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Posted: 12/21/2005 3:21:09 PM EDT
I can't swing the money for a high end optic like the Trijicon ACOG, etc. for my 20" HBAR. It will mainly be a range/varmint rifle so a red dot sight isn't accurate enough. So,...
What kind of quality could I expect from a manufacturer like BSA or NcStar? I see them mentioned on other boards, especially on C&R milsurp rifles. I figure the low end scopes from those 2 are junk, but are the higher end any better? A "high end" BSA costs a lot less than a low or mid range Leupold, Nikon, etc.
Or should I just save my money and use the rion sights until I can afford better?

Please be tender.
Jim
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:26:08 PM EDT
Use the irons...
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:31:32 PM EDT
I have one NcStar scope, fixed 6x, that I bought for an SKS I have. I haven't tried it yet so I have no idea what to expect.
I do have a 4x Weaver and a 4x Redfield, but I want to put them on a couple of Mausers.
Thanks,
Jim
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:39:10 PM EDT
Use the irons.
Save the cash for the good glass.
You'll thank me later because you will be a great shot with irons, and you will have a quality optic.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:43:00 PM EDT
I figure the AR sights will be better then the small irons on a Mauser.
Are there affordable scopes that work on an AR? There's no chance of buying a $700.00 scope. I don't need a bdc, or illuminated reticle.
Suggestions?
Jim
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 4:05:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/21/2005 4:09:03 PM EDT by BigBore45]
You might want to try one of these. IMO very nice scope that won't break the bank.

Simmons prodiamond scope
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 4:09:52 PM EDT
I have a Nikon Prostaff 3x9 on an A4. I really am happy with it. 150 dollars, no problems,lots of dead pigs.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 4:15:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By arteacher:
I have a Nikon Prostaff 3x9 on an A4. I really am happy with it. 150 dollars, no problems,lots of dead pigs.



How is the eye relief?
$150.00 for a Nikon scope? That might work. Thanks,
Jim
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 4:38:02 PM EDT
3.6 inches of eye relief. Also very clear. I shoot pigs under a hoglight. 85 yard shots in the dark with a faint green nightlight shining on them.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:16:58 PM EDT
Save your cash and shoot irons, it'll make you a better shooter and get you a good quality scope the first time around...buy cheap...buy twice...you'll never be sorry
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 6:45:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/21/2005 6:45:39 PM EDT by ZootTX]
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 7:03:47 PM EDT
Thanks for the links to the scopes.
I have read on a FAQ that the eye relief for AR rifles is different from high power rifles and need a different scope.
My AR15 is a Colt A3 style flattop. I don't know how that affects the eye relief, but I don't have to mount the scope on the carry handle.
Jim
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 9:37:11 PM EDT
Pepperbelly,

Try this link: www.muelleroptics.com

Look through the site and go to the "reviews" section as well. Several of them deal with reviews specific to AR-15 varmint rifles, etc.

Hope it helps.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 12:25:54 AM EDT
I also have a Muller (4.5-16x) on my rifle. Works very well, if a bit big.

But that's a range gun. I don't really take it out in the rain, go hunting either.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 6:11:16 AM EDT
While saving up for a more high end scope, I do not think that you can really go wrong with a BSA a Mueller a Tasco or the like for that matter. With the AR's low recoil, they will hold a zero and will put you on target.

The only trade off you will have with these scopes IMO would be their durability. They are not as rugged as the high end ones.

Link Posted: 12/22/2005 10:00:22 AM EDT
Back in 86 I bought a Simmons 3x9x40 at wally world around 35 bucks

I put it on my Bolt action SAVAGE 222Rem and shot 1/4 inch groups at 100 yard

I bought a BUSHNELL AOS 3.5-10x42 Scopechief Fully Multicoated
And shot 1inch groups at 100 yards with a 20HBAR M193/M855

This is one of the Best CHEAP Scopes For the money!
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:27:09 PM EDT
I bought a Leupold FX-II 6x36 for $252.60 including shipping from outdoorsuperstore.com (sku 499372)

You know it's good, since it's a Leupold. It's a great price.

Not junk, also not an ACOG. Just something good for a good price.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:33:20 PM EDT
A good home for the low cost scope after you are done with it on the AR, is a 22LR (Ruger 10-22 etc.).

