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Posted: 4/28/2003 1:32:06 PM EDT
Just to make things interesting the last two times I was at the range I brought a water filled gallon plastic milk jug. Last week I filled the jug about 85% shot it with XM193 out of my 20" Bushmaster. It was 75 yards down range and it had obvious entry and exit points.

Today just to try something different I filled the jug to full point for milk, leaving the typical air space near the cap. Also I used some 5-minute epoxy to glue on the plastic cap. I wanted to see what would happen if the shock wave was contained (keeping the top from popping off). This time I put the jug 25 yards down range and again shot it with XM193 and the same 20” Bushmaster.

I had a rather interesting result; at least I think so. There was no exit point. The jug busted open from the shock wave and I found the copper jacket and some of the lead still inside the jug. I’m guessing that what wasn’t found in the jug was washed out by the exiting water. So do you find it strange or normal that a 55-grain XM193 (Lot 5) would not pass through a flimsy gallon jug of water? It says a lot about fragmentation but not much for penetration. Of course this was a one-time event and not intended as an experiment. But I would like to give it another shot. I will have to get my research assistants (my kids) to drink more milk.

I brought the remains home; I'll try and post some pics later.
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 2:42:23 PM EDT
I've had similar fun milk jug experiments. I've shot them at 100yds completely full with PMC plinking ammo and it would just punch a hole in the jug. Then I've shot them at about 25 yds with the same ammo and the jug explodes. I wonder if this could correlate to the fragmentation velocities for 55gr bullets. My next experiment will be to place jugs at 25, 50, 100, 200 etc. and shoot them with M193 to see at what range the bullets will stop fragmenting. Oh and if you need to kill a milk jug at 200-500yds. The Hornaday VMAX 168gr .308 does a very nice job. This bullet also explodes and creates several exit holes also leaving the jacket and bullet fragments inside the jug. Disclaimer: We all know milk jugs filled with water is not viable ballistic medium so don't give us a hard time about it. [:)]
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 3:46:55 PM EDT
To get a better seal, try 2-liter soda bottles refilled with water. If you hit it, it will explode. G23c
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 8:53:55 PM EDT
Me Too. I've shot them at 100 yards with PMC, XM193, and my M193 'clone' load. I have found similar results with the XM193 and my 'clone'. I also taped the caps down with duct tape (over the lid and down the sides). Catostrophic explosion, with front and sides blown out, and no visible exit hole. PMC just passes through, punching two 22 caliber holes and doing little damage. PMC is loaded pretty light, so I'd guess it's under the fragmentation threshold at 100yd. As to why XM193 and my load don't appear to penetrate further, it's a mystery to me, too. Hardly scientific, but fun!
Link Posted: 4/29/2003 10:09:01 PM EDT
you want to see the jugs really explode use 55 grain ballistic tips, i was amazed how the jugs exploded at 100 yards.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 12:19:56 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 1:31:11 AM EDT
Just go out and but some real cheap meat and shoot that up. You can go to grocery stores and ask the people who work in the meat department if they have anything that just expired. Tell them its for a science project. When you shoot meat, it gives you an ok sense of what your ammo will do.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 7:06:29 AM EDT
We're preparing for an invasion of the "Milk Jugs from Mars".
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 7:49:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Ridge: Disclaimer: We all know milk jugs filled with water is not viable ballistic medium so don't give us a hard time about it. [:)]
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I knew they'd start giving us a hard time about it. The only thing that I see that might be useful is measuring the velocity of the bullet and shooting a jug at different ranges. If the jug explodes at >2700 fps or the bullet passes through at <2700 fps then it would be kind of a neat way to see at what range your bullet might fragment. All in good fun of course.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 8:24:00 AM EDT
I just brought the jug along for the fun of shooting something different than paper. However I was supprised that the bullet did not exit the jug. Maybe if the jug had beed placed against a backstop the results would have been different. Was I trying to conduct any type of experiment? No.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 10:30:34 AM EDT
Even more fun is to freeze it half full. then top off the rest with water or whatever.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 11:14:44 AM EDT
Hardly a week goes by without me shooting a water-filled something. Milk jugs are fun, of course, but explode too readily. I also like the harder plastic jugs (the 64 oz fruit juice containers). Plastic-tipped bullets do wonders on those at 100 yds. And I have gotten nice results with the milk jugs and Q3131a at 200 yds... (20" Bushmaster)
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 1:06:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 5:33:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy: Shoot a pineapple with a soft-point rifle bullet (especially something big and flat like a .30-30), and it will rain tiny pineapple chunks in a 50 foot radius for about 4-5 seconds.
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Isn't that a violation of the VEGAN code?
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 8:05:14 PM EDT
man! still no pics???
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 8:46:28 PM EDT
Ok, so if someone is shooting at you, grab to gallon jugs of milk and use them as a shield :) Just gotta worry about the other 28 rounds :)
