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Posted: 11/8/2003 1:25:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/8/2003 1:35:17 AM EDT by PatRHenry]
Fellow Hotshots and Sharpshooters,

My name is Pat R. Henry (ok, ok, not my real name, but an internet persona, ok?). I am writing you to tell you about Liberty Optics. We are an authorized IOR Valdada (www.valdada.com) distributor. Haven't heard of IOR? You're not alone.....IOR (imported by Valdada Enterprises LLC) is an old, highly accomplished military optics manufacturer from Bucharest, Romania, dating back to WWII and the subsequent Cold War. They have maintained close ties with Zeiss over the decades and their current lineup is first class. All their scopes/binocs are made with premium glass from Schott Glasswerks, Germany (a subsidiary of Zeiss). They feature photo-etched reticles, 6061-T alloy or steel housings, CNC-machined turret and adjustment mechanisms, in a word...awesome!!! Price is moderate, about what you would expect to pay for top of the line optics. (This may be old news to you guys, but 99% of my customers have never heard of IOR).

Here at Liberty Optics, we love guns and gun people. Our goal is to become the #1 IOR distributor in the world. We won't sell you other makes and other stuff besides IOR optics. Why? Because we think IOR is simply the best, PERIOD! We have fixed power, variables, hunting and awesome tactical reticles. Don't forget our mounts and rings (including AR handle mounts!). Don't have it in stock? No prob, we can drop-ship straight from the Valdada warehouse in Denver, CO!! (FL residents add 6% sales tax, sorry!)

So, give us a call, and try us out. If you have any questions for us, CALL or EMAIL. We want you to put IOR optics on YOUR guns, and you will be glad you did!! Thanks for your consideration!!

Pat R. Henry, Proprietor
Liberty Optics
PO Box 208
Island Grove FL 32654
352-572-1469
FNrifleman@aol.com

PS See you at SHOT Show 2004 in the IOR Valdada booth!
PSS Online store to be launched July 4, 2004!!!



