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Posted: 3/1/2006 4:47:54 PM EDT
I have never had an issue with the green followers and that includes out in the field and when I have gone up into Iraq. I did a torture test at the range pouring sand into one of my mags and then loaded it in my rifle and it still fed. Does anyone else have any experierences? I am going to buy upgrade packages for my rangs mags (still have the black follower in those). Am I just not screwing it up enough?

Hound
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 5:51:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/1/2006 5:51:45 PM EDT by WIZZO_ARAKM14]
I've only had one or two FTFeed's that I would attribute ot the follower and they happened with the green ones.

Based on the 1000's of rounds I've put through my AR's though, the two (max, it might just be one, IIRC) failures are statistically insignifigant.

And yes, I bought about 15 or 20 Magpul followers and have installed most of them just because the tilting of the green followers looked like an accident waiting to happen.

WIZZO
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 5:56:34 PM EDT
Don't remember who, but an arfcom member said it best, "Perceived need, like Magpuls entire line."
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 6:39:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/1/2006 7:15:04 PM EDT by Magpul]
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:08:28 PM EDT
I was just stating that I have never had an issue I dont know if it was just dumb luck or that I just have newer mags than others. When I get me 20 round mags they will have magpuls already installed I have made my mind on that but I just would like to hear others sound off if they have had lots of problems with the green follower. I like the orange magpuls thats what is going to be going in the 20's but I was just trying to hear others talk about it because I hear green ones are bad the jam dont feed right but now real stories or situations. I just think that some of it is they dont baby their black rifles like i do. I love my ar been wanting one for years and now I have 2 and proud of them thats why I am trying to figure out if I should replace all my greens with magpuls?
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:12:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Magpul:

Originally Posted By bigkracka:
Don't remember who, but an arfcom member said it best, "Perceived need, like Magpuls entire line."



In some ways the statement is true. All our products are based not on what we think we can sell (safe choices / minor enhancements) or on what we are dictated to us via large government contracts (things build to fill a line item of requirements).

In 1996, while in the Marines, I "perceived" a need for a better magazine loop system that would provide consistent placement of the loop and could be installed in seconds on the magazine. Knowing nothing about injection molding or product design I borrowed money and built my solution. 6 years later my perceived solution is selling better than ever with only word of mouth advertising.

Having spent my time on the Marine KD course firing line I saw most malfunctions were magazine related. When HK spent a few million of the Brits money for the SA80 revamp, they redesigned the magazine and the resulting follower looked like the Styer Aug or AK47 mags which all have a much higher mean rate to failure than the green follower mags.

Again our perception of the problem is also shared by the Army itself which has funded a study last year on replacing the green follower as standard issue due to feeding issues.

Because we perceive problems we sometimes can find answers that others miss. We also put our money where our ideas are, developing products we perceive a need for and letting the market decide if we are right.

All this with little or no marketing. We don't have glossy full page ads in Guns and Ammo or browbeat our competitors. We simply offer our products with a 60 day money back guarantee- If you think they suck our do not fill a need just send them back no questions asked.

We have no plans on changing our way of innovation or our “perception”.



Rock On.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:53:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Magpul:
Having spent my time on the Marine KD course firing line I saw most malfunctions were magazine related. When HK spent a few million of the Brits money for the SA80 revamp, they redesigned the magazine and the resulting follower looked like the Styer Aug or AK47 mags which all have a much higher mean rate to failure than the green follower mags.



Does the magpul follower look like the HK or Aug follower? Is it more innovative than that?

The magpul follower seems to be a pretty snug fit in an AR mag compared to the green follower. I've had them get stuck at the bend in the AR mag. Maybe the mags are out of spec. Maybe the springs are weak. Maybe green follower is better in certain regards. However, the magpuls don't tilt, which seems to be the selling point.

I haven't seen HK or Aug mags. Do they have the same pronounced bend in the body that AR mags have? If not, maybe that's why the followers can be designed that way and work good in those mags.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 8:16:12 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 3:55:16 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 6:08:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ffhounddog:
I have never had an issue with the green followers and that includes out in the field and when I have gone up into Iraq... I am going to buy upgrade packages for my rangs mags



The fact that you've never had a problem with green followers and theses are going to be range mags I see no problem with using them.

I too have ever had a problem with green followers. In fact I just bought ten more (black Teflon).

I've dropped my fair share of mags but have never experienced a problem with subsequent function.

My one concern with the magpull is that, with the follower being so tight, if the mag were to be in any way damaged, even a slight ding, not to mention dirt/sand there may be a problem with FTF.

