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Posted: 10/14/2003 1:58:08 AM EDT
alright, so i've planned on putting down the $$ on a Vari-x III, and so far i planned on getting the 4.5-14x40 w/the mildot.. but i've been rethinking it and now i cannot decide between the 4-14x40 mildot or the 3.5-10x40 mildot.. this is going on my varmint AR... since i'm putting down a substantial amount of money, i'd like to get it right! so, which do you think that i should go for? is 10x enough? or should i go 14x? or is there something else I should go for in the same (600 dollar) price range?? thanks for help on this life changing decision!
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 2:13:08 AM EDT
A Leupold is an investment which if cared for properly can be passed on to your grandkids. Here's one I purchased a few months back from Premier Recticle. It has the new Gen2 recticle with the mil-dots in the first plane, making ranging at any power possible and a very decent price. [url]http://www.premierreticles.com/catalog/index.php?file=catalog&action=catalog_productinfo&uid=5465&pi_id=51293&clist=0,51202,51203&PHPSESSID=30dfb72f5f83a63f4cc282bd2736df8a[/url] While they sell the 4.5x14 scopes too, and I own one bought way back in the late 70s, and upgraded by Premier in the late 80s, I'm close to half century mark now and find the extra power very useful, either way Leupold and Premier are a great combination IMO. Good Luck, Mike
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 10:13:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/14/2003 8:42:50 PM EDT by Klinger_04]
regarding premeier reticles: if the reticle is in the first plane, then it gets bigger as you zoom in right? one of the many reasons i'm trying to get a new scope is because the old one I had had euopean-style glass/reticle which makes the reticle bigger as you crank up the power, and i did not particularly favor it.. now that said, the scope I had wasn't that great, so maybe thats why I didn't like it.. but i did like being able to use the rangefinder at any power.. do you have any problems with the crosshairs getting bigger? btw.. thats so funny that you should say how it can be passed on to your grandkids, because my dad has had one of thoes vari-x III 6.5-20x40 on his 22-250 for since before I was born.. and after using it all last month, thats what inspired me sell the old scope, and get a Vari-x III for my varmint rig!
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 10:44:22 AM EDT
If you are actually going to be hunting varmints with your varminter, I think 14x might come in handy. Leupold is kind of over priced; the Nikon Monarch, Weaver Grand Slam and Bushnell 4200 are as good or better for a lot less money. However, none of them have as many offerings with mil-dots.
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 10:52:34 AM EDT
I also agree that if you will hunting varmints, the 14x will be nice......I've tried it with 10x and they were nearly too far to reliably pick them up..... The only reason I would stick to a Leupold, over a Weaver/Bushnell/Nikon, the M1LR windage and elevation adjustments. If you are not getting the LR scopes with the M1 or M3 dials, I'd look to a Weaver Grand Slam. They are optically very similar with the edge going to Weaver on the price point.
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 10:53:53 AM EDT
Your correct the cross-hairs and mil-dots do get bigger as ya roll the power up. They are very small and thin at the 6.5X power and biggest at 20X, I don't notice that there too big, but I can say I like them better at 20X than I do at 6.5X, 'cus their fairly faint for my aged eyes. To tell the truth never considered/looked at this aspect from your point of view, now ya've given me something to check ...... Mike
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 10:56:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 12:47:06 PM EDT
awesome! thanks guys, i'll go 14x! now, should i put in the extra $170 for the M1?? by doing that I gain a 30mm tube and the M1 knobs.. that sounds good to me.. but humor me.. what are the advantages of the M1 knobs?? is it just alot easier to use?? before i was thinking that the M1 knobs were something i wouldn't even need, because I thought that it just was a BDC or something.. thanks I've almost convinced myself to do it, but, dang it thats an extra $170 that was going to my rings/mounts!![banghead] Oh well, I'll just have to wait..
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 12:53:32 PM EDT
Many of the varmint scopes utilize target knobs that come with covers and are less stout than the M1 knobs. The M1 knobs are just 1/4MOA adjustment knobs for windage and elevation. However, they are built for serious social uses like sniping/countersniping rifles, LE rifles, etc.....they will stand up to repeated target solutions, and will repeat zero each and every time. When they don't, it goes back to Leupold for a retune...... I like precise 1/4MOA control, and IMO a varmint rig needs that level of control -- if you were engaging man size targets the M3 BDC dials would be best. But little targets like groundhogs or squirrels or 2" target dots need a little better resolution than 1MOA.... Again IMHO....
