I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

Here's one of glass penetration  on a driver...







Just kidding - this is really a deer through the windshield.

    Try this site:
http://www.plusp.com/gallery/gunshotwounds?&page=1
     Copy and paste to your address bar.  Unfortunately it does not show any wounds with .223 but it does show other caliber.  hug.gif

Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

Let him go into combat with just a 1911.

Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

He's a liar or a fool. Hell, he could be both!!

1911's are great, but a sidarm is a backup weapon if your primary fails or you're caught reloading.  

Check out:
www.Box-o-Truth
Our boy took a 2 x 6 pine frame and per his physician, filled the space in with modelers clay.

This way it approximates a human body.

Check out the two pics-.45ACP and THEN,

Check out the .223 PICS.

HOLY ****! The daggone impact left in the clay says it all!

This is all using/wearing ballistic body armour.

CASE CLOSED

Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

Sounds like he wants to be like the Sgt. Major in We Were Soldiers.

Quoted: Check out: www.Box-o-Truth Our boy took a 2 x 6 pine frame and per his physician, filled the space in with modelers clay. This way it approximates a human body. Check out the two pics-.45ACP and THEN, Check out the .223 PICS. HOLY ****! The daggone impact left in the clay says it all! This is all using/wearing ballistic body armour. All I get is the guys emailh.gif CASE CLOSED

Quoted: Check out: www.Box-o-Truth Our boy took a 2 x 6 pine frame and per his physician, filled the space in with modelers clay. This way it approximates a human body that somehow became made of clay for some reason. Check out the two pics-.45ACP and THEN, Check out the .223 PICS. HOLY ****! The daggone impact left in the clay says it all! What does it say?  I can't figure out how (Non-elastic) clay can translate to an elastic medium such as flesh.  If Gumby ever invades he is toast! This is all using/wearing ballistic body armour. CASE CLOSED

Quoted: Here's one of glass penetration  on a driver... i1.tinypic.com/n6ztxf.jpg i1.tinypic.com/n7003c.jpg Just kidding - this is really a deer through the windshield.

LOL. I was shocked at first. Than I saw the hole in the windshield. Ya had me going for a sec. Good one

I shot two large javelina (50 lb +) last weekend with a Mk12 Mod 0 clone.  One at 175 yds and one at 50 yds.  62 gr. RG SS109.  They went down but were not dead, required finishing off.  Ice pick entry and exit holes, no destabilization.  7.62 NATO 147 gr. fmj RG did much more damage at the same ranges and knocked them down in a more conclusive fashion.

tagged

We had a prisoner in Iraq who had been shot three times in the buttocks.  He walked into the camp on his own for medical treatment.  His wounds weren't that bad excpet that one of the bullets went from the back to the front and blew off his junk.

Quoted: We had a prisoner in Iraq who had been shot three times in the buttocks.  He walked into the camp on his own for medical treatment.  His wounds weren't that bad excpet that one of the bullets went from the back to the front and blew off his junk.

IMHO, those two statements should NEVER go together

Quoted: Check out: www.Box-o-Truth Our boy took a 2 x 6 pine frame and per his physician, filled the space in with modelers clay. This way it approximates a human body. Check out the two pics-.45ACP and THEN, Check out the .223 PICS. HOLY ****! The daggone impact left in the clay says it all! This is all using/wearing ballistic body armour. CASE CLOSED

LINK FIXED

Quoted: I shot two large javelina (50 lb +) last weekend with a Mk12 Mod 0 clone.  One at 175 yds and one at 50 yds.  62 gr. RG SS109.  They went down but were not dead, required finishing off.  Ice pick entry and exit holes, no destabilization.  7.62 NATO 147 gr. fmj RG did much more damage at the same ranges and knocked them down in a more conclusive fashion.

isn't SS109 an AP round however?

Quoted: Quoted: I shot two large javelina (50 lb +) last weekend with a Mk12 Mod 0 clone.  One at 175 yds and one at 50 yds.  62 gr. RG SS109.  They went down but were not dead, required finishing off.  Ice pick entry and exit holes, no destabilization.  7.62 NATO 147 gr. fmj RG did much more damage at the same ranges and knocked them down in a more conclusive fashion. isn't SS109 an AP round however?

