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Posted: 6/12/2003 8:33:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/12/2003 8:46:45 AM EDT by RussB]
All rounds were fired from a RRA CAR UTE 16" heavy barrel, 1-9" twist. A sandbag rest was used.

Aimpoint ML2 was used. All shooting done @ 100 yards, over the course of several days. The scope was adjusted over the course of the shooting, so POI is not indicative of the groupings shown.

The (Chrony brand) chronograph was set-up 12' ahead of the muzzle. Temps were in the 70's each day, bright & sunny. Low humidity.

55 Grain

Federal/XM193 – 3094fps 39fps
Win/Q3131A – 3079fps 13fps
Sellier & Bellot – 3076fps 62fps
PMP – 2972fps 100fps
DynaMax - 2946fps 156fps
Rem-UMC – 2857fps 59fps
Winchester – 2856fps 147fps
Wolf – 2728fps 151fps
PMC - 2720fps 150fps

62 Grain

S&B SS109 – 2986fps 143fps
Silver Bear – 2907fps 108fps
Winchester – 2786fps 84fps
Wolf – 2644fps 140fps























Link Posted: 6/13/2003 7:44:04 AM EDT
Thank you! =)
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:16:15 AM EDT
Awesome.. Thanks!
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:57:37 AM EDT
That's good info, thanks for posting it!
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 9:34:36 AM EDT
EXCELLENT info! Thanks a lot!
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 4:37:08 PM EDT
Thank you for going to the trouble of posting the pics/info. This is what keeps this site informative and interesting.
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 11:01:02 PM EDT
Wow... all i can say is... wow Now, whats your impression of the best overall round? Any info on FTE/FTF problems or the like?
Link Posted: 6/17/2003 5:30:01 PM EDT
Out standing marine.Could'nt have asked for better.I appreciate the effort,THANX.
Link Posted: 6/17/2003 7:27:31 PM EDT
Any info on FTE/FTF problems or the like?
View Quote
There were no FTE's/FTF's with all ammo tried. A variety of USGI 20 & 30 round mags, along with some Thermold's were used. Overall impressions? The Q3131A, PMP and S&B ss109 were very accurate out of my particular gun. All the "Russian" stuff left a lot to be desired in accuracy, as did the Wal-Mart/Winchester "value pack" ammo. With the limited amount of Fed/XM193 that I fired (40 rounds) I found the recoil and muzzle flash to be out of proportion to it's performance (note that Q3131A averaged a mere 15fps slower, but was more consistent) IMHO, S&B 55gr ammo is a great value @ $150 a case. It's too bad I didn't/couldn't use a powered scope to get better accuracy results...
Link Posted: 6/27/2003 12:05:04 PM EDT
PMP is some really good stuff my 16 bushy Shorty A1/C7 loves it! Also likes Q3131A a bit better than XM193! Also the ZV SS109 Green Box wich doesnt have the Sellier Bellot logo but is suppose to be SB? I sent Chuck S. A box to test he came up with 3184FPS and a SD of 14! Great stuff!!
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 8:47:49 AM EDT
back up, just for the hell of it!
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 9:14:01 AM EDT
Great job and real good info. I lean toward the Q3131A stuff also. Not only from the accuracy stand point but also from the reliability end too.
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 10:19:46 AM EDT
What ammunition did you zero your rifle with initially? Thanks for the post and the info.
Link Posted: 9/13/2003 5:33:17 PM EDT
The only complaint I have is that you did not fire the same number of rounds of each ammo type. Statistically speaking, those groups are not comparable for that reason. Good effort though.
Link Posted: 9/13/2003 5:51:38 PM EDT
HeavyMetal whined,
The only complaint I have is that you did not fire the same number of rounds of each ammo type. Statistically speaking, those groups are not comparable for that reason.
View Quote
Sorry the effort disappointed you. It is by no means some diffintive ammunition test...just some casual shooting that I figured I'd share. dcoke76, I used the S&B .223 55gr.
Link Posted: 9/13/2003 5:58:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2003 6:05:50 PM EDT by HeavyMetal]
Whined???? Apparently, some of us cannot take constructive criticism offered in good faith without seeing it as a personal attack. Did I say I was dissapointed? Did I say you "Fucked up"??? Did I just shit in your wheaties or something? What I said was a simple statement of fact and not meant to call into question your worth as a human being. If you study statistical methodology, you will realize the nature of the comment and not take it as a personal put-down. Did I not say "Good Effort" or was that just me whining? In the immortal words of Warren Oates, "Lighten up, Frances!"
Link Posted: 9/13/2003 6:20:30 PM EDT
I said "whinned" You ranted (overreacted?) then told me to "lighten up"...No, you lighten up! (it's all in jest, you know) I'm lightened! Too bad this thread took such a negative turn.
Link Posted: 9/13/2003 6:42:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2003 6:49:29 PM EDT by HeavyMetal]
Look Russ, I am sure you are a fine fellow. Not trying to rain on your parade. As I said, you did some hard work. I am a scientist by profession and when I see somebody do an experiment, I want it to be statistically valid so I can draw a definitive conclusion (X is demonstrably better than Y for example). Its not that I am dissapointed or trying to cast asperison of your efforts, its just that you came [b]so close[/b]! If only you had kept the number of rounds fired per group the same. For example: If you fire a 15 shot group [i]with the same ammo from the same rifle with all other conditions being the same[/i] and then fire a 5 shot group with the same ammo and set-up, the 15 shot group will almost always be larger. Therefore if you have two different brands of ammo that are equally accurate in fact and you fire a 15 shot group of brand X and a 5 shot group of brand Y, brand Y will almost certainly give a smaller group and this could lead one to the erroneous conclusion that Y is superior to X when in fact, both are equal. Even worse, you could have a scenario where Y is slightly inferior to X. In this scenario, the measurer useses a sample size of 15 rounds for a grouping of X and a sample size of 5 for a grouping of Y. X produces a larger grouping than Y leading to the conclusion, on the surface, that Y is superior to X when in fact the opposite is the case. If you fire equal numbered shot group of both, then both should give equal groupings (more or less). (especially if you use groupings of 10 to 15 shots and take averages amongst several groupings of each) That is all I am trying to say.
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