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Posted: 2/4/2006 6:22:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/5/2006 2:33:26 PM EDT by mfingar]
Then identify them...



ETA: Nobdoy's gotten them all yet...I'll post answers later tonight. (ANSWERS BELOW)
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 7:00:01 PM EDT
1. Blank
2. Tracer (Red Tip)
3. Training (Blue Tip)
4. AP (Black Tip)
5. XM193
6. WWB 55gr (wally world stuff, not Q3131)
7. Wolf
8. Blazer
9-11. That polymer cased crap
12. Barnul aluminum case
13. ?
14. ?
15. Looks like a Federal SP
16. Is that Simunition?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 7:07:47 PM EDT
All are .223/5.56mm

1. M200 Blank
2. M856 Tracer
3. M855
4. M995 AP
5. M193
6. M193? South African? Where have I seen that crimp before...
7. Wolf Polymer 55gr FMJ
8. Wolf Polymer 62gr FMJ
9. PCA/NATEC "M855"
10. PCA/NATEC 55gr
11. PCA/NATEC 55gr
12. Winchester Supreme Silvertip
13. Experimental Duplex Ball
14. Experimental Armor Piercing / Incindiary
15. Some kind of expanding bullet cartridge (game cartridge)
16. Israeli "less-lethal" round? Simunitions?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 7:46:17 PM EDT
1. M200 Blank
2. M856 Tracer
3. M855
4. M995 AP (could also be Igman/Hotshot SS109)
5. M193 (Q3131, Q3131A, XM193...but without an annealed neck, my guess is commercial 55gr, .223 pressure
6. WWB 55gr FMJ
7. Wolf Polymer 55gr FMJ
8. Wolf Polymer 62gr FMJ
9. PCA/NATEC Sierria Blitzking...55gr IIRC
10. PCA/NATEC "855"
11. PCA/NATEC 55gr
12. Winchester Supreme Silvertip
13. Experimental Duplex Ball
14. Experimental Armor Piercing / Incindiary
15. Winchester Power Point... 64gr
16. TTI subsonic?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 9:27:41 PM EDT
1. M200 blank
2. M856 tracer
3. M855
4. M995 AP
5. Q3131A
6. Q3131
7. Wolf 55 gr.
8. Wolf 62 gr.
9. PCA Natec 50 gr. ballistic tip?
10. PCA Natec 62 gr.
11. PCA Natec 55 gr.
12. Winchester .223 55 gr. Silver Tip
13. Black Hills 50 gr. VMAX?
14. Winchester .223 55 gr. FMJ
15. Winchester .223 55 gr. SP
16. IMI plastic bullet?

Link Posted: 2/4/2006 10:18:33 PM EDT
Number 2 is not M856, M856 has an orange tip. It is the older tracer that goes with M193, I think it is M196 but I am not sure. Number 4 or 5 would get my vote for M193, but the case is too shiney, so probably AE 55 grn. or another manufacturer. 3 would be some foriegn SS109 round due to the color of the tip and nice looking case, maybe S&B? 4 is probably Ingman (Hotshot) SS109 re-painted black, certainly not M995. 1 is a blank, but it is not Violet colored on the tip so I can't say without seeing the rim.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 10:33:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 10:34:00 PM EDT by Bushwacker85]

Originally Posted By wyv3rn:
All are .223/5.56mm

1. M200 Blank
2. M856 Tracer
3. M855
4. M995 AP
5. M193
6. M193? South African? Where have I seen that crimp before...
7. Wolf Polymer 55gr FMJ
8. Wolf Polymer 62gr FMJ
9. PCA/NATEC "M855"
10. PCA/NATEC 55gr
11. PCA/NATEC 55gr
12. Winchester Supreme Silvertip
13. Experimental Duplex Ball
14. Experimental Armor Piercing / Incindiary
15. Some kind of expanding bullet cartridge (game cartridge)
16. Israeli "less-lethal" round? Simunitions?



