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Posted: 9/4/2010 6:13:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 12:00:08 PM EDT by Russ68]
I have a Spikes ST-22 upper that had a 16" barrel. It has about 1500 rounds through it. It was plenty accurate for the distances that I typically shoot - 60ft indoor range. I believe the barrel is a Green Mt. (did not pay extra).

I sent the barrel to ADCO to cut to 5.5" and thread. Now, accuracy went to crap. It patterns like a shotgun. Bullets tumble, and looking at a target shot at 30ft, there is marks in the paper showing the bullet went through sideways. I tried the ST-22 suppressed, un-suppressed, and with the suppressor mount removed (NOTHING screwed on the end of the barrel) - results are the same. The cut/crown/thread job by ADCO looks perfect to my eye.


Suppressed, it cycles perfect, no failures of any kind. Without a suppressor it is a single shot most of the time with most ammo - (I fully expected this).

I have tried the following ammo (every kind I found locally):

- FEDERAL Target grade performance (white & black box, says it is "ideal for semi-autos"), 40gn solid lead, MV 1200fps
- FEDERAL champion bulk pack, 36gn copper plated Great Wal of China Mart stuff
- Remington Sub-Sonic, 38gn Lead RNHP
- Remington/ ELEY Target rifle, no clue what weight bullet, but it's lead RN solid
- FEDERAL Spitfire (Gander Mt. exclusive), 31gn copper plated HP (my 16" ST-22 absolutely LOVED this stuff, never had a MALF and was laser accurate)
- Winchester 333 bulk pack, 36gn copper plated HP (this stuff sucks ass in anything I've tried)

I also brought my Bicentennial Ruger Single-Six, which also has a 5.5" barrel. Same time, same range, same distance and same ammo, accuracy was excellent with the Ruger.

I have one theory that I am going to check - barrel twist. Does Green Mt. make gain twist rifling for their AR barrels? Far fetched, I'll admit, but this thing really seems like it isn't stabilizing the bullets. I think the Single-Six should have a 1:14" twist, while the ST-22 has 1:16". I'm going to try to get to the outdoor range with my chrono, and I should see velocities pretty close between the two 5.5" barrels I would think...

Of course I am discontinuing use of the suppressor until I get it sorted out - don't need a baffle strike ruining my can

Any ideas from you guys. Thanks

ETA...


I think I may have discovered the problem. After I cleaned the barrel I took an absorbent tipped applicator (long wood handled q-tip). The q-tip part happens to be a little bit bigger than the bore, so it takes a little bit of pressure to get it into the barrel. While passing the tip through the bore, resistance can be felt and it spins with the rifling, until it gets to about 3/4" form the muzzle, where there is no resistance at all, then pull it the rest of the way out the bore and resistance once again at the muzzle.

I can see a darkened ring all the way around the bore when I shine a light from the chamber end. Can't really get a picture of it, but I drew the MS paint to show what I think is going on. Flaw in the barrel? It only has a little over 1500 rounds through it. The rest of the bore is mirror bright and shiny.

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 4:50:44 AM EDT
Generally what you're showing is caused by a bullet not making it all the way through the barrel.
A squib load that didn't have enough powder to push the bullet. Then firing another bullet that slams
into the first. If it still goes unnoticed there may be more bullets slamming into an already bad situation.
The second bullet could also slam into the first and push it out the end of the barrel. When the 2 or
more bullets collide it places forces on the barrel, causing a dent in the bore.

I have a Smith and Wesson model 17 in 22 long rifle. I got it very cheap because this had happened to it.
In it's case it doesn't cause problems with accuracy, in fact it's the most accurate 22 revolver I've ever owned.

In your case it appears that multiple bullets expanded an area of the barrel where accuracy is very affected.
Not a whole lot can be done, it's already very short and would have to be cut further to remove the defect.
That wouldn't leave you with much length..

SpecOps-13
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 4:30:06 AM EDT
Dave (Spec) is right on the money. The problem is classic bullet stoppage commonly associated with rimfire ammunition, most likely caused by a squibb load.
One bullet doesn't make it out of the bore, and because you hear a bang you assume it did and fire another round, which sometimes clears the stuck bullet
without damage. In your case, it damaged the barrel.

