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Posted: 6/6/2012 10:16:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/8/2012 9:20:59 AM EDT by grun13]
I took two Frankenguns to the range yesterday: a midlength .223 with an Osprey conversion, and a 300 BLK carbine. As a matter of practice, I always load BLK ammo in Lancer mags so I know which is which. Once situated and ready to fire at the bench, I picked up the 223, inserted a TangoDown mag, acquired a sight picture, pulled the trigger and - kaboom! I felt a blast of heat on my left forearm as I thought, damn, I can’t believe my reloads are that hot. Then it dawned on me - I had loaded BLK in the wrong f*ing magazine!!!! Can you say dipf**k? Then I noticed there was no magazine protruding from my rifle. Not only that but there was blood on my left arm and also the distinct imprint of a Tango Down magazine. That’s cool. (I was trying to make light of the situation.) The only visible damage to the rifle was the magazine catch was blown out from its track but otherwise intact. I simply pushed in the magazine button with a pen and rotated the catch back into position. Other than only being able to move the charging handle rearward about ½ an inch, all appeared well. All things considered, I thought I was pretty lucky.

Once at home I had to remove the receiver extension in order to separate the upper and lower. Unfortunately, the bolt was stuck in the barrel extension. I used a 3/16” steel rod and a BFH in an attempt to tap the bolt out of the barrel extension (upper and lower rejoined) but to no avail (the steel rod bent!). I removed the barrel nut hoping to have a better chance of forcing a separation but have not had any luck that way either.

Anyone have an idea as to how to remove the bolt from the barrel extension? If all else fails, I was considering keeping it as a conversation piece, sending it to ADCO for separation, or donating it to one of the associated manufacturers if they had any interest.

Spikes upper
Rainier Arms Thunder Bolt
RRA 16” barrel
Osprey Bolt Carrier
TangoDown mag

So yeah, you can shoot .300 BLK in a 223, but why would you?

ETA: She had exactly 600 rounds through her (140 factory, 460 reloads) before she encountered the .300 Special.

ETA: Hammer photo, cartridge/bullet photo.



Note the lower half of the TangoDown mag exploded. Also note the cool Zombie Green handguard heatshield (another story).



Surplus Arms & Ammo - local boys, tough as nails.



I forgot to include the mag spring in the top photo.











That's the rearmost travel of the BCG.



The Osprey piston rod still moves just fine.



The bolt refuses to move. Note the "gold dust."



That's as far back as the BCG will move. More "gold dust."



It's just a little stuck.



That's as far forward as the barrel will move. Yes, that's mil-spec Shell grease on there.
It irks me in that this build had the lowest torque of any barrel nut I've done thus far: 38.



Slide steel rod down barrel; place steel bar over end of rod; smack bar with hammer.
Note the peened end of the bent rod; the bolt refuses to cooperate.



Bullet: SMK 125 grain
Case: LC ‘09 (converted Brads Warehouse)
COL: 2.24
Primer: WSR
Powder: H110, 17 gr. - 2117 fps



Do I see a pattern here?
Link Posted: 6/6/2012 10:28:10 PM EDT
damn

in before the 300 blackout haters
Link Posted: 6/6/2012 10:36:36 PM EDT
Once, apparently. Glad you weren't hurt more severely.
Link Posted: 6/6/2012 11:15:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/6/2012 11:15:29 PM EDT by kyleh]
So you fired a 300blk in a 223 barrel?
Link Posted: 6/6/2012 11:49:40 PM EDT
NUTS

I'm sorry for the blood sweet and tears.

A 300 blackout round won't chamber in a 5.56 unless the bullet is pushed back in the case. Letting the BCG fly home has the energy to push back rounds that are crimped well. I've tested the new blacktip load for movement, the crimp groove prevented any set back and the round didn't let the bolt lock up.

You got blood spilled,lucky no damage to vision, thanks for sharing what happened. What 300 blackout load wet you shooting?
Link Posted: 6/6/2012 11:53:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/10/2012 11:46:45 AM EDT by Operator42]
Originally Posted By kyleh:
So you fired a 300blk in a 223 barrel?


I'll guess the bullet is trapped between the bolt and extension, luckily the gas vented downward away from the face. The imprint on the arm(from the mag).
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 12:28:37 AM EDT
What kind of bullet, and how far in were you seating your 300's? I tried one of my 300 reloads in my 556, because I was wondering if what happened to you was possible. My load wouldn't chamber, and the bolt wouldn't close (I didn't let the bolt slam forward, though).
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 12:49:49 AM EDT
That's harsh, dude.

Thanks for sharing the info.

Great pix, btw.

I wish you luck.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 1:01:55 AM EDT
Would like to see pics of the damage once you get the bolt removed.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 1:31:36 AM EDT
On the upper, above the lower emblem, is that a bulge, or a smudge?
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 3:27:27 AM EDT
And this is why I am trying very hard to segregate my ammo using different mags. That way the potential for similar is less likely. I am planning to only load 300 in Pmags and 5.56 in GI metal.

