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Posted: 2/23/2006 6:35:10 AM EDT
I just got an email from Century Arms that .223 ammo from Guatamala is now in stock. The price is 1440 rounds for $259.95 / $3.87 a box.

It's listed as berdan primed. Seems kind of pricey for berdan primed ammo?

thanks,
Ron
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 7:29:33 AM EDT
That's pretty sad, last time I bought Gautamalen it was $130/1000. All of mine is boxer primed. Will we ever see decent ammo prices again?
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 7:40:46 AM EDT
Total Ripoff.

I used to fly through crates of Guatamalean(1440 rds) for around $130 each @ gunshows.
They are charging XM193/Q3131A prices for this stuff.

Be sure to ask if it's the tarnished or Non-tarnished stuff.
The tarnished shoots fine but is DAMN ugly.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 7:53:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/23/2006 7:54:10 AM EDT by FALARAK]
AIMsurplus will have it listed soon, at a better price.

You cannot say total ripoff, and used prices from two years ago as reasoning. Raw materials have gone up, and the surplus market is dry, which lets supply and demand set the price.

If you hadn't noticed - XM193/Q3131A is $0.22 per round or more IF you can find it.

.17 per round, this stuff will sell, and quickly.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 9:00:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
.17 per round, this stuff will sell, and quickly.



Isn't that what Winchester White Box sells for at Wal-Mart?

thanks,
Ron
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 9:06:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DoctorCheney223:
I just got an email from Century Arms that .223 ammo from Guatamala is now in stock. The price is 1440 rounds for $259.95 / $3.87 a box.

It's listed as berdan primed. Seems kind of pricey for berdan primed ammo?

thanks,
Ron



Is this in Battle Packs?
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 9:39:54 AM EDT
I called Century, this ammo is not in battlepacks, dated 80 - 90 and possbility of up to 30% will show signs of tarnish.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 10:50:52 AM EDT
aimsurplus.com will have *sealed* battlepacks. I think the stuff at Century will be opened and potentially tarnished.

Both will go bang.... I would buy whatever is cheaper - and based on posted prices, that is going to be AIM.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 2:34:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoctorCheney223:
I just got an email from Century Arms that .223 ammo from Guatamala is now in stock. The price is 1440 rounds for $259.95 / $3.87 a box.

It's listed as berdan primed. Seems kind of pricey for berdan primed ammo?

thanks,
Ron



Thats a total ripoff if anybody buys it. I was hoping to get some. I got a load of this stuff back a few years ago, the boxer primed stuff though. Works great. $.18 per round + shipping for berdan? i can get new Federal AE for that price, and its reloadable.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 2:50:12 PM EDT
Hell, "cheap" AE in my area is SIX bucks per 20, same as S&B. I see very little .223 that sells for under 4 bucks a box anymore. Hell, I have GOOD 193 and Q3131A I paid $2.50 per 20 stashed away, I did not figure it would remain at that price forever.

Shooters tend to think of ammo prices in the past and gripe if it ever goes up. They forget that the 12K car they bought new 15 years ago now costs 25K. And their house they paid 100K for 15 years ago now costs 250K to replace.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 3:01:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fxntime:
Hell, "cheap" AE in my area is SIX bucks per 20, same as S&B. I see very little .223 that sells for under 4 bucks a box anymore. Hell, I have GOOD 193 and Q3131A I paid $2.50 per 20 stashed away, I did not figure it would remain at that price forever.

Shooters tend to think of ammo prices in the past and gripe if it ever goes up. They forget that the 12K car they bought new 15 years ago now costs 25K. And their house they paid 100K for 15 years ago now costs 250K to replace.



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 3:02:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/23/2006 3:08:46 PM EDT by Bartholomew_Roberts]
According to AIM, their ammo will be in 360rd sealed packs. $184/1080 + shipping.


When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable?


The Winchester is SAAMI pressure, not 5.56 and I don't reload. According to my calculations, the Winchester would be $182/1000 + shipping or taxes.


J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff.


Several of the local ranges don't allow the use of steel penetrators so SS109/M855 is out if I want to use those ranges. It is also still milsurp and not any cheaper.


Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain.