Not exactly.  It fragments like M193 (not quite as well though), but it has a steel penetrator in front of the lead core (but not an all-steel core or tungsten penetrator like a true AP round such as the M995).

While certainly not a human type goblin, I figure punching through the hair, hide, and shoulder bones would be close.  Ice pick holes in and out.  The one at 175 required two behind the ear, about point blank, also ice pick in and out.  Shot placement is always critical.  I put an RG 7.62 NATO into a 80 lb. boar's left neck/shoulder at 150 while he was moving, quartering toward me.  It  was at a downward angle and punched a hole through about all of his organs in the chest cavity and exited right flank, low, stomach, an exit wound the size of a quarter.  He ran 50 yards squealing and dropped dead.  He was dead when hit, just didn't believe it.  The javelina (a less tough animal, and smaller) took the SS109 through roughly the same vital area, dropped immediately with shoulder and likely some spinal damage, but would have lived a long time had I not finished him off.  By contrast, last year, FNM (Portugese) 7.62 NATO, which I'm quite sure has a thinner jacket, did a great deal more damage at the same ranges, same hits, with exit wounds the size of a fist.  EVERY hog and javelina (2 hogs, 5 javelina) hit with the Portugese FNM (ranges of 50 yds. to 150 yds) was knocked down immediately and was dead, save one that required a followup through the bean at distance.

I've used 5.56 (55 gr. and 62 gr) and 7.62 (147 gr.) for these critters.  The best medicine, by far, is a thin jacketed or hunting point 7.62 NATO.  5.56 will do it, but shot placement is much much more critical.  Thinner skinned and tougher javelina fall to the 5.56.  Decent sized hogs invariably do not unless struck behind the ear or in the head.  Brush and wind deflect the 5.56 a good deal if you have any long shots, such that it is not a good thing to use reliably when there is brush or wind.  Overall, I first choose a 7.62 NATO in a Bush style shorty M1A or at longer ranges my M25 clone.  However,  I would (and have) used the 5.56 and would without a great deal of concern if the M1As where not available.  Apply this to the discussion however.  Also note that the guys shooting all kinds of hunting tip ammo in .270, .260, and .308 were getting similar results, though their shot placement was not as solid as mine.  Semi auto, controlled fire at range, through cover, wind, on any target that could return fire I would choose the 7.62 NATO every single time.   Though I'd not feel scared with a 5.56, it would just be more a matter of shot placement.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I shot two large javelina (50 lb +) last weekend with a Mk12 Mod 0 clone.  One at 175 yds and one at 50 yds.  62 gr. RG SS109.  They went down but were not dead, required finishing off.  Ice pick entry and exit holes, no destabilization.  7.62 NATO 147 gr. fmj RG did much more damage at the same ranges and knocked them down in a more conclusive fashion. isn't SS109 an AP round however? Not exactly.  It fragments like M193 (not quite as well though), but it has a steel penetrator in front of the lead core (but not an all-steel core or tungsten penetrator like a true AP round such as the M995).

I'm all about the M1911 but I've bounced .45 fmj off the skulls off hogs at 15 yds.

Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

You're just some kinda twisted freak aint'cha?!?!?!?

Me for shooting pigs with Nato FMJ calibers?  I don't care to see pictures of people shot with 5.56 to be honest.  My observations of it on hogs pretty much confirms and tracks battlefield accounts.

Quoted: You're just some kinda twisted freak aint'cha?!?!?!?

Quoted: We had a prisoner in Iraq who had been shot three times in the buttocks.  He walked into the camp on his own for medical treatment.  His wounds weren't that bad excpet that one of the bullets went from the back to the front and blew off his junk.

oh mygodAllah!!

As far as combat goes, a pistol is a tool that should only be used to fight your way back to your rifle.


                    Invisiblesoul

Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911.

Got some 7.62www.ogrish.com/archives/iraqi_insurgent_shot_by_m14_rifle_Aug_01_2005.html

opps

I shot a 250 PIG with a 22lr it died on the spot.
Shot placement is a major key

No doubt about it.  However, I've bounced .45 230 fmj off their heads.  Right under or behind the ear or the eye sockets with a pistol or rifle for that matter too.

