Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Posted: 11/9/2003 9:44:19 AM EDT
Here’s the scoop… I’m looking to build a new AR for plinking, target shooting and just a general fun gun. I already have a SHTF AR. That being said, I would like this gun to be reasonably capable as a SHTF gun if the need should arise.

I’m looking to build a fairly standard 16” carbine with a fairly stock appearance. This will be my first build and would like to build the upper and lower. I want to keep the costs down but don’t want cheap components. I’m not opposed to a kit but I haven’t found one that meets all my requirements and desires.

Here’s what I have picked out so far…

Lower =
DPMS Forged receiver
RRA 2 Stage NM trigger
Standard A2 Stock
Standard A2 grip
Question – For the rest of the lower parts, is anybody’s kits better than anybody else’s? Is there one I should look for or one I should stay away from?

Upper =
DPMS A3 upper (I assume matching the upper and lower forgings is the best way to get a good fit\perfect color match?)
Chrome bolt carrier group (is one really any better than another here?)
Upper parts kit (again, anyone better than another?)
Barrel - ? I know I want 16” length. I know I want a 1/8 twist. As it will be a post ban config, I would rather have a target crown end as opposed to a muzzle break or fake flash hider. (I’ll have it turned after the AWB expires and have phantom mounted then)

But…
Standard heavy barrel contour or M4 profile?
Fluted or not? (does flutting save a considerable amount of weight?)
Chrome lined, phosphorus coated or Stainless Steel? (Slightly worried about a shiny SS barrel in a SHTF senerio?)
If steel, is the 4150 that much better than 4140?
Which barrel manufactures should I look for? Which should I avoid?
Standard CAR handguard or M4? (Can and M4 handguard be used on a non M4 profile barrel?)

Sights =
Switch between detach handle open and scope with quick detach mount.