However, saying that, the last dozen scopes have been a mix of Leupold, Aimpoint and ACOGs .... all which like very well.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:41:43 PM EDT
I have a Simmons 3x9x40 on a Ruger 10/22. I have thought about putting that on my AR and replacing it with another low priced scope until I can afford a good scope.
I need something that will do until I either save up some more money or win the lottery.
Jim
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:49:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pepperbelly:
I figure the AR sights will be better then the small irons on a Mauser.
Are there affordable scopes that work on an AR? There's no chance of buying a $700.00 scope. I don't need a bdc, or illuminated reticle.
Suggestions?
Jim



+1 on using the irons and saving for quality glass. I'd go with an Aimpoint or EoTech, but I don't get many opportunity to shoot at things more than 100 yards away (and at those ranges the irons work fine). If you must have magnification then an ACOG w/BAC is the way to go.

You might take a look at the IOR Valdada M1 and M2. Street prices are between $300 and $400. IOR makes good glass for the money, but an M1 or M2 won't be an ACOG.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 3:57:41 PM EDT
I am not looking for a red dot sight. I plan on shooting at 100 yards or more and need magnification.
Jim
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 7:40:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/22/2005 7:41:35 PM EDT by Essayons]
I can shoot 1 to 1 1/2" groups with iron sights at 100 yards if I take my time. That's better than M192/Q3131A is supposed to shoot (2 MOA dispersion spec. IIRC), but IOR makes a good 4x24 power illuminated scope with a 30mm tube and an integral bullet drop compensator for under $400.

Link Posted: 12/31/2005 7:46:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/31/2005 7:49:03 PM EDT by realineman]
I picked up a Burris Fullfield II 3x9x40 awhile back for under $200 and it came with a free 10x50 spotting scope. The scope seems well built and I've used it alot for coyote and fox hunting on my RRA Varmint. www.riflescopes.com
Link Posted: 12/31/2005 7:52:37 PM EDT
Had an NcStar (had the red and green reticles), it was a piece of junk. Never held it zero.
Link Posted: 12/31/2005 8:39:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/31/2005 8:41:39 PM EDT by Onslaught]

Originally Posted By pepperbelly:
It will mainly be a range/varmint rifle so a red dot sight isn't accurate enough.


Just in case somebody missed that part the first time around.

There's LOTS in this world outside of Leupold/ACOG that works JUST fine if you're not betting your life on it. I just purchased a Mueller 4-16, and I've been looking through that glass for DAYS now wondering when it's going to "go dark" at 16x or when the image is going to fuzz out or the reticle is just going to fall over sideways. So far, it hasn't. That's $189 spent NOW, while I spend $800 on everything else I want to do to my rifle without having to use IRONS in the meantime... THEN I can worry about an $800 Leupold.

You can do better than BSA for sure. The biggest complaints I've read about them were the higher mag scopes. It's the lower mag ones that I see people happy with at the range.

Depending on your actual budget, your specific needs (what type of "varmints", how far away, what time of day or night) There are a few good scopes available for $150 - $300 that will do just fine.

I had an almighty ACOG. What I don't have is a NECK, so the eye relief was too short. Image was super bright and clear though. I also had a SuperSniper that was extremely bright, and I've looked through a Bushnell 10x tactical, and thought it was even better than the SuperSniper, and as good as the ACOG!. The Mueller is definitely more like watching TV compared to an ACOG being HDTV, but it's a really GOOD picture like a Sony instead of a Magnavox (Tasco)
Link Posted: 12/31/2005 9:11:41 PM EDT
I ordered a Simmons 6.5x20x40 from Cabelas. Of course Murphy's Law required that Natchezss would send an email flyer with their Simmons scopes about half price.
The only thing I wasn't wild about on the scope I ordered was the standard turrets. I haven't owned a scope with the target turrets but I think I would like to.
Of course the turrets may not make any real difference.
Jim
Link Posted: 1/1/2006 10:38:19 AM EDT
I have the Bushnell 3200 Elite 10x40 on my Bushmaster. It has the Firefly feature that lets you expose it to a flashlight to have the reticle glow for dawn/dusk situations.

They also have variable power scopes in this line.

Mine was 180ish about a year ago form a gun shop. I'd buy one again.
Link Posted: 1/1/2006 2:35:24 PM EDT
sightron 3-9 with mil-dot

Its an S1 so its their "bargin" model but I've been using one for a while and I think it is the best bang for your buck scope out there. Mil dots, good glass and there you go..........all for under 175
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