Not meant to step on any toes and of course, just my .02
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 6:15:40 AM EDT
I am starting to see why someone would get a magpul. I will have to re eval my mags w/o one. I just didnt like all the issues that people brought up with having to mod a magpul with the first gen. second gen looks alot better and orange is a good color for it. I might have to get a few here and a few there because I have other projects to go through. All thanks for the info.
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 6:21:53 AM EDT
RGT just made a good point could there be an issue with the tightness of the magpul? Could the reason why the greens bend a little for battledamage of a magazine? Dang my head is going to explode if I think too hard on this but this has been one of my better posts.

Scott
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 9:52:32 AM EDT
Cannot get the Magpul doc to open in word.....


M4-AK
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 1:27:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By M4-AK:
Cannot get the Magpul doc to open in word.....


M4-AK



+1 My computer will open it, but it's in Wingdings font (or something)

TS
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 2:08:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 2:36:11 PM EDT
Thanks for the PDF. I only have two disagreements with the paper. I can load more than thirty rounds (thirty one) in most of my mags, but I only load 28 rounds in my 30rd mags. And, the color isn't Coyote Brown but grey/gray or orange. I prefer the Coyote Brown and the original 2nd generation red-orange over straight orange. Almost all of my mags that take them have Magpul followers, all will have them soon. I don't see how having a follower that will not tilt can be anything other than an improvement.

TS
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 3:19:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Magpul:
Ok try this, saved as a PDF instead.

PDF of Magpul Follower White Paper



Thanks for posting that. The paper talks about a design goal of acheiving 80% better reliability and how the follower should be more reliable than other designs. Has field testing proven this? Is the failure rate of green vs. magpul followers known?
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 4:48:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 5:23:29 PM EDT
If you want the Mag-Pul followers to prove their mousy worth pronto just try some quick loading of some .458 SOCOM mags. Now, I am the first to admit that I am all thumbs and seem to manage to stick a standard follower at least every other time when loading .458 SOCOMs into mags but with the addition of the MP follower, even I cannot jam them up. I will also admit that I have never jammed up a normal GI follower when loading in 5.56, but with the .458s that have to go in from the front I can jam them up in nothing flat.
And since there is no difference between a .458 SOCOM mag and a 5.56, all mags have the MP followers in them. Thanks to a C&R license and Brownell's dealer discount I even managed to replace them all without breaking the bank.
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 5:39:03 PM EDT
I have jammed green followers once or twice.

Seeing as I spent $2,000 on the rifle, an extra $40 or so improving my mags is inconsequential.

How many people in this thread would put an Ed Brown pistol in an Uncle Mikes holster?
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 6:43:27 PM EDT
There's one thing I've always admired about the MagPul products I own - whether or not I actually NEED them, they are all amazingly well thought-out.
Link Posted: 3/3/2006 3:06:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bigkracka:
Don't remember who, but an arfcom member said it best, "Perceived need, like Magpuls entire line."



I've never needed the airbags in my car or the smoke detectors in my house, but I'm glad that I have them and I would never get rid of them. Same goes with the Magpul followers that I have in all of my mags. They are an extra level of reliability and peace of mind for guys that shoot guns for a living.

Stephen
Link Posted: 3/3/2006 3:13:33 AM EDT
I never had a problem with the old black followers, but I replaced them with green anyway. I've never had a problem with those, either.
Link Posted: 3/3/2006 5:49:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/3/2006 5:50:19 AM EDT by CB1]
I had a couple of old Sanchez mags that would give me problems at the range. the green follower would stick/tip on occasion.

After I installed the coyote follower these issues went away and these Sanchez mags are now in the "good" pile.

In my case, the Magpul follower performed as advertised.

Thanks Rich/Magpul Team for the innovation and research.
Link Posted: 3/4/2006 1:11:21 AM EDT
Sounds like we had a good discussion on followers and I appriciate all the help and the reasoning on why we have magpuls. It is for the 1% of times when we are stress and need to get a mag loaded and ready to go and we cant think about it we have to rely on training. I have a friend in SF at Bragg he really is and he uses the magpul gen 1 follwers in his M4 that he has. He likes them and says he never had an issue green followers also but told me he never had an issue with iron sights and he has a aimpoint it makes it better. So he asked me if the SHTF would you want the best gear or not as good gear. Well in my 20's I will get magpuls in then already added and I will order some for the 30's I have and the ones I will get. I guess part of my issue is that I have to save money for ammo and my ar stuff and all that and I try to save a few here and there for more ammo and possisbly a reddot or 1-3X scope (still shooting irons). All thanks for the help.

Scott
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