You've seen that crimp on Q3131.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 12:17:12 AM EDT
Last one is subsonic ES ammo 127 grain.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 12:40:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mfingar:
Then identify them...

i2.photobucket.com/albums/y44/mfingar/Misc/ammo.jpg

1: The ammo used by Al Pacino in the movie HEAT
2: 120mm smoothbore sabot round
3: 120mm smoothbore HEAT round (no relation to Al Pacino or the movie)
4: 120mm smoothbore training round
5: 155mm artillery round
6: Q31313131313131313131
7: Wolf ammo
8: More Wolf ammo
9: 5.56 designer round in feminine colors
10: Evil black case round for EBR's
11: 10mm, explosive tip, caseless (standard light armor piercing round)
12: Super long range (2000m) round, guaranteed 0.5in group at max range
13: Experimental incendiary round in 5.56mm (30meter blast radius)
14: 5.56mm armor piercing round (perfect for main battle tanks but will not penetrate a loaf of bread)
15: 5.56mm extremely hi-velocity soft point (perfect round for Elk and other large game)
16: JDAM



Link Posted: 2/5/2006 1:23:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By danpass:

Originally Posted By mfingar:
Then identify them...

i2.photobucket.com/albums/y44/mfingar/Misc/ammo.jpg

1: The ammo used by Al Pacino in the movie HEAT
2: 120mm smoothbore sabot round
3: 120mm smoothbore HEAT round (no relation to Al Pacino or the movie)
4: 120mm smoothbore training round
5: 155mm artillery round
6: Q31313131313131313131
7: Wolf ammo
8: More Wolf ammo
9: 5.56 designer round in feminine colors
10: Evil black case round for EBR's
11: 10mm, explosive tip, caseless (standard light armor piercing round)
12: Super long range (2000m) round, guaranteed 0.5in group at max range
13: Experimental incendiary round in 5.56mm (30meter blast radius)
14: 5.56mm armor piercing round (perfect for main battle tanks but will not penetrate a loaf of bread)
15: 5.56mm extremely hi-velocity soft point (perfect round for Elk and other large game)
16: JDAM






^^^ I like the way this man thinks.

JDAM....priceless...
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 2:34:39 PM EDT
You guysreally know your ammo (for the most part)

Here are the answers:

1: M200 Blank (0 grain)
2: M856 Tracer (63.7 grain)
3: M855 Ball (62 grain)
4: M995 (AP)
5: M193 (55 grain)
6: Winchester WWB (55 grain FMJ)
7: Wolf (55 grain, FMJ)
8: Wolf (62 grain, FMJ)
9: PCA - Spectrum (55 grain Sierra Blitzking)
10: PCA - Spectrum (69 grain Sierra Matchking HPBT)
11: PCA - Spectrum (55 grain FMJ)
12: Winchester Supreme Ballistic Silvertip (55 grain)
13: Federal Premium V-Shock (55 grain)
14: Hornady V-MAX MOLY (55 Grain)
15: Engel Ballistic Research (63-grain) Subsonic
16: Extreme Shock (127 grain) Subsonic
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 3:01:00 PM EDT
Doubtful that #4 is M995.

Try Bosnian SS109....
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 3:03:35 PM EDT

1, 6, 7, and 8

I still say #16 is a JDAM


Link Posted: 2/5/2006 4:14:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By uglygun:
Doubtful that #4 is M995.

Try Bosnian SS109....



Why?
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 5:16:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By uglygun:
Doubtful that #4 is M995.

Try Bosnian SS109....



Actually, I think you're correct...look at the cannelure.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 5:19:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mfingar:

Originally Posted By uglygun:
Doubtful that #4 is M995.

Try Bosnian SS109....



Actually, I think you're correct...look at the cannelure.



Excuse me for being stupid, or for asking a stupid question. but this is why I lurk this forum so often to learn new stuff. How can you tell the difference in the cannelure?
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 5:25:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/5/2006 5:26:28 PM EDT by mfingar]

Originally Posted By fiend:

Originally Posted By mfingar:

Originally Posted By uglygun:
Doubtful that #4 is M995.

Try Bosnian SS109....



Actually, I think you're correct...look at the cannelure.



Excuse me for being stupid, or for asking a stupid question. but this is why I lurk this forum so often to learn new stuff. How can you tell the difference in the cannelure?



I don't think M995 has a cannelure....(I may be wrong)

I'm certain I have some M995 floating around here, but also remember getting some Bosnian Black-Tip at a gunshow about 5 years ago (I think he's correct, and I was wrong)...
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 6:56:50 AM EDT
#1 is a blank cartidge (M200)
Round #2 is a Hornady V-max. That is a plastic tip, not painted.
#3 looks a lot like S&B SS109. The paint and case are too nice for M855. Also the shade of green is darker than M855.
#4 is Hot-shot SS109
#5 and #6 are commercial .223. Those are NOT M193 or XM193. Cases are too shiny.
#7 and #8 are Wolf loads (55 and 62 gr)
#12 is a Winchester 50-gr silver tip.