__________________
FNrifleman

Link Posted: 11/9/2003 6:44:20 PM EDT
Hmmm. And all this time I thought that advertising your business here without being a paying advertiser was against the rules or something....
Haven't heard of IOR? You're not alone.....
View Quote
Or just some a__hole who came to this board today and hasn't bothered to read any of the numerous posts about these scopes. If you really want "to become the #1 IOR distributor in the world" then you've got a hell of a row to hoe. There are several other vendors selling these scopes at excellent prices who were motivated enough to get their on-line store up and running in less than the 8 months(!) you're saying and they don't post BS sales hype ad copy using pseudonyms.
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 8:23:24 PM EDT
Well Mr. Henry "guard with jealous attention the public liberty" and make sure that you clear your next add with the staff.
Link Posted: 11/9/2003 11:05:35 PM EDT
Dear Hoplophile, In response to your first "shot over the bow," I seek guidance on reaching forum members with our products / prices / specials that won't PO anybody....didn't see any when I registered. Please give me a hand there.... I am not an "A-hole," but a really nice guy who cares about our products and customers. I believe I said (This may be old news to you guys, but 99% of my customers have never heard of IOR). This is a specialized target audience here, but would you agree that IOR optics are way underrated and under-marketed, and it never hurts to educate that ONE person who's never given IOR a serious try... You're right about having a "hell of a row to hoe," but we are building slowly and patiently, and over time we will succeed, one customer at a time. IMO, there really is NOT that many vendors selling IOR, and there prices are not all that excellent, either..esp on the high end stuff. We will nearly always have the best price, but we can't advertise per policy at Valdada, so call or email. As for the online store, motivation has little to do with it. The store will actually be up and running well before the stated deadline, but will not be PROMOTED until JULY 4, 2004. Let's see, Patrick Henry...Liberty Optics....July 4....are you catching a theme here?? Have you heard of the author Boston T. Party?? He uses a pseudonym, but his books are anything but BS, IMO. It's all a marketing ploy...lighten up a little, eh? My real name is Scott J. Berish, and Liberty Optics is for real.... You may call Valdada and ask for Valentine (pronounced ValenTEEN) to see if I'm legit, or email Boston @ javelinpress@yahoo.com and ask him what he thinks of Liberty Optics, as he is a customer!! Thanks for your reply! Scott a/k/a Pat "BS" Henry...:)
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 12:37:09 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 12:40:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/10/2003 12:49:32 AM EDT by Aimless]
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 2:45:24 AM EDT
He has the lowest prices I have found on the web for IOR optics. YMMV? -Justin
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 4:53:13 AM EDT
Thanks for "breaking me in" guys, and giving me a fair shake. Bob, got your email, will respond today. Justin, don't know what "YMMV" means (or even if I was meant to know). To all other members who wrote me, I will get your questions answered today.... Pat a/k/a Scott
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 5:50:10 AM EDT
YMMV(Your Mileage May Vary) You were $20 cheaper than any I have found on the 1.1-4x. Others may have a different/better source. Best of luck w/ the optics thing. -Justin
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 6:14:41 AM EDT
Cool - sell a cheaper mouse trap and the world will beat a path to your Internet site. I hope you become a member here as I support our supporters ... and need an M1 [:)]
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 1:41:13 PM EDT
Pat, check your email and hook a brother up.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 4:27:01 PM EDT
Baxshep, Got your email and will respond soon. Thanks for your interest! Pat
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 9:04:48 AM EDT
Guys, Yeah IOR may be a robust scope with killer glass, BUT, you best pray you aren't in need of warranty repairs, my 2.5-10 Tactical had the rubber ocular eyepiece go missing on a deer hunt last November. Well, it just got replaced last week, and not by IOR, but by a sympathetic IOR dealer who managed to scrounge one for me (When I could reach IOR, they alluded to having to wait for one to arrive from deepest, darkest Romania). One year for a friggin' rubber gasket!! YMMV, but Leupold, Trijicon etc (USA!) get my $$$.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 6:20:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By PatRHenry: In response to your first "shot over the bow,"
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I apologize for being more harsh than was called for. After a long day at work I finally got a chance to catch up on the Internet and yours was neither the first nor last commercial post in a dicussion forum that I'd encountered that day. As others have already discussed, there is a equipment exchange that is an excellent place to do business and there are additional options for supporting this site with advertising. More importantly this site is an excellent opportunity for you to reach a large volume of users. Not by posting ads but by joining the discussions and contributing to this online community. Much of the value to this forum comes from members who are owners or employees of manufacturers or distributors who are able to provide information that would not otherwise be available. It also provides benefit to you since you can see what type of features people are looking for so you'll know what products to stock and/or provide feedback to your suppliers about potential new products. I do hope you establish yourself as a top vendor with excellent prices because IOR Valdeda does make excellent optics and I'll probably be ordering some in the coming year.
I am not an "A-hole," but a really nice guy
View Quote
Being an A-hole isn't the worst thing to be, and at least you'll be in good company. [wave]
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 7:43:29 PM EDT
