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Posted: 5/22/2020 1:19:51 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: The WOA that I have gets nearly 7 turns (not a clone gun), purchased late 2019. Maybe they've adjusted measurements since @BurtSaun1049 got theirs? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: Originally Posted By lancecriminal86: Then they probably are, or at least they went off the Crane spec. That drawing there follows Ron's drawing for the AEM5 and has distance from muzzle to step at 2.4", so should get plenty of turns. The WOA that I have gets nearly 7 turns (not a clone gun), purchased late 2019. Maybe they've adjusted measurements since @BurtSaun1049 got theirs? Good question. I think my barrel dates from 2014-2015 timeframe. |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 8:47:08 PM EDT
[#2]
So I got my Leupold Mk4 MR/T 2.5-8x36mm with the M1 turrets, it's really nice
 What are the clone correct scope caps/covers? |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 8:48:20 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PA-Minuteman: So I got my Leupold Mk4 MR/T 2.5-8x36mm with the M1 turrets, it's really nice What are the clone correct scope caps/covers? Butler creek |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 9:12:05 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: Butler creek |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 9:29:09 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PA-Minuteman: Just plain Butler Creek? Also do you know what size? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PA-Minuteman: Originally Posted By kmcale: Butler creek I believe you can go on BC's site and look up what sizes you need. |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 10:01:23 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PA-Minuteman: Just plain Butler Creek? Also do you know what size? Measure the ends of the scope with a micrometer and refer to the chart on their website. |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 10:10:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Engineer5: Measure the ends of the scope with a micrometer and refer to the chart on their website. This. And get the smaller of the two if you are in between sizes. |
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Posted: 5/22/2020 10:47:59 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyPilot12: This. And get the smaller of the two if you are in between sizes. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ArmyPilot12: Originally Posted By Engineer5: Measure the ends of the scope with a micrometer and refer to the chart on their website. This. And get the smaller of the two if you are in between sizes. This too. Some of my occular covers will slide off if you look at them wrong even though "they fit". |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 5/22/2020 11:04:54 PM EDT
[#9]
Is the Ops Inc Muzzle Break that Brownells sells clone correct? Or is only the Allen Engineering the only clone correct currently produced?
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Posted: 5/22/2020 11:43:05 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By nickbowen5: Is the Ops Inc Muzzle Break that Brownells sells clone correct? Or is only the Allen Engineering the only clone correct currently produced? Ops Inc is no longer in business. AE took over production when they closed up. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 5/22/2020 11:45:29 PM EDT
[#11]
That's what I was under the impression of. However, the following link appears to refer to the product as ops inc.
https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/muzzle-devices/compensators-amp-muzzle-brakes/ar-15-12th-model-muzzle-brake-kit-22-caliber-prod55418.aspx |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 12:07:12 AM EDT
[#12]
Ron has mentioned that brakes and collars coming from "certain other vendors" have been causing problems, they're not concentric and have a myriad of issues.
I'd go through Ron direct or ADCO personally. |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 12:50:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: secretwheelman]
[#13]
Butler creek Cap sizes:
For the 2.5-8x36 13 eye 19 obj The 3.5-10x40 13 eye 26 obj |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 1:06:54 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mra4523: Anyone have any recommendations for a mounting system for the Docter Sight on top of the MK 4 like the picture shown. I know the ring cap is A.R.M.S. #22 TRC, but the flat mount below it is escaping me. Thoughts?http://www.imfdb.org/images/1/18/Lone76.jpg That is the A.R.M.S #22 TRC with the TRR (tactical ring rail). It was cut on down so that it was the same length as the TRC. I have 2 sets of these that I chopped. It's fairly easy, just need to have the right tools. Here's my Mk12 with the modified TRC/TRR.  Attached File |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 11:01:35 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mra4523: Well, I think I'm going to trade off my MK 4 Leupold in pursuit of a Nightforce NXS instead. I think for me at the end of the day, the scopes got to be what I want vs. clone correct. Anyone have any experience with the newer NXS 2-10x42 vs the 2-10x32 of old. I want to see if anyones thrown that on their MK12 and had preferences. Get a newer production x24 in MIL/MIL and you will absolutely LOVE it. 
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Posted: 5/23/2020 2:11:52 PM EDT
[#16]
FINALLY got some time to shoot some loads with 77 TMKs and XBR. Shot great, like a whole new gun.
Could’ve easily kept every group at 1” or better if not for the crazy ass wind/gusts shaking the truck. 
