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Posted: 6/28/2003 10:43:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2003 12:14:51 PM EDT by Wave]
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:08:34 AM EDT
Leupold M1LR 3.5-10x40mm. Should be right around your budget. If you don't care about super precise adjustments, then look to the M3LR. In the Armalite 30mm mount it may be a touch low, but you can remount it to an ARMS #5 if you need additional height. I've never thought of the ACOG as a precision rifle compliment. YMMV... There is an M1LR on the EE a couple days ago for $600. "ArmyInf" can get them for $619 last he listed. He might not have any more though...
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:15:42 AM EDT
One other thing: I have noticed that when I use my M4gery with the Compact ACOG that I have to get a little close to the scope. The eye relief is OK when handling a very light recoiling rifle like the 5.56/.223, but 1 or 2 inch eye relief is not really what I call ideal for the recoil of a .308. The ACOG is awesome, and we have seen the pics of the M14 with the TA11 on them...IMHO the M3LR and M1LR just seem to be the ideal optic for a precision .308 auto.... Again....YMMV.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:26:55 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:31:50 AM EDT
I saw a 50mm on ARMS quick disconnects clear the tube, but not sure about the Armalite mount. If nobody answers you, check with Dave @ Quantico Arms.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:39:43 AM EDT
Being that it's the carbine -Go with the .308 TA11. That would be cool.
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:43:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/28/2003 12:15:44 PM EDT by Wave]
Link Posted: 6/28/2003 11:46:47 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 10:36:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/29/2003 11:14:59 AM EDT by LARRYG]
Originally Posted By Wave: This is what I'm looking at: [b]Vari-X III 3.5-10x40 Long Range M3 Illuminated Reticle[/b] [url]http://www.leupold.com/products/tactical_products/images/magnified/Vari-XIII_3.5-10x40LRM3IRx2.gif[/url] [url]http://www.leupold.com/products/tactical_products/Vari-X_III_3.5-10x40mm_LRM3_IR.htm[/url]
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How much is that thing? I know it's not a Leupold, but at the Dallas gun show I went to with some of the DFW gang, I picked up an NcStar 6x24-50 AOE Mil-Dot 1 inch tube with illuminated recticle and target turrets at the John Masen table. It may be junk, but I'm poor right now and in my past internet ordering dealings with Masen, they are great at making exchanges or taking stuff back. In fact, I originally picked up a rangefinder model and while I was still in Dallas, I went over and they swapped it, no problem. I had also picked up an illuminated normal (non-rangefinder on mil-dot)3-9x40 with a built in AR mount at the same show and they swapped it for 3-12x50 illuminated mil-dot 30 mm tube with no difference in price when I drove over there. They are good folks and I feel that if I am not satisfied with the scopes, they will make good, plus NcStar has a lifetime warranty. I checked out their website and they have quite a variety. I know Leupold is the cream of the crop, but what makes them so versus other brands?
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 10:46:06 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave: This is what I'm looking at: [b]Vari-X III 3.5-10x40 Long Range M3 Illuminated Reticle[/b] [url]http://www.leupold.com/products/tactical_products/images/magnified/Vari-XIII_3.5-10x40LRM3IRx2.gif[/url] [url]http://www.leupold.com/products/tactical_products/Vari-X_III_3.5-10x40mm_LRM3_IR.htm[/url]
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Good choice, I've been thinking of buying the same scope. Which reticle were you looking at? Mil-dot or duplex? Steve.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 10:53:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 3:02:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave:
Originally Posted By Cincinnatus: Being that it's the carbine -Go with the .308 TA11. That would be cool.
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Cool? Yeah but my wallet would be empty for 3.5 magnification only? I think I'll go Leupold.
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It is what it is. And it's worth it. Being that it's a carbine, I think the TA11 is a fine match for the AR-10 Carbine's optimum range. But that is just my opinion.
Link Posted: 7/1/2003 7:21:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SHIVAN458: IMHO the M3LR and M1LR just seem to be the ideal optic for a precision .308 auto.
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I couldn't agree more. To hell with those IOR (POS) scopes. Ya get what ya pay for! If you are thinking of a mil-dot, check out [url=http://www.premierreticles.com/gen2.html]Premiere Reticles[/url]. Here's the one I have on my AR-Varmint gun: [url=http://206.131.255.85/merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PR&Product_Code=51182G&Category_Code=GEN2 ]3.5X-10X 40mm M3 LR Tactical[/url]. From their site: GEN 2 MIL-DOT - This Premier innovation features a First Focal Plane reticle which allows mil spacing to remain constant throughout the power range of the variable Leupold Vari X-III scopes. Answering to persistent requests from various military and law enforcement operators, we have redesigned the mil-dot to include hash marks between dots to provide 1/2 mil gradients which allows much more accurate range estimating. This also gives a more precise aiming point when using the mil-dot for quick hold-overs. 1/2 mil gradients are .15 mil in length. Dots have been resized to be exactly 2/10 mil round in diameter. This allows mils to be broken into 1/10 mil increments. Hash marks on posts, 2 mils in length, are placed in 5 mil increments and extend entirely to the edge of the field of view. This feature can be utilized when ranging larger objects at long distance. For low light considerations, all lines and hash marks are 1/4 moa for maximum visibility.
Link Posted: 7/1/2003 8:28:45 PM EDT
As to clearance with the AR10 mount, here is a kind of big scope on an AR10 using the Armalite mount (I think) If this fits I think most anything will. [img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=11208[/img] Not that I recommend this combo. I think the US Optics is overkill for any but those who really use and abuse their equipment. I'm just a paper puncher. And the price is way outa $800.
