User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 12:51:23 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thank You I am currently working on a article for SWAT Magazine online will feature more pictures of the guns from downrange Subject will be... single optic carbines specifically red dots are a thing of the past! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Great articles and thank you for your service. I am currently working on a article for SWAT Magazine online will feature more pictures of the guns from downrange Subject will be... single optic carbines specifically red dots are a thing of the past! 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 7:54:30 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wait! I just bought an Eotech G33 magnifier for my AP PRO! Don’t tell me it’s obsolete!! |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 1:46:41 PM EDT
[#3]
Tell me about it, bro. I’m slow to adopt new tech and most of my shooting is 300 yards max, so I have been content with my set-up.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 1:59:25 PM EDT
[#4]
Great articles, I follow the series..
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 2:25:34 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Tell me about it, bro. I’m slow to adopt new tech and most of my shooting is 300 yards max, so I have been content with my set-up. For me Im all about tech...one reason years ago I was at a 3gun match shooting a 1x4 optic 1x6 scopes had just hit the scene. Ability aside, guys shooting 6 power scopes were all able to out pace me at long range stages. Just faster picking up/hitting small targets at range. So for me if it makes shooting in matches or combat easier I say go for it. But also there is merit to the fact; if it works for you then stay with it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 6:09:02 PM EDT
[#6]
If you are running a red dot for close up, why not put more a more powerful scope on? Like a 2-10 or similar?
BTW, good read, and thanks for your service. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 6:16:31 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are running a red dot for close up, why not put more a more powerful scope on? Like a 2-10 or similar? BTW, good read, and thanks for your service. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 6:33:38 PM EDT
[#8]
Great series of articles, really enjoyed seeing how guys are able to mod and optimize their weapons with non-standard, non-issue equipment now. Guess 17+ years of continuous combat operations does result in some lessons learned; not only recognizing them, but adopting them as well. QC in 88, and Devens from 88-92 - I could never understand why teams were issued A2s. I was on staff at SFC and USASOC when M4s and SOPMOD became the standard, and was always envious of the guys that got to teams after I did. Well done!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/10/2019 7:26:05 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think, and I could be wrong, that the red dot secondary is for quick transitions when running at 6x (or 8x) for sudden close up action, but I would guess that they run at 1x when expecting all close up. At least that's what makes sense in my head. Faster to rotate to red dot and back than to adjust optic The issue is; its not always up to you when you expect to shoot close or far its up to the enemy also. Having offset red dot allows best for both near and far with just flick of the gun keeping both hands on rifle you are ready for both. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 9:48:56 AM EDT
[#10]
@Stukas87
Just finished Part 1 Any of the SOP warriors runningCAV COMP? Give er a field test, the teams might like em. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 11:56:54 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I ran on 6x entire time (in Part III, I also never needed to use scope illumination black BDC worked great) The issue is; its not always up to you when you expect to shoot close or far its up to the enemy also. Having offset red dot allows best for both near and far with just flick of the gun keeping both hands on rifle you are ready for both. OP, did you leave the rds on all the time or just at the start of your patrol? Thank you for your service! |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 4:28:06 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is why we run miniature red dot in 3 gun, Open Div. dating back to 2005-ish. JPoint and Tasco were the rds of the time. OP, did you leave the rds on all the time or just at the start of your patrol? Thank you for your service! |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 4:29:57 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Stukas87 Just finished Part 1 Any of the SOP warriors runningCAV COMP? Give er a field test, the teams might like em. I ran a FERFRANS Break a little in 2014 but really the SF 4 prong now War Comp is where its at. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 5:47:34 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The success of SF SOCOM suppressor has put to rest any notions of running any other muzzle device I ran a FERFRANS Break a little in 2014 but really the SF 4 prong now War Comp is where its at. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 6:43:34 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I ran on 6x entire time (in Part III, I also never needed to use scope illumination black BDC worked great) The issue is; its not always up to you when you expect to shoot close or far its up to the enemy also. Having offset red dot allows best for both near and far with just flick of the gun keeping both hands on rifle you are ready for both. If you knew you were going into a building/close quarters, would you use the LPVO on 1x or the MRDS? Great articles, I've been following them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 6:57:58 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That was similar to the question I had: If you knew you were going into a building/close quarters, would you use the LPVO on 1x or the MRDS? Great articles, I've been following them. Military you must be ready for both internal and external threats fighting your way onto target then back off. Now If I went to Iraq where all fighting takes place in cities then maybe put LPVO on 1x power too. Cant give a for sure answer until I was on the ground. But optics and optic settings should not be based on mission say CQB but on threat's usual actions and methods |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2019 7:14:03 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Afghanistan stayed on 6 power Military you must be ready for both internal and external threats fighting your way onto target then back off. Now If I went to Iraq where all fighting takes place in cities then maybe put LPVO on 1x power too. Cant give a for sure answer until I was on the ground. But optics and optic settings should not be based on mission say CQB but on threat's usual actions and methods Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