The hell with the others.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 2:47:51 PM EDT
Number 4 is not M995. I have fired thousands of rounds of M995 AP ammo made by Bofors and it does not have a black tip, rather it is all black and it does not have a cannelure. Number 4 appears to be Bosnian SS109 or a gun show rip-off with a black tip. M995 is EXTREMELY rare and coveted even in the military, almost none of it is availible outside well funded units. To see this in the civilian world would be highly unlikely and illegal. This is not something your cousin in the NG can get for you. It really doesn't exist outside of special operations units and results have been mixed. Lethality is generally quite poor as it does not fragment and has a tendency to "ice-pick" rather than yaw. Even with just yawing as a wounding mechanisim, its inferior to M855. M995 is not intended to be a general issue round. It is mainly used when the situation dictates. Private

serurity personel are probably the biggest user in Iraq. They are primairly limited to 5.56 weapons and require an anti-vehicle capability, which a SAW loaded with M995 certainly provides. Its an also extremely effective combo for manning road blocks. While M995 is extremely effective against vehicles, 5.56 in general is a little small to be shooting at "stuff". 7.62x51 is a much better choice for anti-vehicles and anti-barrier activity, especially with AP ammo. A Mk48Mod0 with AP ammo is certainly capable of dropping a Helo or ventilating a BMP/Unimog. While M995 increases 5.56 capability against vehicles and such, it drastically reduces lethality. For this type of duty, 7.62 NATO is far superior and retains acceptible levels of lethality and penetration. In summation, your picture does not depict M995 ammo and I would wager that you most certainly DO NOT have any examples of M995 in your collection....if you do, good for you just don't prove me wrong because its illegal, oh...and its stolen. An excellent post, though....
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:30:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ryno_the_wyno:
Number 4 is not M995. I have fired thousands of rounds of M995 AP ammo made by Bofors and it does not have a black tip, rather it is all black and it does not have a cannelure. Number 4 appears to be Bosnian SS109 or a gun show rip-off with a black tip. M995 is EXTREMELY rare and coveted even in the military, almost none of it is availible outside well funded units. To see this in the civilian world would be highly unlikely and illegal. This is not something your cousin in the NG can get for you. It really doesn't exist outside of special operations units and results have been mixed. Lethality is generally quite poor as it does not fragment and has a tendency to "ice-pick" rather than yaw. Even with just yawing as a wounding mechanisim, its inferior to M855. M995 is not intended to be a general issue round. It is mainly used when the situation dictates. Private

serurity personel are probably the biggest user in Iraq. They are primairly limited to 5.56 weapons and require an anti-vehicle capability, which a SAW loaded with M995 certainly provides. Its an also extremely effective combo for manning road blocks. While M995 is extremely effective against vehicles, 5.56 in general is a little small to be shooting at "stuff". 7.62x51 is a much better choice for anti-vehicles and anti-barrier activity, especially with AP ammo. A Mk48Mod0 with AP ammo is certainly capable of dropping a Helo or ventilating a BMP/Unimog. While M995 increases 5.56 capability against vehicles and such, it drastically reduces lethality. For this type of duty, 7.62 NATO is far superior and retains acceptible levels of lethality and penetration. In summation, your picture does not depict M995 ammo and I would wager that you most certainly DO NOT have any examples of M995 in your collection....if you do, good for you just don't prove me wrong because its illegal, oh...and its stolen. An excellent post, though....



So there!!!
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:08:33 AM EDT
I really wasn't trying to be a "dick", I promise so I hope it didn't come accross that way.
I see so many gun-show con artists who are taking 55 and 62grn FMJ *penetrator or not* and painting the tip black. I have even seen some which have been done with a Sharpie and some that had been done so quickly the paint came off on my hand. These bastards are taking 4.00 ammo and selling for obscene amounts of money claiming that its M995....as paranoid as these fuck-tards usually are, there isn't any way they would give the BATF an open invitation to seize all thier stuff and perform a colonoscopy with a search warrant. I was just trying to set the record straight and hopefully disuade anyone from buying "black tip" ammo marketed as M995. Sorry if I was a little wild.
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