf tee? Hmm...I live right next to a golf course. That sounds like a good idea. I can see from the schematics that it is not desirable to completely pull out the pivot pin, since it is enough of a bitch to get back in that a special tool is highly recommended for the detent. I just want it off enough to get the upper on when I get it. Off course, the rear pin comes right out with a bit of finger pressure.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:10:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 1:10:36 PM EDT by Dano523]
The small hole is a weep hole, some receivers have them, while others do not. If you have one, then you can use it for a lube point.

A chop stick will work as well for a punch. The idea is you just want something that will not leave a mark if you have to use a hammer to walk the pivot pin over get the upper off the rifle. In time, the detent pin tip will wear, and you won't need to use so much force to get the pivot pin into the open position.


As for the rear pin, the detent and the spring are retained by the butt stock, carbine plate, and if it will easily push open, you may want to check the detent/spring to make sure that they have been installed/correctly positioned.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:50:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dano523:
www.ar15.com/content/guides/assembly/lower/pivotPin.gif

To drift the pivot over to remove the upper without mar'g the surface of the pin, I use a golf tee as the punch. The tee tip will blow up long before any damage is done if the pivot is seized in place.

As for completely removing the pivot from the receiver, Don't!!!!!! The detent is spring loaded, and will be lost into orbit as soon as the pivot pin clears the receiver. But if you just must, pull the pivot pin as far as it will glide, then use a 1/32 punch to press in on the detent (threw the small hole in the pivot), as you pull out the pin.




Actually, you probably do need to remove the detent and spring from the reciever, and there's a really easy way to do it. Just remove the pin with the reciever in a plastic bag (those gallon Zip Lock bags work great).
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 7:57:59 AM EDT
I use a curved dental pic to get to the detent pin.



It's shaped like the 4th one from the left.

Pull the pivot pin till the detent locks into place, then work the tip of the pick to the top of the pin and push down.
A little nudge of the pivot pin will put it past the detent pit stop.

A hammer to remove the pivot pin?
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 10:41:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 11:12:25 AM EDT by flesheatingvirus]
Ok, new development. After trying numerous methods to try to get the damn front pivot pin out, I used a hammer and punch. It worked. Unfortunately, the detent was secured enough on the pivot pin to BEND with the pin as it was pushed out. So now, the pin will go in and out enough to get the upper on, and still 'locks' into place, but will not lay flush as it did before. (The upper is off btw) So as you can see, I'm having a great day so far (and I haven't even shot the freakin thing yet). Should I just punch out the pin the rest of the way, then replace the detent, spring, and/or pin? With this, I worry about the f'd up detent pin screwing up its hole in the receiver as it is forced up and out. Or should I just cut the damn pivot pin right through the middle with a cutting disc, remove, and replace? I've already ordered Bushy's Lost Parts kit, as well as a new front pivot pin. I think the detent hole may be a bit too deep on this pin.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:58:08 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 6:22:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 6:30:32 PM EDT by flesheatingvirus]
The detent pin is bent too far out of the hole to press it back down into the receiver. I'm actually suprised that the detent pin has not been forced all of the way out. BTW, the detent began to bend out of the channel BEFORE the pivot pin was all the way opened, I did not try to just punch out the pivot pin all the way. This is why I believe the detent hole in the pivot was too deep.

I do have a drill bit small enough to go through that hole in the pivot pin though. I can very carefully try to drill out most of the bent detent pin. Once I get through it, I should be able to remove the pivot pin and just replace the whole setup.

The only alternative I can think of is to hit the crap out of it with the punch to force out the detent pin with the pivot pin. I do not think that is a good idea, since I don't want to replace my new lower just because I screw up one detent channel.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 7:14:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 7:15:19 PM EDT by Dano523]
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 7:22:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 7:23:10 PM EDT by Triple_D]

Originally Posted By flesheatingvirus:
Or should I just cut the damn pivot pin right through the middle with a cutting disc, remove, and replace?



This is might be your best option now. But what ever you do, STOP hitting the damn thing with a punch and hammer.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 7:25:16 PM EDT
A hammer? You're doing it all wrong. That's not nearly hardcore enough.

You need this.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 3:16:19 AM EDT
YIKES!
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 3:51:03 AM EDT
No such luck on the dealer gunsmith. I will have to look around town. Geez guys, you act like I'm beating on the receiver like a kid in puberty. I only tried that once, unfortunately that is all it took. At least I can say I learned something.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 5:29:59 AM EDT

Originally Posted By flesheatingvirus:
No such luck on the dealer gunsmith. I will have to look around town. Geez guys, you act like I'm beating on the receiver like a kid in puberty. I only tried that once, unfortunately that is all it took. At least I can say I learned something.





Good one, man. We're just yanking you.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 9:21:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/9/2006 9:26:32 AM EDT by flesheatingvirus]
Hell with it. I'm cutting the head of the pivot pin off as soon as my replacements arrive. I'll tape up the receiver to prevet scratches and grap my drill and disc. Fun fun.
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