Link Posted: 7/1/2003 8:34:25 PM EDT
That's an ARMS #5 that raises it up about 1/2" or more maybe 5/8"...looks like low rings.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 4:15:36 AM EDT
Hmmm, guess I better pull it out and take a better look. I thought I was using the Armalite one peice setup. But, I have mixed stuff around the last year or two and maybe you is right. I'll get some better closeups while I'm at it.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 4:55:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Slash:
Originally Posted By SHIVAN458: IMHO the M3LR and M1LR just seem to be the ideal optic for a precision .308 auto.
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I couldn't agree more. To hell with those IOR (POS) scopes. Ya get what ya pay for!
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Slash, have you ever used the IOR scopes or is this just a bash on a good scope? I personally have used the Leupold's and they don't seem as durable as the IOR's.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 5:48:02 AM EDT
Shivan is 100% correct. It is ARMs #5 and throw lever rings low from who I can't remember. My bad. Wonder where I used the US Optics Posilock mount?? I would post a closeup but for some reason AR15.com tells me I have no room for more photos. I think this is operator error and am investigating.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 5:49:13 AM EDT
Based on the research I have done, I do not and will not own an IOR. Maybe I'm just stuck in my ways, but I've been more than satisfied with EVERY Leupold scope that I've owned. I can't say the same for ANY of the lower-priced optics that I THOUGHT were a good deal when I bought them (I have a a drawer full of Tasco, Simmons, etc. that are not worth mounting on a BB-gun). I see no reason to gamble my money on a relative newcomer to the U.S. market. Yes, IOR has been around forever in the eastern-bloc, but an old name and a European address do not guarantee quality optics. I know what to expect from Leupold and I know how things will be handled in the rare event that there is a problem. "You get what you pay for" & "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is" keep ringing in my ears. I generally spend almost as much (if not more) on optics as on the actual rifle. I just can't see how IOR can put out optics that supposedly rival Schmidt & Bender at far less that half the price of other German optics of KNOWN quality. There is a lot more to a quality optic than perceived durability. And I don't recall ever hearing anyone criticize Leupold's construction. Link to discussion thread on SniperHide.com: [url=http://www.snipershide.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=19;t=000193;p=]IOR versus Leupold[/url] It sounds like service is an issue with IOR products.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 9:39:54 AM EDT
I read the articles and the link you provided. Seems that some dislike the scope and customer service from 5 years ago. I can't speak for everyone but from my own personal experience, I would choose the IOR over the Leupold. I had the 6x42 Mil-dot reticle scope and have not looked back after selling it and getting my IOR M2 scope. As far as customer service goes, if mine ever broke, I would prob consider getting another. I totally agree with you on getting cheap scopes. I have sent back/traded/returned more NCStar/BSA/Simmons scopes than I care to remember. I did like my Tasco SS 10x42 though.
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 10:12:55 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DOA: As far as customer service goes, if mine (IOR) ever broke, I would prob consider getting another.
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If one of my my Leupolds ever breaks, I can send it back and they will repair/replace it for free. No questions asked. [:D]
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 12:36:27 PM EDT
Check around for the Swarovski Conquest line of scopes. They are 1" and not 30mm, but legendary Swarovski quality at surprisingly affordable prices. For what it's worth, I have a Tasco Varmint scope - 6-24x44 on my AR-10 in an AR mount and have never had any problem. It might just have been a bad scope...
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 1:25:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/2/2003 1:43:43 PM EDT by 223Rem]
Originally Posted By SHIVAN458: There is an M1LR on the EE a couple days ago for $600.
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Yup, there was and the money is on it's way! [;D]
Link Posted: 7/2/2003 9:22:48 PM EDT
Hey Wave, I have the scope you pictured above on my SPR. Mines the LRM3 with the Premeire Reticle Second Gen MilDot. If you are familiar with the mildot system, the Second Gen reticle is pretty awesome. However, if you get this reticle, you can not get it magnified as I understand it. Excellnt scope that can play double duty on an AR you have just by switching the cams! Go for it!
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 11:07:54 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave: I'm looking really hard at the Leupolds. Will the 50mm objective clear the free float tube using an ArmaLite 30mm onepiece mount?
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The Armalite mount lets even a 56mm objective clear the free float tube. [img]http://pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/858902/2267174/25067316.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 11:11:34 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/5/2003 7:49:20 AM EDT
I really like that Armalite one piece mount in the pic.
Link Posted: 7/5/2003 9:39:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/5/2003 9:45:37 PM EDT by Slash]
Originally Posted By Wave: Damn! I put the Leupold M3(Illuminated Duplex reticle) on top of my AR-10 and took it to the range today...[b][red]you really do get what you pay for.[/b][/red] When that Tasco SS comes back from repairs it's going to the EE.
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[nana] I told you so .... [nana] I had to learn the hard way as well. [:D]
Link Posted: 7/5/2003 10:37:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 7:29:28 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave: Like I said...from now on Leupolds and ACOG's thats it!
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Pretty good words to live by [:D]
Link Posted: 7/8/2003 4:16:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave: Like I said...from now on Leupolds and ACOG's thats it!
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Add Burris to that list. They make pretty decent glass.
Link Posted: 7/9/2003 9:57:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/9/2003 10:04:11 AM EDT by wolfj2]
For future scope purchases. . . check out A-Z scopes. Best price I could find (internet)on the Leupold LR VXIII scopes. Got my 8.5-25x50mm LRM1 (mil dot) tactical for $845 6 months ago.
Link Posted: 7/10/2003 5:49:40 AM EDT
Thanks Wave! Last week I was the range, saw drops in my view and thought it was lube landing on the outer glass. Nope, it is on the inside reticle. Another mid-price scope trashed. A guy there had a Tasco SS on his .50, great view when he let me try it, said it held up thru hundreds of shots, I was about to buy one.
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