Last I looked the Wolf M193 was $239/1000 shipped.... and that is without any guarantee that it performs like M193.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 3:30:09 PM EDT
Yea, metal has gone WAY up. I work for an HVAC, plumbing outfit. My boss is always harping about saving materials, recycling and the price of copper and brass. I know at some point last year it had doubled from the year before.
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 3:48:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bartholomew_Roberts:
According to AIM, their ammo will be in 360rd sealed packs. $184/1080 + shipping.

When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable?


The Winchester is SAAMI pressure, not 5.56 and I don't reload. According to my calculations, the Winchester would be $182/1000 + shipping or taxes.


J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff.


Several of the local ranges don't allow the use of steel penetrators so SS109/M855 is out if I want to use those ranges. It is also still milsurp and not any cheaper.


Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain.


Last I looked the Wolf M193 was $239/1000 shipped.... and that is without any guarantee that it performs like M193.



Now that's what I needed to know... that's a fair price for sealed packs of ammo that is true mil-spec stuff. I don't know what the shipping out here to Vegas is but it still should be somewhat reasonable. I just ordered a thousand rounds of the Radway 5.56 stuff and it only cost $15 for shipping.

I have close to 15,000 rounds of .223 but will probably pick up a couple thousand of the sealed stuff from AIM and avoid the Century stuff.

thanks,
Ron
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 4:35:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DoctorCheney223:

Originally Posted By fxntime:
Hell, "cheap" AE in my area is SIX bucks per 20, same as S&B. I see very little .223 that sells for under 4 bucks a box anymore. Hell, I have GOOD 193 and Q3131A I paid $2.50 per 20 stashed away, I did not figure it would remain at that price forever.

Shooters tend to think of ammo prices in the past and gripe if it ever goes up. They forget that the 12K car they bought new 15 years ago now costs 25K. And their house they paid 100K for 15 years ago now costs 250K to replace.



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron



According to another thread I saw here, AIM claimed it will be 184.95 +15 shipping (199.95 total) for 1080 rounds. I can get brand new boxer primed Federal AE for $208 shipped, why pay this for 15-20 year old berdan?
Link Posted: 2/24/2006 8:41:32 PM EDT
tag
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 12:33:43 AM EDT
If this stuff is SHTF-stash worthy, it doesn't matter much if it's Berdan primed, IMO.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 4:37:33 AM EDT
Wait until the begining of March when Century puts out their monthly sales, they just might put it on sale.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 5:36:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By APBullet:
Wait until the begining of March when Century puts out their monthly sales, they just might put it on sale.



Word around the campfire here is that the stuff Century has is the berdan, not the boxer stuff, and it doesnt come in battlepacks. So for the price they are asking you are better off going to AIM and getting the sealed battlepacks with boxer primers. Or just paying the same for some brand spankin new Federal AE or Q3131.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 6:49:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:
According to another thread I saw here, AIM claimed it will be 184.95 +15 shipping (199.95 total) for 1080 rounds. I can get brand new boxer primed Federal AE for $208 shipped, why pay this for 15-20 year old berdan?



Well, their website now lists it at $246.60 for 1,440rd case. Excellent ammo, but I'll look elsewhere.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 6:51:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
If this stuff is SHTF-stash worthy, it doesn't matter much if it's Berdan primed, IMO.



10-20 year-old ammo stored in unknown conditions can't shouldn't be used for SHTF. Now if this were new production . . .
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 6:57:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By STG77:
If this stuff is SHTF-stash worthy, it doesn't matter much if it's Berdan primed, IMO.



10-20 year-old ammo stored in unknown conditions can't shouldn't be used for SHTF. Now if this were new production . . .



If it proves extremely reliable, consistent, and retains a very acceptable muzzle velocity, I disagree.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 7:14:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/25/2006 7:18:29 AM EDT by SalemShooterMN]
Got my crate of 1440 ordered from AIM SURPLUS.
Thanks for the heads up!
My calculator figures, even with shipping to Minnesota ($19)
is still less expensive than Walmart Value Packs...
Plus I get another wooden crate.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 7:30:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 7:32:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:
According to another thread I saw here, AIM claimed it will be 184.95 +15 shipping (199.95 total) for 1080 rounds. I can get brand new boxer primed Federal AE for $208 shipped, why pay this for 15-20 year old berdan?