Quoted: I shot a 250 PIG with a 22lr it died on the spot. Shot placement is a major key

Quoted: No doubt about it.  However, I've bounced .45 230 fmj off their heads.  Right under or behind the ear

Shot placement doesnt just mean hit them in the head, it means hit them in a place that will drop them.  Same goes for people.  If you're trying to drop someone using a rock, and they're wearing a helmet, you're not going to drop them by hitting them in the head, so you aim for somewhere that will drop them- perhaps in the junk...

Heck, I thought that self evident, kind of like shooting for the CNS.  Obviously if they are armored up or hiding behind a car, one shoots where they ain't armored, skips bullets under the car, etc.

Quoted: Quoted: No doubt about it.  However, I've bounced .45 230 fmj off their heads.  Right under or behind the ear Shot placement doesnt just mean hit them in the head, it means hit them in a place that will drop them.  Same goes for people.  If you're trying to drop someone using a rock, and they're wearing a helmet, you're not going to drop them by hitting them in the head, so you aim for somewhere that will drop them- perhaps in the junk...

Quoted: Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911. Got some 7.62www.ogrish.com/archives/iraqi_insurgent_shot_by_m14_rifle_Aug_01_2005.html

Now I am a mostly 7.62x51 guy,  but don't you think that a 5.56 placed in the head would do the

same??

I am at a point where I just don't know what I want I want to carry/stockpile anymore; 7.62 or

5.56,  especially since cheaper, good surplus 308 has seriously started to dry up.

should have been drafted in the 60's and gone to Nam.  could have seen a few hundred thousand......

Quoted: Quoted: We had a prisoner in Iraq who had been shot three times in the buttocks.  He walked into the camp on his own for medical treatment.  His wounds weren't that bad excpet that one of the bullets went from the back to the front and blew off his junk. IMHO, those two statements should NEVER go together

NO KIDDING!!!!!!!!!  My next wound would be self-inflicted.

I wanna see some M262 wounds.  

As for M855 I've seen a couple 5.56 wound pics along with some 203 hits from Iraq.  THe 556 resulted in death.  Couldnt tell anything about the wound except the massive loss of blood and the way the guy was slummped it appeared to be a near instant incapacitation.  Looked like right under the rib cage near center.

When i start to question whether the m855 has the ability to kill/severely wound someone. I think of the video of the poor , defenceless RPG toting iraqi guy that gets shot by the SAW gunner. I can't remember where the video is posted , but its quite easy to find. Long story short , guy gets hit with 2 , 3rd bursts, first burst knocks him down with multiple chest shots , second burst hits him in the head , instant death.

Well yeah, a .22 magnum would have done the same  thing.  Point is what has been hacked out here too many times;  people wearing gear, running, behind cars, debris, vegetation, trees, brush, shooting back, at long distance, with a crosswind, etc. ideally require something more than 5.56.  It's a decent round and excellent in a combined arms / FA mode.  I have two more ARs than I do M14 clones.  The SS109 and M855 invariably have punched icepick holes through the game (wild hogs, boar, javelina) I've shot.  Uninspiring and requires perfect shot placement.  Nonvital shots and they are gone.  .308, even in FMJ with thin jackets, is much much more effective in my experience.  I won't take a shot at 300 yds with a crosswind with 5.56.  I will with a 7.62.

Quoted: Well yeah, a .22 magnum would have done the same  thing.  Point is what has been hacked out here too many times;  people wearing gear, running, behind cars, debris, vegetation, trees, brush, shooting back, at long distance, with a crosswind, etc. ideally require something more than 5.56.  It's a decent round and excellent in a combined arms / FA mode.  I have two more ARs than I do M14 clones.  The SS109 and M855 invariably have punched icepick holes through the game (wild hogs, boar, javelina) I've shot.  Uninspiring and requires perfect shot placement.  Nonvital shots and they are gone.  .308, even in FMJ with thin jackets, is much much more effective in my experience.  I won't take a shot at 300 yds with a crosswind with 5.56.  I will with a 7.62.

Until you've actually shot SOMEONE with 5.56, STFU!

Tiny intellect you have there Dagina, thanks for sharing.  I'm sure you have slain thousands with your M4 at 300+ meters with all kinds of rails, lasers, etc.   There, feel better about yourself now little fella?  .