OP: Thanks for sharing as it helps solidify my reasoning.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 3:53:45 AM EDT
wow man, very lucky it wasn't worse.....sorry for your pain..
been thinking of a .300 but with the daughter running 5.56, i'm not so sure...
please update as you work through the gun...tagging this
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:00:55 AM EDT
WOW OP!

Was actually a great post - thanks for sharing and glad it'll all buff out.

Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:25:06 AM EDT
Thank you for the pictures. I always wondered about this.

Glad you made it out without any major injuries.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:33:16 AM EDT
Glad you were not hurt more than you were.
To be honest, I am surprised this doesn't happen more often. Or possibly it does, but they don't post because they are emabarised or something. Either way, keep us updated if you get it apart.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:14:17 AM EDT
Wow. Glad you are OK. That sort of brain fart can happen to anyone.

This kind of makes me think that I should just stick with the .300 BLK in the bolt action I am working on getting built. No way to load its magazines in an AR. Of course I could still load the wrong ammunition in the AR mags, but that would be one more step where I might notice that I was doing something wrong.

I too would like to see inside pcis if and when you get it apart. I'd also like to know what load it was.

Thanks for posting!

Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:28:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 6:29:42 AM EDT by soonerman]
That pretty much sucks. Glad the injuries weren't more severe!
The thought of using different mags crossed my mind the other day, and now it's stuck in my brain for good.
But I don't have an operating firearm yet or ammo
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:42:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 6:43:29 AM EDT by tammons]
Wow, Lucky.
Looks like the AR came apart like it was designed to.

There are quite a few bad cross over cartridges, not to say this is specifically
one those being a 308 through and 06 based chamber, 270, 25-06 etc.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:59:29 AM EDT
you are one lucky guy.

that is one reason i never pre-load any mags when i go to the range. even though i use diff. mags for my x40 and 223. and i only have one type of ammo on the bench at a time.

glad you are ok.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 7:31:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 8:19:15 AM EDT by golfroot]
OP, I'm surprised that yours didn't blow up. Sending a .224 down a .310 bore is one thing. Sending a .308 down a .223 bore is

Glad you're here to tell your story.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 7:39:32 AM EDT




some people really need to evaluate what hobbies they partake in.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 8:16:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By FLATFOOT762:
What kind of bullet, and how far in were you seating your 300's? I tried one of my 300 reloads in my 556, because I was wondering if what happened to you was possible. My load wouldn't chamber, and the bolt wouldn't close (I didn't let the bolt slam forward, though).


I added a photo (near the end of the list) of the type of round fired. It's a SMK 125 grain at 2.24 COL.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 8:17:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ocshaman:
On the upper, above the lower emblem, is that a bulge, or a smudge?


It's just a smudge.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 9:58:13 AM EDT
OP, try tapping on the bottom rear of the carrier wih a brass punch and a hammer.

Might be able to bet the bolt to unlock and get a better view at the chamber.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 10:59:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 11:02:46 AM EDT by DocGP]
Originally Posted By m4hk33:




some people really need to evaluate what hobbies they partake in.


It would be nice never to have made a mistake in my life also. I would bet ANYONE who has been shooting long has had an O' CRAP moment. I know I have had mine.

Doc

It also never hurts to be reminded that there can be deadly consequences to our beloved past time.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 11:04:45 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DocGP:
Originally Posted By m4hk33:




some people really need to evaluate what hobbies they partake in.


It would be nice never to have made a mistake in my life also. I would bet ANYONE who has been shooting long has had an O' CRAP moment. I know I have had mine.

Doc

It also never hurts to be reminded that there can be deadly consequences to our beloved past time.


I was just going to say dont believe it cant happen to you because it can.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 1:53:10 PM EDT
Holy carp. After I would have cleaned out my drawers, I'd consider myself lucky.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:17:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:29:25 PM EDT
Good thing you were not seriously hurt
be careful out there!
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:34:35 PM EDT
Were you at a range here in WA when it happened? Just curious. Glad you are OK, that coulda turned ugly.

I'm in the process of building a 300 blk - you just gave me some things to think about.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 5:45:42 PM EDT
DAMN!!!


glad it worked out for ya though
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:28:02 PM EDT
ahhh, no, people are braindead. been to a gunshow or public range recently, yeah, its amazing this stuff doesnt happen more often
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:33:53 PM EDT
Thanks grun13, for posting your unfortunate accident,,glad you had the courage to post the reminder that we all need to be aware of the consequence one can have...glad you were not seriously injured ...
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 6:51:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 6:52:05 PM EDT by kaos]

Originally Posted By Gearhead1940:
Were you at a range here in WA when it happened? Just curious. Glad you are OK, that coulda turned ugly.