Well, their website now lists it at $246.60 for 1,440rd case. Excellent ammo, but I'll look elsewhere.



$246.50/1440 is the same price as $184.95/1080. All they are doing is throwing in an extra 360rd battlepack at $61.65 per pack.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 8:02:04 AM EDT
They probably changed their mind about the $ 184.95 /1080 because it was priced to close to their Adcom stuff and nobody would buy that while they had the new stuff in stock. This way they can accomodate all budgets.

BD
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:18:47 AM EDT
well... I took the plunge and ordered a case 1440 rds.

wholly crap, I have not even shot 1 rd of the case of ADCOM I got last month .

This year is gonna be interesting.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:58:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Harv24:
well... I took the plunge and ordered a case 1440 rds.

wholly crap, I have not even shot 1 rd of the case of ADCOM I got last month .

This year is gonna be interesting.




LOL... I still have GI 30 carbine and 30.06 from WW2 in bandoliers I bought in the 70's
I haven't got to shoot all up yet.

BD
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 1:59:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By STG77:
If this stuff is SHTF-stash worthy, it doesn't matter much if it's Berdan primed, IMO.



10-20 year-old ammo stored in unknown conditions can't shouldn't be used for SHTF. Now if this were new production . . .




If I get through 1K or so of the stuff with no failures to fire or squibs, then I'm going to SHTF stockpile it like mad.

I've heard that the Army is using 60 year old .50cal ammo in Iraq. If that's good enough for them, 20 year old surplus is good enough for me.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:57:10 PM EDT
I have some of this ammo that is 11 years old (according to the head stamp) and it shoots perfectly. Just a little tarnish, but no dent, dings, or squibs rounds in the lot. Buy with confidence and enjoy.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 5:25:10 PM EDT

I'm going to order some.

Ammo is a bit more robust than some around here seem to believe. You don't have to keep it in an air-conditioned safe!
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:45:53 PM EDT



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron



I just bought a Battle pack to try out, never fired this stuff before but if it's as good as people say it is I'll buy a lot of it for however long it's around, that Chinamart WWB .223 value pack won't cycle for shit out of my Bushmaster, all other 5.56mm rounds cycle just fine, and at this price it's very comparable.
Got ~400 rounds of WWB .223 for sale if anybody wants it.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 9:59:33 PM EDT
I'll buy it. I like the stuff. IM coming to ya.




Originally Posted By dilligaff:



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron



I just bought a Battle pack to try out, never fired this stuff before but if it's as good as people say it is I'll buy a lot of it for however long it's around, that Chinamart WWB .223 value pack won't cycle for shit out of my Bushmaster, all other 5.56mm rounds cycle just fine, and at this price it's very comparable.
Got ~400 rounds of WWB .223 for sale if anybody wants it.

Link Posted: 2/26/2006 12:43:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Black-X:
I'll buy it. I like the stuff. IM coming to ya.




Originally Posted By dilligaff:



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron



I just bought a Battle pack to try out, never fired this stuff before but if it's as good as people say it is I'll buy a lot of it for however long it's around, that Chinamart WWB .223 value pack won't cycle for shit out of my Bushmaster, all other 5.56mm rounds cycle just fine, and at this price it's very comparable.
Got ~400 rounds of WWB .223 for sale if anybody wants it.




Got your IM. Will get right back to ya.
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 12:18:16 PM EDT
My Battle pack IMG has tarnish case`s!

Other than that it was good!

I went for the P.P. M193 from ammoman 2006 headstamp says WOLF on the box but is made by P.P.
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 1:03:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FMJ:
My Battle pack IMG has tarnish case`s!

Other than that it was good!



Can you take pics? Where did you get it from?
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 3:10:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By FMJ:
My Battle pack IMG has tarnish case`s!

Other than that it was good!



Can you take pics? Where did you get it from?



+1 on the pics
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 4:20:47 AM EDT
Guatamalen 5.56 kicked my dog !

Invisiblesou­l
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:43:35 AM EDT
Excuse me for being ignorant, but is the Guatamalen ammo at AIM steel cored or lead cored? Thanks in advance.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:50:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By DoctorCheney223:

Originally Posted By FALARAK:
.17 per round, this stuff will sell, and quickly.