Quoted: Quoted: Well yeah, a .22 magnum would have done the same  thing.  Point is what has been hacked out here too many times;  people wearing gear, running, behind cars, debris, vegetation, trees, brush, shooting back, at long distance, with a crosswind, etc. ideally require something more than 5.56.  It's a decent round and excellent in a combined arms / FA mode.  I have two more ARs than I do M14 clones.  The SS109 and M855 invariably have punched icepick holes through the game (wild hogs, boar, javelina) I've shot.  Uninspiring and requires perfect shot placement.  Nonvital shots and they are gone.  .308, even in FMJ with thin jackets, is much much more effective in my experience.  I won't take a shot at 300 yds with a crosswind with 5.56.  I will with a 7.62. Until you've actually shot SOMEONE with 5.56, STFU!

Not a pic of a body but a pic of the result of dumbass Iraqi driver + M855 through windshield @ about 250 yards = lots of blood.  


One of my guys took the pic.  It was taken in 2004 near Fallujah after a firefight.

M855 works!

Thanks for the pic.  The windshield looks fine.  The rear glass is all shot out.  It is my understanding that windshield is the toughest thing to get through.  Regular ole side autoglass is not as tough as it is designed to crack in little pieces, whereas windshield has laminated layers which strip the jackets from bullets.  It is my understanding that windshields are especially hard on .223.  Oh, and Dagina, I have shot through windshields and autoglass on junked vehicles with various calibers.

Ask for ARKittyCat or something like that.  He shoots deer and pigs with M193 and the damage is almost unbelieveable....very impressive.

I probably need to switch to M193.  Next go round I will and report up.  .223 is not a favored calibre for hogs.  The shoulder area and bones are very thick, as is the hide.  I've tried the 62 gr. so as to provide penetration.  Zip zip in and out, same size.  The last one penetrated through shoulder bone, muscle, hide, hair, and did not destabilize nor disrupt.....ice pick in, ice pick out.  BUT, it did put him down.

Quoted: Quoted: I want some pictures of 5.56mm wounds on humans. Guy a work says its weak and he'd rather go in combat with a 1911. Sounds like he wants to be like the Sgt. Major in We Were Soldiers.

SGT MAJ Plumly did not need an M16. His job is not to shoot and maneuver, his is a logistics/supply/personnel type role. If he was close enough to the action to need a rifle...

Quoted: Tiny intellect you have there Dagina, thanks for sharing.  I'm sure you have slain thousands with your M4 at 300+ meters with all kinds of rails, lasers, etc.   There, feel better about yourself now little fella?  . Quoted: Quoted: Well yeah, a .22 magnum would have done the same  thing.  Point is what has been hacked out here too many times;  people wearing gear, running, behind cars, debris, vegetation, trees, brush, shooting back, at long distance, with a crosswind, etc. ideally require something more than 5.56.  It's a decent round and excellent in a combined arms / FA mode.  I have two more ARs than I do M14 clones.  The SS109 and M855 invariably have punched icepick holes through the game (wild hogs, boar, javelina) I've shot.  Uninspiring and requires perfect shot placement.  Nonvital shots and they are gone.  .308, even in FMJ with thin jackets, is much much more effective in my experience.  I won't take a shot at 300 yds with a crosswind with 5.56.  I will with a 7.62. Until you've actually shot SOMEONE with 5.56, STFU!

Bro, watch it. On the internet you have NO idea who you are talking to. For all we know that dajini feller is a genuine snake eater who has killed a lot of people. In fact, from his tone and speech I suspect he has killed someone with 5.56mm.

BTW, my hobby is studying terminal ballistics. People who shoot people for their paychecks tell me that 5.56 does pretty good, and that 7.62 isnt enough of an improvement to warrant the size and weight.

