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Posted: 10/21/2002 6:10:03 PM EDT
Hello, everybody.

I'm new to this group. This is my very first post here. I've had a Colt SP1 since 1980 and it has remain unchanged...until about 45 days from now.

I haven't shot mine in about ten years or more. I bought a new DSA 58 carbine a couple of years ago and it's been to the range only once. I just don't have the time anymore. Anyway, a friend of mine put the fever back in me when I saw his new DPMS with the fixed-open telestock, carbine barrel, and suppresor. It's a beautiful setup.

I liked it so much I was going to buy one just like it until it hit me...just reconfigure the one I have. So today I ordered a Bushmaster 14.5" M4 barreled A2 upper with the Phantom suppresor (to bring it to 16") with a teardrop forward assist. I also ordered the telestock. I'm really looking forward to getting it back to the range after so many years.

OK. Now for the question:

If I buy an 11.5" barrel for my pre-ban, would all I need to do is take it to my local police station to register it as a handgun? I wouldn't have a problem with that because I have all my handguns registered. Or would I have to reclassify it as a short-barreled rifle through BATF and wait for an exemption from the director? I spent hours trying to research this answer yesterday and could not find anything definitive on it. Since it becomes a pistol chambered for a rifle cartridge, it gets way out into muddy waters. Even the guy at Bushmaster today wouldn't touch this with a 10' pole. He told me to get with ATF. I went to ATF's website and they state all inquiries must be submitted by mail. Their FAQ page didn't address the issue either.

A little help out there, please.

Does it become a pistol that requires only a simple trip to the police station? Or is it way deeper than that?

Thank you very much,
Rob
Trenton, Michigan
Link Posted: 10/21/2002 6:52:44 PM EDT
First of all the Phantom suppressor will have to be pinned in place i'm not sure but you might have to silver solder it also. Or you have to register it as a short barreled rifle.This goes for any barrel under 16". To register it as a pistol it has a minumum weight requirement. I don't know what it is though,sorry.There are probably other requirements also but i'm not sure. Maybe other more knowledgable folk will chime in.

GlenR
Link Posted: 10/21/2002 6:56:50 PM EDT
The lower, must be classified as a "pistol" meaning that it could have NEVER been assembled into a rifle before. Just as in a preban, I beleve you'll need a letter stating that the lower was never assembled into a rifle configuration. Then you can build the lower into a pistol. I'm not sure of the specs of a pistol, but that's how I understand it.
Link Posted: 10/21/2002 7:27:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rob22:
...
I'm new to this group. This is my very first post here. I've had a Colt SP1 since 1980 and it has remain unchanged...until about 45 days from now.
...
If I buy an 11.5" barrel for my pre-ban, would all I need to do is take it to my local police station to register it as a handgun? I wouldn't have a problem with that because I have all my handguns registered. Or would I have to reclassify it as a short-barreled rifle through BATF and wait for an exemption from the director? I spent hours trying to research this answer yesterday and could not find anything definitive on it. Since it becomes a pistol chambered for a rifle cartridge, it gets way out into muddy waters. Even the guy at Bushmaster today wouldn't touch this with a 10' pole. He told me to get with ATF. I went to ATF's website and they state all inquiries must be submitted by mail. Their FAQ page didn't address the issue either.

A little help out there, please.


Since it's already been a rifle, it would become a Short-Barrel Rifle (SBR). You would have to submit and get back an approved Form 1 from the ATF BEFORE getting the 11.5" barrel. You fill out 2 copies of the Form 1 application, get your local sheriff to sign off on them, then submit it with 2 fingerprint cards, 2 passport style photos, a "citizenship certification form" and a check to ATF for $200. 3-6 months later, provided they don't reject it and nothing goes wrong, you'll get back the 1 copy of the Form 1 with a cancelled NFA tax stamp on it. You're now free to order the barrel, assemble the SBR, and engrave your name and city, state on the rifle somewhere.



Does it become a pistol that requires only a simple trip to the police station? Or is it way deeper than that?



Once it's been a rifle, it can never be a pistol, legally. Making an AR pistol has its own arcane set of rules, thanks the 94 AW ban. Anything you built now would be post-ban, of course, and it's just about impossible (but not completely impossible) to make a legal, semi-auto post-ban AR type pistol that can accept a detachable magazine.
Link Posted: 10/21/2002 8:45:12 PM EDT
What sort of suppressor does your friend have on his rifle? If it's postban, I believe flash and sound supressors are verboten.
Link Posted: 10/22/2002 12:55:14 AM EDT
You can get the 11.5" barrel you just cant put it on the lower to make it part of a rifle before its registered as a SBR. Its going ot be a 6 month process with a $200 fee and you have to get permission to take it out of state. Written in advance from the ATF.
Link Posted: 10/22/2002 2:52:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DevL:
You can get the 11.5" barrel you just cant put it on the lower to make it part of a rifle before its registered as a SBR. Its going ot be a 6 month process with a $200 fee and you have to get permission to take it out of state. Written in advance from the ATF.



ATF considers possession of the short barrel upper and an AR-15 to be "constructive possession" of an unregistered SBR unless you've got the cancelled tax stamp in your hand. Whether they'd ever find out about - who knows? But they HAVE prosecuted people in the past for possession of an uninstalled short barrel and a host receiver.
Link Posted: 10/25/2002 4:28:53 PM EDT
It's factory installed. It looks exactly like the one Armalite uses, with the helical cutting. They really aren't verboten. My DSA came with a suppresor. Back when I bought it two years ago it was called a "muzzle break." That was the hot-button issue for BATF back then. That is why I get kind of upset with people who bad-mouth ATF. They're not much different from us. They were willing to go with the whole "thing at the end of the barrel" thing as long as it wasn't a "flash suppresor." Get it? It's all in the nomenclature.
Link Posted: 10/25/2002 4:33:53 PM EDT
Thanks to all of you who replied to my question here. I appprecite the help very much.

Rob
Link Posted: 10/25/2002 5:04:37 PM EDT
If I recall, Michigan is not a "SBR" state. SOO, your Form-1 is out of the question. They have goofy pistol/rifle measure laws.
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