I'm in the process of building a 300 blk - you just gave me some things to think about.
One of the things he gave me to think about was that my system of color coding mags to ammo/weapons isn't as foolproof as I was hoping.

My caliber overlap for similar looking ARs is limited, but it aint 'zero'.


Link Posted: 6/7/2012 7:00:44 PM EDT
I found your problem you are using a Rifle barrel extension with a M4 cut lower. Thats a no-go lol. Glad you are ok. I had a lack of attention moment this week as well. we where both lucky.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 7:49:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/7/2012 7:50:07 PM EDT by GACKER1143]
Glad your O.K! I'll bet money the bullet never left the barrel! Probably stuffed into the throat. Thats why you bent the rod. You need to put the a brass rod to the lip of the carrier through the ejection port and tap the bolt back. I have no idea how your going to get that bullet out though, beside beating it out with a rod.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 8:02:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 8:16:28 PM EDT
Thanks for having the balls to share, OP. I don't care who you are, mistakes happen. This WILL help prevent others from doing the same.
Link Posted: 6/7/2012 8:16:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By krpind:
You need an Air hammer.

Put a rod down the bbl and tap on the other end with the air hammer.





I tend to agree, using a tool steel rod down barrel and using a air hammer to dislodge
the bullet may work, provided the bullet didn't "heat weld" itself to the chamber...

Glad your Injuries were not even worse...
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 2:56:44 AM EDT
Glad your ok. But mark your mags. Problem solved.



Last one was cut from a shot by Stickman. Thanks Stick!
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 9:41:26 AM EDT
I figured I had might as well put things away until I figured out what I wanted to do next. I mounted the barrel and when the barrel nut was tightened it pushed the stuck bolt rearward. How cool is that?! I pulled the charging handle rearward but it didn’t move. So I loosened the barrel nut, removed the barrel, and then the BCG from the front. A spent primer casing fell out at the same time. I could see brass in the barrel, so I measured the depth with a dial caliper at around 1.93 inches. For S&Gs I slid the steel rod down the barrel to measure the opposite end but when I did it knocked the brass out.

All that remained of the cartridge was the spent primer casing, part of the brass case head lodged in the barrel and another piece fused to the bolt. Apparently the bullet squeezed down and shot out the barrel.

When I removed the firing pin a small piece of primer fell out of the bolt carrier.

Am I going to keep shooting 300 BLK? Oh yeah. But you can bet the mags are going to be painted red or with the big letters: H D A - Hey, Dumb Ass!

Thanks for all the comments. And of course, be safe out there!





















Rainier on the left; new Spikes on the right.

Link Posted: 6/8/2012 10:26:34 AM EDT
Bolt and mag are hosed. Is the rec. and barrel still OK?

I imagine if you had a tougher bullet, and it didn't go down the barrel it could if been a larger failure.

How's the arm?
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 10:30:19 AM EDT
WOW now thats impressive!

Guess you found a new way to swage bullets
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 10:39:52 AM EDT
I would guess the barrel is bulged but maybe not.
It didnt even break any lugs which is amazing IMO.

It would be interesting to know the pressure.

I have to wonder what would have happened if this was a Barnes bullet, because I
dont think it would have made it down the barrel.
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 11:48:01 AM EDT
One other thought from looking at your arm. You may want to get a local GP to do a quick radiograph and see if you have any shrapnel in there.

Doc
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 12:21:50 PM EDT
It shot the bullet out...?
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 1:10:52 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 2:24:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/8/2012 2:24:54 PM EDT by 346ci]
Originally Posted By krpind:
Originally Posted By grun13:
Apparently the bullet squeezed down and shot out the barrel.






BUT.

This forever ends all questions about the power of the 300BLK.

Take that 346ci.



A little levity in the tech forums in ok I think .



LOL, yup that is some power. Not the kind of power I want to be around though.

That is insane that the bullet went down the bbl.

Link Posted: 6/8/2012 2:46:36 PM EDT
I heard the sky screens in the ceiling clocked a projectile at 4500 fps that day.

Maybe.
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 5:46:25 PM EDT
Glad you're ok, OP. It was a stupid mistake, but one I can see happening very easily!

I just put together a 300 BLK upper. I decided I only wanted a couple of semi-auto rifles. I got a Sig 556 pistol and SBR'd it and put a 551A-1 lower on it. I sold my 5.56 upper for my AR SBR to fund the 300 BLK. I was worried myself about having one of these moments. Now, it can't happen because my Pmags have 300 BLK and won't go in the 551-A1 lower. The mags for the Sig get 5.56.

How's the arm doing?
Link Posted: 6/8/2012 6:08:57 PM EDT
Looks like the case is welded into the chamber? I can't believe a 309 caliber bullet was swaged down enough to pass through a .224 bore. Are you absolutely sure it was a 300 blk and not a overcharged 5.56mm?
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