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Posted: 11/23/2003 10:07:29 AM EDT
I'm putzing in the basement and decided to put on an old 3-9 Redfield on my 10/22.

What is the best/most accurate way plumb/level/square the crosshares to the barrel ?

Thanks.......

( besides having it done professionally )
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 10:18:03 AM EDT
I have set up several accuracy rifles, and I have access to a scope leveler. Without that it is not too awfully hard. 1st find rest that is leveled and ensure the gun is level within the rest. 2nd attach scope so that it is snug enough to stay where you put it. 3rd point the leveled gun and scope at a vertical item (door jam, window pane) ensuring that it too is straight up and down. 4th from a decent distance so as to have both the item and cross-hairs in view match it accordingly. 5th when tightening the scope into the rings utilize an X pattern to ensure you are torquing it evenly. 6th check your scope again. At least this is one method of doing it. HTH.
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 12:28:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 4:36:55 PM EDT
you might want to check out this [url=http://www.riflescopelevel.com/vertical_retical_instrument.html]product[/url] from Long Shot Products. I got one for my Rem 700PSS when I mounted the scope and anti-cant level. The tool is well made from aluminum bar stock, pretty heavy duty, and easy to use. You'll be able to do as many scopes as you want and help your friends do theirs. Transaction went fine, shipped quick, etc. I have no desire for their electronic anti-cant device, but the tool is well made. I use a simple bubble-level anti cant. As a guide I recommend a plumbob or other weight on a string. Trust me the corners and doorjams in your house aren't straight! But that weighted string will be! Hope this helps. Hershey
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 4:58:22 PM EDT
I have a knack of being able to get it to within a half a nat's ass just with my eye balls. Closer then that isn't needed. Get the eye relief for the scope set first and then tighen the scope mount down a bit so twisting the thing is difficult. Then I rotate the crosshairs until they look right and then double check. Yeah, I know - the bullet drops according to gravity and if the crosshairs are 1/64" of in inch off I can't hit the broadside of the barn at 50 feet [rolleyes] it's a wonder I hit anything at all quite honestly!
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 6:11:40 PM EDT
GENTLEMEN, I thank you all very much for the info, and this will work great for my rifle !!! But......... While I'm asking... How does the REAL Operator/Sniper insure that his weapon is plumb/level ?? Barrels aren't square and neither are forearms, grips or stocks.... What is the " Medium " on a rifle for determining " plumb " ?? Thanks everyone...... ( I know, I know, too many questions.... )
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 6:17:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/23/2003 6:22:02 PM EDT by TNRonin]
The scope leveler I used mounts to the action via a rubber band and metal (square) bar. Attached to this is two paddles with lines. The paddles are certainly plum because the devices is laying on the flats of the action. Therefore it will most certainly NOT depend on the stock being out of wack. And when I talked about leveling the gun in my post, I was referring to leveling the action, not the stock. If you level the action, ALL of the physical adjustments to the scope will be correct. HTH. Edited to add link: http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=13069&title=SCOPE+RETICLE+LEVELER
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 6:29:22 PM EDT
As described in the book "The Ultinate Sniper", having the scope "slightly" canted to one side or the other is not "that" critical. It amounts to a fraction of an inch at many yards. But obviously, we want as close to perfect as possible. If you leveled your rifle (horizontal plane of the receiver top), and then alighned the crosshairs with a plumb, seems like you'd be there.. I always use the method mentioned in the above book. From behind the rifle, sight through the scope (we're talking from a couple feet away) and alighn the verticle crosshair with the verticle line that runs vertically through the recoil pad.... If you hold the rifle correctly, you will be able to see the center section of the crosshairs. At the same time, you'll be able to view the recoil pad of the stock from behind and line it up with the scope crosshairs...
Link Posted: 11/23/2003 6:31:25 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/24/2003 11:12:07 AM EDT
Gentlemen, I thank all of you for your time and great ideas........ I appreciate your help, Steve B.
Link Posted: 11/24/2003 1:54:47 PM EDT
I thought I would throw one more in here. If your using split rings, install them on the rifle. Put the rifle in a gun vise, and level the rifle across the bottom half of the rings, across your mounting rail, or any other flat spot. Clamp it down, and mount the scope. Remove the top adjustment cap on the scope, and put a level across the adjustment assembly. Tighten everything down, check your level and your cross hairs should be plumb with the rifle. It works for me every time I use it.
Link Posted: 11/24/2003 4:32:40 PM EDT
Troy, I have found the top one to be a good item, the bottom level to be a POS. I ordered one and found it to be milled incorrectly and off. What problem did you discover with the paddle style? I have had no problems.
Link Posted: 11/24/2003 5:13:28 PM EDT
Hmmm, haven't had that problem with my Bsquare bubble level. I installed it getting the rifle nice and level, used a second small magnetic bubble level on my front sight gas block as well to make sure my rifle was in perfect horizontal orientation. Then set up a plumb line with 550 cord and set the reticles to the verticle line. The real trick is once all that is done, to check to see if your mechanical movements for elevation/windage are keyed or move along true verticle/horizontal. Sometimes reticles get put in slightly off rotational axis and won't move true to how the turrets adjust the reticle. Testing that at the range usually takes a couple of 5 shot groups, shoot a group, move 10MOA right to shoot another group, move 10MOA down shoot another group, move 10MOA left to shoot another group, and then move 10MOA up to shoot the final group. Not only tests the turrets for consistency/repeatability(final group should fire to same point of aim as first group) but the groups should move horizontally/vertically in a path along what the crosshairs indicate as you do this test.
Link Posted: 11/24/2003 10:49:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/27/2003 8:17:51 AM EDT
Troy, you back away from the objective until all of the stuff is visible. You don't have to see the target, just the crosshairs and the paddles. I have been able to back up a couple feet and see the whole shebang and get a good level.
Link Posted: 11/27/2003 11:30:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/27/2003 11:32:19 AM EDT by DarkNite]
Originally Posted By plateshooter: I thought I would throw one more in here. If your using split rings, install them on the rifle. Put the rifle in a gun vise, and level the rifle across the bottom half of the rings, across your mounting rail, or any other flat spot. Clamp it down, and mount the scope. Remove the top adjustment cap on the scope, and put a level across the adjustment assembly. Tighten everything down, check your level and your cross hairs should be plumb with the rifle. It works for me every time I use it.
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That's the technique I use. Level the rifle, mount the rings, check level, install scope and check level against a small bar level across the top turret. I can hit .410 shells at 200 yds with clicked up from a 100 yd zero consistantly with rifles set up this way so I think cant problems are not much of a factor!
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