Hoplophile, no apology necessary....all is forgiven...I'm a pretty good sport. In my line of work, you'd better have thick skin, or you won't cut it!! I would like to contribute to this forum and help everyone out concerning IOR optics...and I promise to be honest an forthright, even if it hurts...soooooo... in the spirit of that statement...I'd like to respond to Seuss. Buddy, I'm sorry to hear about your non-repair from Valdada. The missing rubber eyepiece is the second one I have ever heard of, so it happens. IF you retain the ring, super glue or other cyanocrylate-type cement should work fine for a repair. The owner of Valdada can be irascible at times with the public, and I'm going to try to work on that. One year is about 51 weeks too long. However, I do believe Val does not have many laying around, but still, no excuse! You did hit a key point though, having a good dealer can do wonders for you, kudos to him for helping you out. Now, about the (USA!) thing....I am as patriotic as anybody, and always try to buy American when I can. However, there are a couple of facts I can speak of...the big "L" brand has none of their optical glass manufactured in the US (try Korea, China, and Japan)...and the FTC law for truth in labeling mandates only 51% of a product be built in the USA to be called "Made in USA." The only true USA optical manufacturer I know of is US Optics...made in the USA with "homemade" glass. IOR optics are manufactured in Romania using German glass, the big "L" is made in USA with Asian glass. Doesn't make anything right or wrong or good or bad, thems just the facts. However, I will say the big "L's" customer service is legendary in reputation, and is a level Liberty Optics hopes to attain for IOR. Best Wishes, Pat
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 12:06:56 PM EDT
Pat, I had a Burris Black Diamond scope develop the same problem, rubber eyepiece went bye bye. I called Burris, and whammo, 3 days later, have TWO replacements in the mail. When I would call Valentin (who last time I checked doesn't publish IOR's phone # anywhere I can find), he copped a major attitude with me, which I sure as heck don't need and won't tolerate. So, IOR, regardless of how good their product is, and how great their dealer network is, is off my list. I urge others to seriously consider what you may be getting in to if you have warranty work with IOR, it isn't pleasant, and there are alot of alternatives.
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 5:29:56 PM EDT
Seuss, Your point is well taken and I wish you the best. I will save your (and any other criticisms)and comments for presentation and discussion to Valdada. Your input is valued! Pat
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 6:08:35 PM EDT
I am in the market for a Valdada IOR M2 in 308 with the CQB reticle like this: [IMG]http://www.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Ekie12091941/31ab4f23.gif[/IMG] You guys have those? Any body every try a Valdada with the donut?
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 6:17:46 PM EDT
Ekie, I will check on the availability of the .308 M2 w/CQB, but most likely they are in stock. I just drop-shipped a .223 CQB M2 for BaxShep. He may have feedback for you soon. Let me know if I can be of any help. Pat
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 6:22:19 PM EDT
Great, that IOR with the donut reticle looks like the hot ticket, but would like some feed back on it. Never heard of any one trying one of those.
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 6:28:26 PM EDT
Well, while I have your attention, plus I really don't have much time in the day to make inquiring phone calls, gotta couple of M2 questions. The marking on the elevation knob, those numbers are yards (meters) right? So 3 stands for 300 yards (meters)? Is it clock wise for right on the windage knob, and are the clicks 1/2 MOA? What about the stadia marks on the CQB reticule, how do those work, I take it they are for range finding?
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 6:47:17 PM EDT
Ekie, You are correct, the numbers correspond to range in meters (darn metric!)...it is a range based BDC. You are correct on both counts w/ the windage knob questions. The stadia marks are borrowed from the MP-8 and are mil-based. They allow for flexibility in ranging any object of known (or closely estimated) size, and also allow for fast holdover capability w/o using the BDC. The numbers refer to 5,10,15 mils in 1 mil increments (per your illustration). Pat
Link Posted: 11/16/2003 7:08:47 PM EDT
Great, thanks for the quick response.
Link Posted: 11/19/2003 2:22:21 PM EDT
Just curious how the mils equate into distance, there are 15 mils and it has 800 meters on the adjustmant knob. By the way just got one of these and I thimk it is a great scope for hte price.
Link Posted: 11/19/2003 4:40:22 PM EDT
Gill, Without going into too much detail, this is similar to the mil-dot system except hashes are used instead of dots. You can bracket a target of known (or closely estimated) size (assumimg we are not talking about the 10 MOA ranging circles) and "measure" it's height in mils. Then you can use the formula to convert to range to target. IOR sells a "Mil-master" slide rule calculator that converts common target sizes and mil measurements into distance. By the way, 1 mil (short for milliradian) is equal to subtending ~3.6" at 100 yards, or 36" @ 1000 yards. The smaller a target of equal size measure in mils, the further away it is. For example, you are ranging a "bad guy" about 72" tall, and you put the top of his head @ the cross hair and his feet go down to 6 mils. He is 333 yards away. If he is 3 mils tall, then he is now 667 yards away. You can dial in the BDC or learn your POA/POI holdovers from work at the range and use the proper holdover and "drop him." Let me know if this helps. Pat
Link Posted: 11/19/2003 7:21:36 PM EDT
exactly what I wanted to know, thanx
Link Posted: 11/20/2003 9:29:53 AM EDT
I recently acquired a M-1 Tactical (marked Armalite) and mounted it on my AR-10 A$bc. I had no manual, so I called Val at Valdada. He was polite, helpful and informative. He emailed me a copy of the owners manual. I haven't shot the rifle yet, but I'm impressed with the apparrent quality. Will post results later. And I'm a BIG fan of "the big L"...
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 3:20:44 PM EDT
I ordered an IOR Valdada 4x24 M2 from Libert Optics (Scott or Pat) and I am very happy w/ the whole experience. Scott called me 3 times after the order was placed, actaully worrying about the suitability of the scope for what I was planning to shoot, what type of rings and whether or not the rings would fits my rail, and the eye relief. I didn't even decide on the scope until he explained the CQB reticle over email and he suggested the M2 after a series of questions on what I was planning to do. I was a bit worried about giving my credit card # to some guy I met over the Internet but damned if I didn't get the cheapest prices I have seen for the 4x24 M2, but I also got the package in the mail 3 days later. In summary, best prices AND superior customer service. If you have any questions about my buying experience, email me using this forum. Thanks Scott! Bax SGT USMC Infantry
Link Posted: 11/21/2003 11:20:31 PM EDT
Baxshep, Needless to say, I am very happy to hear you were pleased with Liberty Optics sales and service. Thanks for the endorsement!! Let me know how that scope performs! Turbozag, Val is really a great guy at heart, and I am pleased you had a positive experience in your dealings with him. I will pass along your comments to him as "positive reinforcement." Thanks for the posts guys. It's always good to start my weekend with feedback like this! Scott @ Liberty Optics
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