Link Posted: 5/1/2003 9:08:44 PM EDT
What will the blocks of ice do when hit?
Link Posted: 5/2/2003 1:56:53 AM EDT
Originally Posted By swj0001: What will the blocks of ice do when hit?
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I found it fun hitting them with 7mm rem mag at 25 yards. Ice dust.
Link Posted: 5/2/2003 1:07:12 PM EDT
Troy sure knows his Shit!! Yeah I like 5 gallon buckets better! Can do all kind of things! TRY WET PAPER PHONE BOOK ETC??
Link Posted: 5/2/2003 2:57:36 PM EDT
Ahh.. water filled milk jugs.. My favorite targets. 40gr ballistic tips at 4k make them dissapear into thin air. [:D]
Link Posted: 5/2/2003 4:16:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/2/2003 4:17:54 PM EDT by Ridge]
Okay here's a tip (no pun intended). If you want to turn you PMC 55gr FMJ plinking ammo into milk jug destroyers, this is what you do. Take some wire strippers and snip the tip of of the bullet. The front portion of the bullet is hollow so it effectively makes the ammo hollowpoints. I sit and watch TV and can do about 100 in less than an hour. NOW try to kill those water filled targets. When before it would pass right through now KABOOM. Cheap hollowpoints. Can wait to try them out on gophers! Unfortunately PMC is the only ammo I've found that has a thin enough jacket or the hollow tip. When trying to snip tips off of other brands it just makes a mess and not a hollowpoint.
Link Posted: 5/2/2003 8:18:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Jus228: Ahh.. water filled milk jugs.. My favorite targets. 40gr ballistic tips at 4k make them dissapear into thin air. [:D]
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Hmmmm...40gr at 4000fps...using a .22-250? I may have to take mine out tomorrow hehehe...I've got a few empty 2 liter soda bottles saved up.
Link Posted: 5/3/2003 4:07:16 PM EDT
Anyone try watermelons? And how come no one has pics?
Link Posted: 5/3/2003 4:18:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/3/2003 4:27:27 PM EDT by Blaster3094]
Here is a pic. [img]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-5/179461/demo1.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 5/3/2003 7:46:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Fenian: Hmmmm...40gr at 4000fps...using a .22-250? I may have to take mine out tomorrow hehehe...I've got a few empty 2 liter soda bottles saved up.
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Yup. They sure are fun when it comes to blowing up targets, eh? [;)]
Link Posted: 5/4/2003 12:27:08 AM EDT
Nice pics to depict the action. Did the jug fly several feet in the air after being hit?
Link Posted: 5/4/2003 3:08:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By newbushmaster: Nice pics to depict the action. Did the jug fly several feet in the air after being hit?
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No, the Jug pretty much just exploded (large water splash) and fell over backwards.
Link Posted: 5/4/2003 4:02:43 PM EDT
good thread. great pics! man, i hate plastic jugs!
Link Posted: 5/5/2003 7:04:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Ridge: Okay here's a tip (no pun intended). If you want to turn you PMC 55gr FMJ plinking ammo into milk jug destroyers, this is what you do. Take some wire strippers and snip the tip of of the bullet. The front portion of the bullet is hollow so it effectively makes the ammo hollowpoints. I sit and watch TV and can do about 100 in less than an hour. NOW try to kill those water filled targets. When before it would pass right through now KABOOM. Cheap hollowpoints. Can wait to try them out on gophers! Unfortunately PMC is the only ammo I've found that has a thin enough jacket or the hollow tip. When trying to snip tips off of other brands it just makes a mess and not a hollowpoint.
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Hold on there Ridge, this has been discussed before. It is generally a bad idea to snip off the tips of open base FMJBT's. I don't know if this has ever actually happened, but it is possible for the lead to be blown through the jacket leaving a good amount of copper left in the bore. Perhaps someone else can perhaps give more details, but that seems to be the general consensus in the shooting community.
Link Posted: 5/5/2003 6:37:00 PM EDT
milk jugs are cool.. I was thinking about doing something with wet phone books when the new ones come out this year. I hate it when the milk jugs just rip along the 'seams' I feel like I got cheated because those are the natural weak points anyway.
Link Posted: 5/5/2003 7:29:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Torf: Hold on there Ridge, this has been discussed before. It is generally a bad idea to snip off the tips of open base FMJBT's. I don't know if this has ever actually happened, but it is possible for the lead to be blown through the jacket leaving a good amount of copper left in the bore. Perhaps someone else can perhaps give more details, but that seems to be the general consensus in the shooting community.
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[size=4]YIKES!![/size=4] Thanks for ruining my fun. I shot probably 500 without a problem, but I don't think I could shoot another after hearing this. It seems very unlikely that this would happen because I snip off a very small amount (maybe 2 or 3 grains of copper), I could understand if I was chopping off the tops like you would have to with most FMJs. Oh well my PMC stock is drying up anyway. Wait a minute....Your just a milk jug rights activist aren't you?? [:D]
Link Posted: 5/6/2003 7:03:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/6/2003 7:07:22 AM EDT by Torf]
Hell no! I use 40 grain V-Maxes for my milk jug work! Regular unsnipped PMC should still bust a jug pretty well. Edited to add: BTW - heres a link: [url]http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=159121[/url]
Link Posted: 5/6/2003 9:42:32 AM EDT
I sleep better at night knowing that an invading army of plastic jugs would'nt make it off the beaches!
Link Posted: 5/6/2003 12:37:46 PM EDT
Im with TORF on that one!
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