Let's see Jack, we are having a civilized discussion and some little feller chimes in to proclaim "STFU" for no reason.   That is the sign of someone that is not squared away and/or has a complex.  Jack, you assume too much and underestimate just as much, though I appreciate your concern for my safety .  Regardless who Dagina is, says he is, purports to be, or wishes he was, his comments are out of line.   Dagina has acted this way before, so this is just a petty attack from a petty person.  Lots of smack spoken on the internet by people who in person would be a lot more polite.  Lots of BS on internet forums spoken by people who know not what they speak and represent themselves as what they are not.  The "snake eaters" (LOL) I know don't engage in slinging petty moronic insults on internet forums.  Someone chiming into a civilized discussion between adult men, telling someone to "STFU" usually ends up missing teeth or in the ER.  That's why no one does that in person, but they do it on internet forums where they imagine themselves to be tough and important.  The lack of civility and little man complexes are amazing.

As for this discussion, it comes up all the time.  All I have done is reported what I have seen and experienced.  I've shot a 100 lb. boar through the center of the chest with 7.62 NATO, bullet exiting his ass cheek and he ran 75 yds before dropping stone dead.  Again, 7.62 cuts cover, bucks wind, and puts em down more solid than 5.56 from everything I've seen and personally experienced.  Read similar first person accounts and talked to guys who said the same thing.  That doesn't mean the 5.56 is inferior.  It means through cover and in wind I prefer a 7.62.  It is silly to argue otherwise.  The photo above shows rounds entering the side glass of that vehicle, not the windshield.  HUGE difference in a windshield and side glass.

Quoted: Let's see Jack, we are having a civilized discussion and some little feller chimes in to proclaim "STFU" for no reason.   That is the sign of someone that is not squared away and/or has a complex.  Jack, you assume too much and underestimate just as much, though I appreciate your concern for my safety .  Regardless who Dagina is, says he is, purports to be, or wishes he was, his comments are out of line.   Dagina has acted this way before, so this is just a petty attack from a petty person.  Lots of smack spoken on the internet by people who in person would be a lot more polite.  Lots of BS on internet forums spoken by people who know not what they speak and represent themselves as what they are not.  The "snake eaters" (LOL) I know don't engage in slinging petty moronic insults on internet forums.  Someone chiming into a civilized discussion between adult men, telling someone to "STFU" usually ends up missing teeth or in the ER.  That's why no one does that in person, but they do it on internet forums where they imagine themselves to be tough and important.  The lack of civility and little man complexes are amazing. As for this discussion, it comes up all the time.  All I have done is reported what I have seen and experienced.  I've shot a 100 lb. boar through the center of the chest with 7.62 NATO, bullet exiting his ass cheek and he ran 75 yds before dropping stone dead.  Again, 7.62 cuts cover, bucks wind, and puts em down more solid than 5.56 from everything I've seen and personally experienced.  Read similar first person accounts and talked to guys who said the same thing.  That doesn't mean the 5.56 is inferior.  It means through cover and in wind I prefer a 7.62.  It is silly to argue otherwise.  The photo above shows rounds entering the side glass of that vehicle, not the windshield.   HUGE difference in a windshield and side glass.

Not true.  I didn't explain it well enough.  I know the pic doesn't show it too well but the bullet was fired into the front windshield as it approached our position.  The bullet penetrated the windshield and hit the driver in the head.  I'n sorry I don't have a pic of the driver.  I'll see if I can post a better pic of the front windshield.

Here it is.  If you look at the windshield you can see a single bullet hole.  

Colt, gotcha.  It must have icepicked right on in.  That is impressive at that distance through glass, but I believe the M855 was designed to penetrate.  Like I said, for a similar bullet, an RG SS109, to go clean through a big javelina's shoulder etc. and exit without disruption at almost 200 yds, well, that's pretty stable and penetrating.  EDIT-  also seeing that pic, that is solid shooting at 200.

I have another picture of a head shot with 5.56 but it might be too graphic here.  If the mods don't mind I'll post it but only if they don't care.

Quoted: Colt, gotcha.  It must have icepicked right on in.  That is impressive at that distance through glass, but I believe the M855 was designed to penetrate.  Like I said, for a similar bullet, an RG SS109, to go clean through a big javelina's shoulder etc. and exit without disruption at almost 200 yds, well, that's pretty stable and penetrating.  EDIT-  also seeing that pic, that is solid shooting at 200.

The guy that made the shot is a very good shot.  He's competed with various firearms.

I see that Colt.  One for the driver, one for the passenger.  Not alot of nonsense and no spray and pray, that's for sure.  Great pics bro.