That was similar to the question I had: If you knew you were going into a building/close quarters, would you use the LPVO on 1x or the MRDS? Great articles, I've been following them. Military you must be ready for both internal and external threats fighting your way onto target then back off. Now If I went to Iraq where all fighting takes place in cities then maybe put LPVO on 1x power too. Cant give a for sure answer until I was on the ground. But optics and optic settings should not be based on mission say CQB but on threat's usual actions and methods Again, great articles. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2019 12:33:34 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well that is all that really matters if it works for you. For me Im all about tech...one reason years ago I was at a 3gun match shooting a 1x4 optic 1x6 scopes had just hit the scene. Ability aside, guys shooting 6 power scopes were all able to out pace me at long range stages. Just faster picking up/hitting small targets at range. So for me if it makes shooting in matches or combat easier I say go for it. But also there is merit to the fact; if it works for you then stay with it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Tell me about it, bro. I’m slow to adopt new tech and most of my shooting is 300 yards max, so I have been content with my set-up. For me Im all about tech...one reason years ago I was at a 3gun match shooting a 1x4 optic 1x6 scopes had just hit the scene. Ability aside, guys shooting 6 power scopes were all able to out pace me at long range stages. Just faster picking up/hitting small targets at range. So for me if it makes shooting in matches or combat easier I say go for it. But also there is merit to the fact; if it works for you then stay with it. Thank you for the feedback, it is much appreciated. I have a question for you, and please forgive me if you have already answered this. In regards to LPVO’s, is there is a certain reticle design you like? Do you ever make adjustments on the fly? Or is it pretty much just hold-over you use? |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2019 12:45:14 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @stukas87 Thank you for the feedback, it is much appreciated. I have a question for you, and please forgive me if you have already answered this. In regards to LPVO’s, is there is a certain reticle design you like? Do you ever make adjustments on the fly? Or is it pretty much just hold-over you use? MIL/MRAD type reticles yes more accurate but too slow. for a 5.56 rifle Shooting on a flat range with known distance sure you can be fast with MIL scope But combat half the challenge is estimating the range of threats running around. Its easier to guess, set quick hold over with BDC and let bullets fly. Then correct off impacts. I think the VCOG reticle could use some improvement now. The design is 5 years old now. The center dot is too big on 6 power fun facts....My Vortex 1x8 Strike Eagle has more forgiving eye relief than VCOG But compared to a Vortex Razor VCOG closer to true 1x But VCOG is indestructible, I took some pretty good falls on rocks and such on missions banged the VCOG around pretty well (put small dent in focus ring) VCOG never lost zero. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2019 2:10:55 PM EDT
[#20]
Thanks for the info, Stuka. I’ll probably end up picking up an LPVO in the near future just to see what all the fuss is about, lol.
Side note: I used my current set-up at a CSAT course (Paul Howe), but, past 400 yds more magnification woulda been nice. The longer range shooting was done on my own time, not during the course, and it did highlight the need for more magnification. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2019 2:16:25 PM EDT
[#21]
Always enjoy, thanks Jeff!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 5:04:41 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thank You very kind..... Now if only we can convince my Teenage kids to pay attention to me! And thanks for finally getting this info out in a "legit" manner. One of the main reasons i never spoke up much about the stuff i'd seen in afghan(2016) was because the guys really didn't like me bugging them with a camera in hand. So no pics and some cloners are anal as anal gets. Didn't want to deal with cloner drama. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 6:04:36 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yea, right. My kids are grown already and i never cracked that code. Don't think i could do any better with yours. And thanks for finally getting this info out in a "legit" manner. One of the main reasons i never spoke up much about the stuff i'd seen in afghan(2016) was because the guys really didn't like me bugging them with a camera in hand. So no pics and some cloners are anal as anal gets. Didn't want to deal with cloner drama. I remember back in 2012 for part I, when I asked fellow team guys to take photos of their guns. Once I told them why, it was well received. Also Parts 1 thru 3 since I wrote on active duty I did send it up thru the PAO channels to get approval... no issues. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 6:12:28 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wish I had started documenting sooner what team guys were running I remember back in 2012 for part I, when I asked fellow team guys to take photos of their guns. Once I told them why, it was well received. Also Parts 1 thru 3 since I wrote on active duty I did send it up thru the PAO channels to get approval... no issues. Some of the foreign teams up in mazar were pretty cool when talking gear, but didn't like pics so much. I enjoyed my time working with the mongolians although all their gear was on loan from the germans or us(the reason i was fixing their stuff). I wanted to, but never was able to get up to kunduz. Good times. I miss it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 7:11:40 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But optics and optic settings should not be based on mission say CQB but on threat's usual actions and methods |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 7:32:15 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well I got the VCOG for the reticle. I like BDCs for 3gun, combat MIL/MRAD type reticles yes more accurate but too slow. for a 5.56 rifle Shooting on a flat range with known distance sure you can be fast with MIL scope But combat half the challenge is estimating the range of threats running around. Its easier to guess, set quick hold over with BDC and let bullets fly. Then correct off impacts. I think the VCOG reticle could use some improvement now. The design is 5 years old now. The center dot is too big on 6 power fun facts....My Vortex 1x8 Strike Eagle has more forgiving eye relief than VCOG But compared to a Vortex Razor VCOG closer to true 1x But VCOG is indestructible, I took some pretty good falls on rocks and such on missions banged the VCOG around pretty well (put small dent in focus ring) VCOG never lost zero. To me, the big thing about the Razor & PST gen II was how they looked and felt on 1x (besides the glass & warranty). Would you use a dedicated 6x optic if something really good existed? |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 7:45:41 PM EDT
[#27]
I did not get any negative feedback from them..