Isn't that what Winchester White Box sells for at Wal-Mart?

thanks,
Ron



WWB is $7.73 + tax at walmart for 40 rounds. That is $.19325 per round (not including tax).

However, you can be assured of the quality AND the brass is great for reloading. Even if you don't reload, you can pick up the brass and sell it for $15/k on the EE.

Total cost would be:
25 boxes at $7.73: $193.25 + 6% tax (11.60) - $15 for brass sale = $189.85 or $.18985 per round.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:54:53 AM EDT

Originally Posted By dilligaff:



When you can get new Winchester 40-packs for $7.30, why pay for ammo that is 15-20 years old, possibly tarnished and not reloadable? I understand inflation, but we are talking ammo, not homes.

J&G Sales has British 5.56 for $179 and it's not tarnished and newer than this stuff. Now add in the Wolf mil-spec, brass-cased M193 rounds and this stuff is no bargain. I wonder what AIM is going to sell this stuff for. Does anybody have an idea?

thanks,
Ron



I just bought a Battle pack to try out, never fired this stuff before but if it's as good as people say it is I'll buy a lot of it for however long it's around, that Chinamart WWB .223 value pack won't cycle for shit out of my Bushmaster, all other 5.56mm rounds cycle just fine, and at this price it's very comparable.
Got ~400 rounds of WWB .223 for sale if anybody wants it.



If WWB won't cycle through your AR, then something is wrong with your AR.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 7:56:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Mpd224:
Excuse me for being ignorant, but is the Guatamalen ammo at AIM steel cored or lead cored? Thanks in advance.



M193 is copper jacket, lead core.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 9:52:44 AM EDT
I just ordered a battlepack of it just to see how good/bad it is. Since it's been a year since I've shot my old SP1 I'll probably burn most of it in that rifle. I know 360 rounds isn't nearly enough, but I want to make sure it's good stuff before I order a case of it.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 9:58:52 AM EDT
I better get out get some shootin' done. The wife says no more ammo until I shoot up my 1800 round plickin' stash.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 5:48:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FALARAK:

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By STG77:
If this stuff is SHTF-stash worthy, it doesn't matter much if it's Berdan primed, IMO.



10-20 year-old ammo stored in unknown conditions can't shouldn't be used for SHTF. Now if this were new production . . .



If it proves extremely reliable, consistent, and retains a very acceptable muzzle velocity, I disagree.



You use USGI AR-15 magazines with Wolff springs and Magpul Gen II followers, but then use 20 year-old ammo . . . Hey, it's your hide.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 5:50:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:
Originally Posted By C-4:
I've heard that the Army is using 60 year old .50cal ammo in Iraq. If that's good enough for them, 20 year old surplus is good enough for me.



You are leaving out a critical point: In the Army, you have no choice but to use what they give you.
Link Posted: 3/1/2006 10:39:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Originally Posted By C-4:
I've heard that the Army is using 60 year old .50cal ammo in Iraq. If that's good enough for them, 20 year old surplus is good enough for me.



You are leaving out a critical point: In the Army, you have no choice but to use what they give you.



True, but I honestly can not remember ever having a cartridge problem ever during my tenure and I dumped god knows how much 5.56, 7.62x51 .45acp, 40mm, 81mm some dated over 10 years previous while eating C-rats that were dated dam near the same...

Besides, Chuck Norris is my Uncle and if SHTF, I'll go hang out with him. He doesn't need no stickin ammo!!

John P..
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 4:53:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Edicut:

Originally Posted By C-4:

Originally Posted By STG77:
Originally Posted By C-4:
I've heard that the Army is using 60 year old .50cal ammo in Iraq. If that's good enough for them, 20 year old surplus is good enough for me.



You are leaving out a critical point: In the Army, you have no choice but to use what they give you.



True, but I honestly can not remember ever having a cartridge problem ever during my tenure and I dumped god knows how much 5.56, 7.62x51 .45acp, 40mm, 81mm some dated over 10 years previous while eating C-rats that were dated dam near the same...

Besides, Chuck Norris is my Uncle and if SHTF, I'll go hang out with him. He doesn't need no stickin ammo!!

John P..



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