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 1:12:21 PM EDT
so are you saying i shoudn't go for the M1?? or are you for the M1??
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 1:19:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Klinger_04: so are you saying i shoudn't go for the M1?? or are you for the M1??
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My custom 700P/HD wears a Mk4 10x40mm M1 mildot. My AR10 A4 wears a 4.5-14x50mm M1LR Mildot. My RRA 20" Varmint .223 wears a 4.5-14x50mm M1LR Duplex. My former Sendero 300 WinMag wore a Mk4 10x40mm M1 Duplex. Your guess is as good as mine.....[:D]
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 1:53:44 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SHIVAN:
Originally Posted By Klinger_04: so are you saying i shoudn't go for the M1?? or are you for the M1??
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My custom 700P/HD wears a Mk4 10x40mm M1 mildot. My AR10 A4 wears a 4.5-14x50mm M1LR Mildot. My RRA 20" Varmint .223 wears a 4.5-14x50mm M1LR Duplex. My former Sendero 300 WinMag wore a Mk4 10x40mm M1 Duplex. Your guess is as good as mine.....[:D]
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haha, M1 it is then! now for the mount; I was thinking either 1)an ARMS #35QD base and some of their #35 rings..(probably med height.. what do you guys think?) any of you guys set it up like this? or 2)the armalite one-piece mount.. that would be cheaper.. i guess i could just get some #22 QD rings, and that would be the same price as the armalite mount.. my main conncern is eye-relief.. any problems with eye-relief with any of these mounts? my old scope needed to be mounted really far forward for it to be comfortable..
Link Posted: 10/14/2003 8:01:23 PM EDT
Leupolds generally have long eye relief. I could not get mine to work with ARMS#22 rings or the RRA one-piece mount. I doubt the Armalite would be much better. When I try it out again, I think I will go with an extended ARMS sleeve and Leupold QRW 1" high rings or, if I have money to burn, another set of #22s.
Link Posted: 12/10/2003 8:29:11 PM EDT
*two months later* Alright guys, I'm bringing this one back from the dead. But for good reason.. I finally got my M1! (After two months and a few "fund diversions") I ended up going for the 6.5-20x instead of the 4.5-14x. I also went with some 22M rings to mount onto the GG&G mount that I already had. I just wanted to come back and thank you guys for the help, and, of course, show off my newest scope.. [naughty] [img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=20401[/img] Looks like now I'll be forced to spend all my money on different types of ammo for testing... *sigh*
Link Posted: 12/11/2003 5:55:18 PM EDT
Nice scope! Feel like "king of the hill" don't ya?
Link Posted: 12/12/2003 8:57:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 223Rem: Nice scope! Feel like "king of the hill" don't ya?
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Thank ye! Yeah I'm King of the Hill on my block for now.. Well, at least until my skill (or lack thereof) determines different! [:D]
Link Posted: 12/12/2003 10:17:04 AM EDT
Nice set-up for varminting! That should make aiming at little critters at 400 yards a piece of cake. The whole thread had plenty of good advice. Thanks to all!
Link Posted: 12/13/2003 6:00:08 PM EDT
Nice score! I just went through your same cituation a few days ago! I wanted the M-1 badly! But when I found out how expensive the Mark 4 rings and mounts were, I was forced to go down a step on the scope for now. I went with the Varix III 4.5x14x40 Tactical model. My cost on the rings, mounts and scope was <$700 Those Mark 4 rings are SWEET! All mounted to a Remington LTR in .308. I just ordered a new Elcan for my AR-10 A4. Elcans are AWESOME!
Link Posted: 12/13/2003 10:04:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2003 10:04:36 PM EDT by Zak-Smith]
Klinger, I ended up with the 14X M1 also: On my "match" AR-15 (a JP CTR-02): [img]http://www.demigod.org/~zak/DigiCam/2003-11-26-farm/small/101_0193.jpg[/img] On my JP AR-10: [img]http://www.demigod.org/~zak/DigiCam/2003-JPAR10/small/IMG_0041.jpg[/img] -z
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