Not even any issues with guys running the Strike Eagles. If they were not holding zero they would stop using them. The limiting factor with Strike Eagles is the illumination If you use it at night the scope projects a red glow from the front That's where one corner is cut to keep price down |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 7:50:53 PM EDT
[#28]
Which reticle do have in the VCOG? Horseshoe or crosshair? I have always wanted to pick one up, but quite a few people complain about the reticle size.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2019 7:54:50 PM EDT
[#29]
Thanks for responding, I've always enjoyed reading your insights into carbine set ups, philosophy behind they way they are set up at any given point, and technology driving changes.
So if you could use a MRDS along with a fixed 6x optic that was similar to a Viper PST but no variable mag, would you do it? I always thought the 1x features were a big selling point to the LPVO. Do you use the 6x and MRDS as a system, with the 1x of the LPVO being a backup to the MRDS? Hope I'm not being confusing, I'm genuinely interested in the thoughts behind all of this. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/15/2019 12:35:26 PM EDT
[#30]
Hey @Stukas87 are you anywhere near the Asheville area? We're usually up that way every fall for camping and often visit the Overland Expo which has been in that area the past 4 years. I'm always down for meeting quality arfcom folks and would love to say hello if our paths cross.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/15/2019 8:59:24 PM EDT
[#31]
Im just west of Raleigh
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2019 12:14:42 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Im just west of Raleigh |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2019 3:09:33 PM EDT
[#33]
Jeff, great series of articles, really practical info data points that are a good reminder that you don't need the most gucci gear to get the job done. I'd love to see more of this in the future.
I'm curious if you have any input on barrel profiles. Were you guys running the SOCOM profile, standard gov profile, or a mix of both, and if so can you comment on any practical accuracy differences? I'm considering a SOCOM profile but not sure if it's worth ~4oz. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2019 3:21:41 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Jeff, great series of articles, really practical info data points that are a good reminder that you don't need the most gucci gear to get the job done. I'd love to see more of this in the future. I'm curious if you have any input on barrel profiles. Were you guys running the SOCOM profile, standard gov profile, or a mix of both, and if so can you comment on any practical accuracy differences? I'm considering a SOCOM profile but not sure if it's worth ~4oz. The only time a SF guy might end up with standard M4 barrel is if his barrel goes down and is replaced with normal one that just happens to be on hand. But once they go back stateside guns get refit with what SOCOM says in the requirement. Accuracy wise I have not seen much difference especially since it really depends on ammo. I wrote this on my testing of M855A1... M855A1 Accuracy Results |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2019 10:53:58 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: SF has been getting the SOCOM heavy barrels since 2003ish The only time a SF guy might end up with standard M4 barrel is if his barrel goes down and is replaced with normal one that just happens to be on hand. But once they go back stateside guns get refit with what SOCOM says in the requirement. Accuracy wise I have not seen much difference especially since it really depends on ammo. I wrote this on my testing of M855A1... M855A1 Accuracy Results Thanks for the link on the M855A1, that was a great read. Based on Molon's testing and posts from others that have compared both it does seem that the SOCOM profile has a bit better accuracy, of course assuming you are using high enough quality of ammo to distinguish the difference. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2019 11:23:14 PM EDT
[#36]
The Non-FSP RIS II may indeed use a standard barrel... when we got issued them in 2015 I never used one,
I stuck with RISII FSP it was mid-deployment I did not feel the need to switch uppers and re-zero. Il have to hit up old teammates see what they got. Jeff G. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/17/2019 8:27:34 AM EDT
[#37]
Great articles.
