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Posted: 9/4/2010 4:34:01 PM EDT
I am just about to pull the trigger on a lower parts kit and I got thinking about the types of pins.Which companies use spiral pins and which use slotted? Is there any that do use spiral? Spiral pins look like a long strip of metal rolled into a pin, Slotted look like 1 piece rolled with a gap that when pushed into a hole, the tension on the pin keeps it in. I know that spiral pins are "supposed" to be better for shock. Does anyone know?
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 4:39:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 4:41:40 PM EDT by Mccray]
The RRA LPK uses coiled roll pins and they are easier to install. It is an excelent quality LPK also
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 5:15:51 PM EDT
The CMT (stag) LPKs I have used came with roll pins. I used a couple from CMMG that had the split pins. I don`t know who they get their parts from. Do yourself a big favor and get one with the roll pins, in my experience they are a dream to get in compared to the split pins.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 5:23:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 5:29:22 PM EDT by maleante]
Armalite also sells LPK's with spiral pins. I have used multiple LPK's from both and I prefer the Armalite over RRA for 3 reasons.

1. Armalite uses a different style bolt catch which also has a square back (not beveled as is the case with most LPK's) and the front of it is all on the same plane.

2. Armalite packs their kits in a sealed plastic container which has a security sticker on it (no one can sell you a mystery LPK from Armalite on the EE or elsewhere).

3. Armalite has EXCELLENT customer service. I have had 2 issues with parts and they sent out free replacements the moment I called.




ETA: Not that anyone is going to spend $200 on a Colt LPK or that it really matters... but Colt uses the "slotted" style roll pin.


The only benefit I have found in using the spiral rollpins is that they are twice as easy to install on a build.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 5:51:43 PM EDT
Funny you should mention the Armalite, it's between them and DD that I'm looking at.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 6:04:45 PM EDT


The only benefit I have found in using the spiral rollpins is that they are twice as easy to install on a build.


Only???

To me that is plenty of reason to require them.

But then again we'd miss out on all the nifty, "What do I do? I broke off a trigger pin ear." threads.

I've never had that issue myself but there are plenty here who have.





Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:30:56 PM EDT
You should always use a piece of wood to support the ears at the very least.. I have only built 3 Ar,s but just to break one is more than the cost of the brownells plastic support puck.... Now your going to have to get it TIG welded and sand and refinish.......
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:36:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jdoming728:
You should always use a piece of wood to support the ears at the very least.. I have only built 3 Ar,s but just to break one is more than the cost of the brownells plastic support puck.... Now your going to have to get it TIG welded and sand and refinish.......


WTF is a "Trigger pin ear"?
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:38:45 PM EDT
How can you tell the diff between pins? I don't think I've ever seen a spiral pin.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 7:43:06 PM EDT
A standard roll pin just has two ends that roll over and butt together. A spiral roll pin is just what it sounds like, it's rolled up, like you would roll up a newspaper.

RRA is the only LPK that I've used that came with spiral roll pins. Went together WAY easier than standard roll pins. Still, not worth the extra $25ish per kit, IMHO.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 8:00:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raygixxer89:
How can you tell the diff between pins? I don't think I've ever seen a spiral pin.






Spiral roll-pins are much stronger than the "spring" type roll-pins. And all Cub Cadet driveshafts require the spiral roll-pins.

http://gardentractorpullingtips.com/clutch.htm


Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:02:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jdoming728: Now your going to have to get it TIG welded and sand and refinish.......


and that will cost you more then replacing it. never knew about the spiral pins. My Armalite rifle came with sloted roll pins.
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:24:54 PM EDT
Aaahhh. Cool. Now I get it. Thanks guys.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 6:23:07 AM EDT
I've been assembling my DD LPK (slotted pins), and hit a big stop trying to get the $%@#* trigger guard pin.

I buggered it up pretty good (fortunately not damaging the receiver), so I removed it and ordered a new coiled pin from RRA. It was $1.33 shipped.

William
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:00:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By weconway:
I've been assembling my DD LPK (slotted pins), and hit a big stop trying to get the $%@#* trigger guard pin.

I buggered it up pretty good (fortunately not damaging the receiver), so I removed it and ordered a new coiled pin from RRA. It was $1.33 shipped.

William


IN the future you might have more success lubing it up and using vice grips with tape wrapped around the ends.. There is a tutorial posted here on the topic. It is much easier and more foolproof than hammering them in.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:05:00 AM EDT
I've had to crush the slotted pins a few times with a pliers or vice to get them to work. If it doesn't go in don't keep pounding, you need to fix the problem
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:49:47 AM EDT
Well, it looks like only RRA uses Spiral (roll, coiled and a million other names) pins.

Colt, CMT, Stag, CMMG use Slotted (split, channel, and the other million) pins

Armalite can go either way. One said spiral, one said slotted. I sent Armalite a email last night to ask about what type is in their LPK. We'll see.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:07:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Mccray:IN the future you might have more success lubing it up and using vice grips with tape wrapped around the ends.. There is a tutorial posted here on the topic. It is much easier and more foolproof than hammering them in.


That is my plan. Despite reading the "lower building" thread 20 times, I missed the notes about lubing the pin and crimping it a little smaller. My fault for not having a frame of reference on how hard the pin should be to install.

The good news is that the bolt release pin went in like a dream. In any case, I'm sure the coiled pins will be much easier to press in (which is a VERY good way to do it).

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 12:17:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By weconway:
Originally Posted By Mccray:IN the future you might have more success lubing it up and using vice grips with tape wrapped around the ends.. There is a tutorial posted here on the topic. It is much easier and more foolproof than hammering them in.


That is my plan. Despite reading the "lower building" thread 20 times, I missed the notes about lubing the pin and crimping it a little smaller. My fault for not having a frame of reference on how hard the pin should be to install.

The good news is that the bolt release pin went in like a dream. In any case, I'm sure the coiled pins will be much easier to press in (which is a VERY good way to do it).



If you use the vice grip method just make sure you have the trigger guard in place before you start clamping the pin in.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 3:48:22 PM EDT
I have just crimped the DPMS roll pins a little with channel locks and tapped them in with light weight oil, no problem in the last 5 builds with CMMG/DPMS LPKs.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 7:26:11 PM EDT
I got slot pins in the DPMS/Stag kit I ordered, and used the vice grip method. It went quick and easy, and I didn't feel like I was tempting fate.

There is a difference in longevity, the roll split pins are thicker and suffer from rust less. The spring roll pins will flake layers off until they are unserviceable. The thin layers hold moisture and that promotes corrosion. Keeping them oiled is more important to prevent it. It's not likely something any of us would see in ten years, but something I have seen working on older cars 25 years+. Of course, they get left out in the rain and snow all winter. AR's not so much.

There's the next Tier One premium product, stainless spring roll pins for just $39.95!
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 8:07:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/9/2010 7:13:37 PM EDT by devinsdad]
Armalite did write me back. Their bolt release and trigger guard pins are spiral type. I decided to go with the Armalite kit. The bolt release and roll pins made up my mind. I really don't doubt that any LPK will work fine and I wouldn't notice any difference between all of them. Armalite just just has a couple extra bene's that the others don't have
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 10:53:26 AM EDT
Must be a new thing from RRA, cause all the LPK I have bought are from RRA & have never seen the coil pins, they've all been the standard roll pins. The coil pins would not be good for the rifles I build anyway.
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