Sorry to be so long winded but I will greatly appreciate any and all input you guys can give me. Thanks!
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 11:32:51 AM EDT
Question – For the rest of the lower parts, is anybody’s kits better than anybody else’s? Is there one I should look for or one I should stay away from?
View Quote
Bushmaster's lower parts are probably the best you're going to find.On the other hand, I have used 2 DPMS lower parts and they are very well made.It might make sense since you have a DPMS lower.You might even go with DPMS upper parts kit as well. If you're trying to keep costs down, you might want to stick with a non-chromed bolt carrier.Not sure what advantage it would have and decent made carriers seem to be pricey. If you're looking for 1/8 twist, you may be limited in what length/style barrel you can get.
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 11:48:12 AM EDT
You should check out Legal Transfers site in the industry forum. The RRA stuff is quality and his prices are about the same as DPMS. Also, check around for a good price on the lower. I got mine from Eagle arms for 85.00. And just ordered a lower parts kit and stock from Pete. Its nice to be able to do a little at a time to keep cost down. Have fun.
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 12:14:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/9/2003 12:19:44 PM EDT by Minuteman419]
My last 2 Bushy Barrels have been excellent, look at them real close when comparing. Lowers: Eagle Arms, MEGA and Stinger have served me well as have Armalites and RRA's lower parts kits. HTH EDIT: Don't forget the Enhanced RRA Bolt Assy. Danny
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 2:27:09 PM EDT
As far as the lower receiver goes. They all seem to range between $85-$120 which for me isn't a big enough difference to choose one over the other. I thought about a RRA unit, particularly one of the "US Property" marked units from Pete but I always hear about how tight they are. I know a lot of people consider that a +. For me that says they are not 100% spec. If they were, they would fit similar to all the rest that are. If I recall correctly, it has been said they are designed that way on purpose. They may be so but I"m still not comfortable with them.
EDIT: Don't forget the Enhanced RRA Bolt Assy.
View Quote
- can you give me more info about this and\or the +\-'s of other bolt assemblies? Thanks!
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 3:16:51 PM EDT
: I would go Eagle Arms lower before anyone else, perfect finish and fit. I think colt and BM are alot more pricey. If the ban sunsets I'm going to buy 10 EA lowers that day and build them that night. DPMS stuff is more cash than RRA from legal transfers or eagle firearms, I'd go with almost all RRA parts except the lower - I'm not kicking RRA lowers, it's just the EA lower worked so well for me. I would call pete at legal transfers, he's a great dealer and he'll give you his .02 on your project.
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 3:42:17 PM EDT
This is what I was planning to get for the lower... [img]http://www.cmmginc.com/cmmg_images/tbl_images/Receivers%20Firearms/DPMS_Lower_Half.jpg [/img] CMMG sells it as a complete kit for 224.95. I would replace the trigger with a RRA NM 2stage unit at some later point. My other reason for buying there is they have an upper that I want for another gun. CMMG seems to have a good reputation around here? Just so I'm clear, Are you guys recomending I buy an EA lower over a DPMS unit because the DPMS is some how inferior to the EA or is it simply because the EA is cheaper? I would really love to hear some more about my barrel\upper questions as this is were I'm really confused! Thanks again
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 6:40:29 PM EDT
I also went with RRA. I got my RRA stripped lower from Sableco, but Eagle Firearms has them for $80. Finish on mine was great, rollmarks are crisp. I got a RRA lower parts kit and CAR stock from ADCO. Parts kit was also of high quality as was the stock. Steve @ ADCO has been very helpful with all my questions, and is going to custom build my upper, when I get the dough! Also according to RRA all their current bolts are the new enhanced version.
Originally posted by Pete @ Legal Transfers: The Semi Carrier Now has more meat around the Firing pin area. Like the M-16 Carrier Rock River and Les Baer are both doing this now on the Semi Auto Groups Colt has been doing this but shaves off the rear of the carrier all the way back like a half moon Both Les Baer and Rock River semi carriers are still full circle at rear of carrier to semi auto specs. I will get a Photo up Pete
View Quote
Hershey
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 8:24:07 PM EDT
I thought about a RRA unit, particularly one of the "US Property" marked units from Pete but I always hear about how tight they are[/qute] Not sure where you heard that or what that means but I have owned 2 RRA lowers that I built up and they have been 100% in spec.They mated perfectly with the BM and RRA uppers I installed on them.I've used DPMS parts but would prefer a RRA lower over one of theirs.The Eagle lowers are supposed to be pretty good as well.Someone in E&E has them for $80 or $85.You can't beat that for a forged receiver.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 3:14:29 AM EDT
There is no 1/8 chrome lined 16" barrel I know of. DPMS chromed bolts have been reported to have a problem breaking an the cam pin hole. I have heard of three seperate people who have had this occur. If I wanted a chrome bolt and carrier I would go with Either the Young Manufacturing/Les Baer unit (same thing) which is a totally different design on the carrier or have a Big 3 unit hard chromed myself. Personally I would buy a complete Colt Bolt and carrier from CDNN for $99. I would also shy away from DPMS and stick with more RRA parts. Fluting will shave a lot of weight but an M4 is lighter than a fluted HBAR and a hell of a lot cheaper too. 4150 is only better than 4140 in high temperature applications. In a semi auto for recreational use 4140 is fine. 4150 is better but its not going to be an issue unless you fire a LOT of ammo in a short period of time. Why the seperate scope and carry handle? Why not a folding BUIS and scope? You wont be wanting to use the irons much after you get used to the scope IMHO.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 3:33:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/10/2003 3:40:51 AM EDT by airgunner]
Thanks for the heads up on the carrier guys. Does sound like the RRA is the one to get.
There is no 1/8 chrome lined 16"
View Quote
Well I haven't been able to find one either but that don't mean much! :) I'm not totally hung on 1/8 but if I decide to spend the money on a SS barrel and I can get it on 1/8, that's the way I'll probably go. I'm sure a 1/9 twist chrome lined would be good enough for my purposes. Do I have to use an M4 profile barrel to use M4 hand guards? I'm still not clear why you guys are trying to steer me away from DPMS receivers? Is there something wrong with them? I have a couple of DPMS uppers and like them. I was thinking the best way to match the fit and finish would be to use the same brand lower?
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 3:39:48 AM EDT
Forgot to answer this one...
Why the seperate scope and carry handle? Why not a folding BUIS and scope? You wont be wanting to use the irons much after you get used to the scope IMHO.
View Quote
Just cause, I don't have one with the normal open sights and would like to but I know I won't like it enough to want to be stuck with a A2 upper. I figure at first, I'll just use the carry handle, later I'll add a scope and sell the carry handle if I hate it.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 4:10:16 AM EDT
DPMS has some out of spec uppers where the 1913 rails are not to spec. The fit and finish of pretty much every DPMS part I have seen or handled has been slightly sub par compared to RRA.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 6:06:04 AM EDT
If you wanted 1/8 to shoot the heavier bullets, why not get a 1/7 barrel? it will shoot 55g and the heavier target bullets.The M4 handguards will fit all 16" barrels.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 7:10:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Redbone: If you wanted 1/8 to shoot the heavier bullets, why not get a 1/7 barrel? it will shoot 55g and the heavier target bullets.The M4 handguards will fit all 16" barrels.
View Quote
Well like I said above, I'm not stuck on a 1/8 twist. My other gun does have a 1/7. This gun would probably be fine with a 1/9 as I doubt I'll use too much of the heavy stuff through this one but I just figured a 1/8 would be a nice compromise. Considering my choices are very limited in the 1/8, I'll probably go 1/9. So forgetting all of that, What barrel manufactures should I look for, whcih should I avoid?
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 8:43:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/10/2003 8:44:15 AM EDT by Wingman26]
I thought about a RRA unit, particularly one of the "US Property" marked units from Pete but I always hear about how tight they are. I know a lot of people consider that a +. For me that says they are not 100% spec. If they were, they would fit similar to all the rest that are.
View Quote
I just built a rifle using a RRA lower from Eagle Firearms, [b]everything fit perfectly.[/b]
Top Top