I enjoyed your writing on binary triggers. I do not understand people’s rabid hate against them. They are far from a gimmic and just as viable as a 2 round burst. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/18/2019 2:00:45 PM EDT
[#38]
Jeff, for guys who opt to individually purchase a 1-4x scope such as the viper, what is the draw vs. the Elan 1/4x? I know you touched on the advantage of the extra magnification on the 6x scopes, but I'm curious what your and others' opinions are of the Elcan vs some of the 1-4 scopes you mentioned. I've never looked through an Elcan but I've read they have great glass.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/18/2019 3:18:47 PM EDT
[#39]
The Elcan is the best 1x4 out there, great field of view and eye relief
I never seen anyone opt for another 1x4 over a Elcan The draw is more powerful scopes over Elcans. Hence SOCOM finally spending money on 1x6 and Sig wining it. Speaking with someone who got to try all the scopes SOCOM was looking at, said there were 11 Sig came in 3rd as far as quality...but best in price. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/18/2019 5:08:23 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sig came in 3rd as far as quality...but best in price. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/18/2019 5:09:09 PM EDT
[#41]
Got it, for some reason I thought I remembered some of those scopes being 1-4x in your article. I read through it again and realized they were all 1-6x. So SOCOM will now be using the SIG 1-6 and the nightforce 1-8 ATCR right? Any insights on different applications for these scope? They seem very similar.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/18/2019 7:12:57 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Got it, for some reason I thought I remembered some of those scopes being 1-4x in your article. I read through it again and realized they were all 1-6x. So SOCOM will now be using the SIG 1-6 and the nightforce 1-8 ATCR right? Any insights on different applications for these scope? They seem very similar. Tier 1 elements will get Nightforce or anything else that's cooler |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/19/2019 11:59:07 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sig came in 3rd as far as quality...but best in price. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/21/2019 12:41:31 PM EDT
[#44]
What is the preferred method to mount an RMR in the offset 45 degree position?
I’ve seen the stand alone mounts by ADM and Trijicon vs. the mount by LaRue that is a Ring mounted on the scope. Which one for ease of use? Thanks for the article Jeff. I really like your work. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/21/2019 1:01:10 PM EDT
[#45]
Stand alone mount
Ive tried in front of scope and behind it, I find behind scope (closer to shooters face) Faster to pick up and aim. If I did not already own two Predator offset mounts I buy one of these... AMS mounts |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/21/2019 1:09:34 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stand alone mount Ive tried in front of scope and behind it, I find behind scope (closer to shooters face) Faster to pick up and aim. If I did not already own two Predator offset mounts I buy one of these... AMS mounts |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/21/2019 10:27:29 PM EDT
[#47]
Outstanding article and I'll be sure to read parts 1-3 next. You mentioned 3 gun, are you using your 14.5 for that as well?
@Stukas87 |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/22/2019 5:42:35 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wait! I just bought an Eotech G33 magnifier for my AP PRO! Don’t tell me it’s obsolete!! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Great articles and thank you for your service. I am currently working on a article for SWAT Magazine online will feature more pictures of the guns from downrange Subject will be... single optic carbines specifically red dots are a thing of the past! Just kidding. I really like my eotech/G33 combo, but I use what works for me. I don't base all my decisions on what people overseas use, as their situation is a lot different than what mine would be should I need to employ my rifle CONUS. I also have a vortex Razor HD Gen 2, but if I had to grab 1 rifle it would be my 10.5" with EXPS-3 and G33. I recently purchased a TA44 with ACSS. I really want to see how it does for that 300 meters and in range. Maybe further. We will see. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 1/23/2019 9:03:18 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Outstanding article and I'll be sure to read parts 1-3 next. You mentioned 3 gun, are you using your 14.5 for that as well? @Stukas87 But 14.5 works just fine, that is all I used to run. I prefer 14.5 for when I do teach classes (once in awhile) and just shooting on the flat rage. If the big one ever hit and the Mad Max movies became reality Id grab a 14.5 over 16 and the 11.5s I have. Despite claims of military settled on14.5 originally to fit bayonet I think 14.5 great balance of length for velocity and maneuverability. |
|
|
|
Posted: 1/24/2019 1:09:30 AM EDT
[#50]
I bought the Strike Eagle 1-6x24 (AR-BDC reticle (MOA) years ago for what I thought was a lot at the time. It's been on my 16" DD v11LW since then and always a solid performer. I'm pretty easy on it but the warranty is hard to beat. I've got a 14.5" URG-I build in the works and plan to buy the NF ATACR 1-8 for it. For 300 yards and out I can see how the extra 2x would be nice. With my old eyes I find myself in the 3-4 range a lot at 100 yards. I'm going to try a RDS at 45 and see how it works for me. I've always thought it was silly to buy nice BUIS for a rifle with an optic because I almost never use them and I'm not a huge fan of co-witness. Think I'll skip them on future builds.
Thanks for the insight and the article. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
