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Posted: 9/17/2003 11:26:55 AM EDT
the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/rifle.html

Scroll down that page in the above link until you get to the .223 section. Look at what it says beside the Q3131A product....."Winchester .223 Rem, made in the USA or Q3131A load made in Israel (while supplies last as Israel has suspended the Winchester manufacturing contract--please specify if Q3131A is desired)".

Is this really true? And if so, does that mean we are down to the Federal XM193 for new production M193 spec ammo? Or will Winchester continue the M193 product by producing their own again (Q3131) or giving the contract to someone else?

-Charging Handle
Link Posted: 9/17/2003 11:46:07 AM EDT
IMI and American Ammunition have an agreement to produce ammo so maybe they'll dump the load on them. CRC
Link Posted: 9/17/2003 9:00:16 PM EDT
I asked a similar question about a month ago when I had trouble finding it at a wholesaler who's earlier catalogs contained it while it was absent in later catalogs. I know I can get the same performance from Federal but the Winchester cases are always so durn pretty. Plus, I like to support Winchester for all their cheap 100 rd Value Packs they provide Wal-Mart with. I've given up hope on a post regarding Win. Q3269 (M855) and Q3270 (M856 60-grn) that I posted around the same time. A law enforcement wholesaler has the Q3269 for about 4.75 per 20 while the Q3270 is around 7.50 per 20. I'm puzzled why the numbers never get mentioned. Thank you for tolerating my pointless post. I just felt like typing.
Link Posted: 9/17/2003 10:01:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/17/2003 10:07:05 PM EDT by wyv3rn]
With the way things have been heating up in Israel lately, I wouldn't be suprised if IMI is busy supplying thier government with ammunition. Israel voted to remove Arafat and I'm sure they know that they could be sitting in the middle of a major war if they go through with that. Who knows who would jump in. But obviously they can't go on the way they are, they are at their wicks end. They've tried everything and bent over backwards but groups like Hamas and Islamic Jihad don't listen to reason, and they don't care about two countries living side by side. They want Israel DEAD AND GONE. If they're going to follow through with removing Arafat, they are going to be stocking up BIG TIME. Also, our government has repeatedly told them they can't go after the people that terrorize them because it is in OUR national interest to appease the eastern world, to act like we actually want the two sides to come to a mutual agreement. Imagine you're a business owner in the United States. Suicide bombs go off left and right, it's part of life and everyone is afraid because it can happen any time, any where. You are living in fear and your sales are poor because no one wants to come out or go anywhere. Your livelyhood is threatend and your ability to take care of your family and put food on the table is jeopardized. YOU ARE A STARVING SLAVE AND A PRISONER IN YOUR OWN HOME. The entire world is telling you, SORRY you just have to live with the constant suicide bombing. As a business owner (IMI for instance), and a man trying to take care of his family you might just say "f*ck them" and cut ties with the companies who support governments that try to screw you because their politics are more important to them than your life.
Link Posted: 9/18/2003 12:05:44 PM EDT
Was that a "yes" or a "no"? ;)
Link Posted: 9/18/2003 1:12:15 PM EDT
I bought two 1000rd cases of q3131a from Miwallcorp.com at the last fun show for 159.00 a case. They had pallets of it, 2003 production..
Link Posted: 10/11/2003 8:19:42 PM EDT
From the information that I got at the last two gun shows here the answer is yes. I was told by 2 different dealers one being MiWall that what Q3131A is in the U.S. now is all that we will be getting. They also said that Winchester will only be selling what Q3131A they have stockpiled to LE agencies. I don't know if this is true or just a way for you to be other ammo or not, but it was interesting to have two different dealers tell me the same thing. XM193 isn't the nicest looking but prices on it seem to be coming down now though. I guess that is what I will start buying.
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