While it seems this happened after the barrel mod, it could happen with any barrel. Assuming you will be replacing the damaged barrel, and assuming
the ammunition lot that caused the damage has not been expended, you need to account for every round fired (which is a good habit to form but is seldom
practiced, especially with rapid firing guns). If you don't see the impact, check the bore before firing the next shot.

Also, wear your safety glasses.

Ted
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 9:25:17 AM EDT
Russ, there is one thing puzzling me, and that is in your illustration you don't show any bulge in the outer profile of the barrel, in the area of the bore damage.
Is it possible you forgot to draw it? If the area is bulging, even slightly, it was most likely a squibb load related issue. But if there is no bulge, and only damage
to the bore, then it may have been a defective barrel.

Green Mountain barrels on Spike's products do not have gain rifling. They are typical button rifled bores, not cut.

Ted
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 11:43:16 AM EDT
Thanks for the replies. I don't recall ever having a squib when shooting this one - not saying it isn't possible, just don't remember ever having one. I never pulled the trigger and had one of those "what was that?" moments... I did have one in a XD40 though - I did NOT fire the next round, and was able to drive the stuck bullet out without too much trouble with a wood dowel and some Kroil when I got home. The ranges I shoot at do not allow rapid fire (1 round every 5 seconds), I have never just fired off a magazine as fast as I could pull the trigger when shooting my ST-22

As far as the bulge on the outside of the barrel - I checked it with the flattest known straight edge I have - a machinist rule. There is no discernible bulge on the outside of the barrel at all. I have the barrel removed from the upper so I could get a good look at it.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 4:25:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 4:01:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By badazzar15:
Russ,

I'm not sure what is wrong with your barrel but please give Sarah a ring tomorrow and we will swap your barrel out for you. Chances are we have a GM barrel the same length as yours instock.

WOW ! It couldn't get better than that
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 4:09:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2010 4:13:28 PM EDT by SpecOps-13]
That's way above and beyond Tom. That's gotta be one of the Coolest offers I've ever seen
a manufacturer make. Spike's Rocks...

Dave


PS: The 22 revolver barrel I mentioned with the same defect shows no signs of it on the outside of the barrel.
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 4:11:57 PM EDT
Amen to that. Spike's is great.
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 6:26:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By badazzar15:
Russ,

I'm not sure what is wrong with your barrel but please give Sarah a ring tomorrow and we will swap your barrel out for you. Chances are we have a GM barrel the same length as yours instock.


Wow thats kick butt customer service. Most would tell you to take a hike since you modified the part. Being that you did not even contact Spikes and this is not even on there forum my hats off to them.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 1:56:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 1:56:48 AM EDT by Russ68]
Originally Posted By kabob:
Originally Posted By badazzar15:
Russ,

I'm not sure what is wrong with your barrel but please give Sarah a ring tomorrow and we will swap your barrel out for you. Chances are we have a GM barrel the same length as yours instock.


Wow thats kick butt customer service. Most would tell you to take a hike since you modified the part. Being that you did not even contact Spikes and this is not even on there forum my hats off to them.


All true. I told Tom in IM's we exchanged that I would gladly pay for the exchange because I felt ST had no liability in this at all. He would not hear of it, and his exact words were "we stand behind our products". Boy, I'll say Makes me happy to have spent a pile of cash on Spikes stuff... the wife, maybe not so much yet
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:50:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SpecOps-13:
That's way above and beyond Tom. That's gotta be one of the Coolest offers I've ever seen
a manufacturer make. Spike's Rocks...

Dave


That is a really cool offer. But I think what Tom did for me tops all others. I don't think I should go into more detail without Tom's OK. His company deserves all my loyalty and future business. Should a thread be started to talk about all that Tom has done above and beyond normal business practices ?
Link Posted: 9/15/2010 12:09:38 PM EDT
Impressive.
Link Posted: 9/16/2010 7:17:33 AM EDT
That is some great customer service!!!
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