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Posted: 5/23/2020 6:24:59 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RTUtah: Get a newer production x24 in MIL/MIL and you will absolutely LOVE it. https://i.imgur.com/5wookqA.jpg Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RTUtah: Originally Posted By mra4523: Well, I think I'm going to trade off my MK 4 Leupold in pursuit of a Nightforce NXS instead. I think for me at the end of the day, the scopes got to be what I want vs. clone correct. Anyone have any experience with the newer NXS 2-10x42 vs the 2-10x32 of old. I want to see if anyones thrown that on their MK12 and had preferences. Get a newer production x24 in MIL/MIL and you will absolutely LOVE it. https://i.imgur.com/5wookqA.jpg I support this. Really amazing scope 
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 7:35:02 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By nickbowen5: That's what I was under the impression of. However, the following link appears to refer to the product as ops inc. https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/muzzle-devices/compensators-amp-muzzle-brakes/ar-15-12th-model-muzzle-brake-kit-22-caliber-prod55418.aspx I got my brake and collar from Centurion. Positive they are not using a knock off. |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 7:40:20 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By nickbowen5: That's what I was under the impression of. However, the following link appears to refer to the product as ops inc. https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/muzzle-devices/compensators-amp-muzzle-brakes/ar-15-12th-model-muzzle-brake-kit-22-caliber-prod55418.aspx That price is pretty ridiculous.. I would just contact Allen Engineering directly. Last time I emailed Ron, he said he had all collars in stock (like a month ago), im not sure about the brakes. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 8:08:41 PM EDT
[#20]
Brake and long collar:
$150 + shipping at Centurion. May not be the cheapest but they are GREAT people. https://www.centurionarms.com/ops-inc-brake-collar-p/17obc.htm |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 9:36:00 PM EDT
[#21]
Just for reference
left- BCM/long collar = 5 1/4 turns Right- Douglas/short collar = 8 1/2 turns  Attached File |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 5/23/2020 9:50:06 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By js1977: Just for reference left- BCM/long collar = 5 1/4 turns Right- Douglas/short collar = 8 1/2 turns https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/438461/0E2597AB-0C73-434E-9B13-FB4C228F1E63_jpe-1429936.JPG We're the original number of turns 4? So it was considered "QD" by the gov? |
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Posted: 5/23/2020 10:47:51 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By nickbowen5: Is the Ops Inc Muzzle Break that Brownells sells clone correct? Or is only the Allen Engineering the only clone correct currently produced? No. I bought one a while back and it came with the short collar. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 3:05:24 AM EDT
[#24]
If I understood Ron correctly, it may very well be that the shell of the old OPS Inc is still going somewhere producing brakes and collars, as I believe Ron was wanting originally to buy out/take over OPS but OP's family cut him out of it.
Basically, if stuff isn't actually being advertised as Allen Engineering AEMB and collar, it's not coming from Ron and his guys, or they've chosen to list stuff as OPS because they know people are just searching old posted parts lists for Mk12s looking for Ops Inc parts. But usually you specifically see Allen Engineering listed when it's Ron's parts. This is what I was alluding to above. On the thread in the Suppressor section and the AE owners FB page, there's been a pretty solid number of posts where people have sent in "OPS Inc" brakes and collars to him and he's found a lot of issues, especially with concentricity, and the threading. I don't know if he's straight up identified the source of these various brakes and stuff but it's my understanding that there absolutely are other brakes/collars being made out there not by him, and that they are causing problems. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 11:21:45 AM EDT
[#25]
Capital armory sells Allen Engineering brakes and collars. Good price too.
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Posted: 5/24/2020 2:06:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RTUtah]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lancecriminal86: If I understood Ron correctly, it may very well be that the shell of the old OPS Inc is still going somewhere producing brakes and collars, as I believe Ron was wanting originally to buy out/take over OPS but OP's family cut him out of it. Basically, if stuff isn't actually being advertised as Allen Engineering AEMB and collar, it's not coming from Ron and his guys, or they've chosen to list stuff as OPS because they know people are just searching old posted parts lists for Mk12s looking for Ops Inc parts. But usually you specifically see Allen Engineering listed when it's Ron's parts. This is what I was alluding to above. On the thread in the Suppressor section and the AE owners FB page, there's been a pretty solid number of posts where people have sent in "OPS Inc" brakes and collars to him and he's found a lot of issues, especially with concentricity, and the threading. I don't know if he's straight up identified the source of these various brakes and stuff but it's my understanding that there absolutely are other brakes/collars being made out there not by him, and that they are causing problems. I remember when I was hunting for the 12th Model all those years ago, and learned that Ron had split and started AE. I don't think the clone community had quite warmed up to the idea of using the M5 can as opposed to the OG 12th Model yet. We've come a long way since then and I'm not sure I'd use anything but AE parts for a Mk12 build. Not unless it was new-old-stock OPS Inc. parts, that is. Ron's the absolute man and his design is still very relevant I think. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 2:16:31 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RTUtah: I remember when I was hunting for the 12th Model all those years ago, and learned that Ron had split and started AE. I don't think the clone community had quite warmed up to the idea of using the M5 can as opposed to the OG 12th Model yet. We've come a long way since then and I'm not sure I'd use anything but AE parts for a Mk12 build. Not unless it was new-old-stock OPS Inc. parts, that is. Ron's the absolute man and his design is still very relevant I think. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RTUtah: Originally Posted By lancecriminal86: If I understood Ron correctly, it may very well be that the shell of the old OPS Inc is still going somewhere producing brakes and collars, as I believe Ron was wanting originally to buy out/take over OPS but OP's family cut him out of it. Basically, if stuff isn't actually being advertised as Allen Engineering AEMB and collar, it's not coming from Ron and his guys, or they've chosen to list stuff as OPS because they know people are just searching old posted parts lists for Mk12s looking for Ops Inc parts. But usually you specifically see Allen Engineering listed when it's Ron's parts. This is what I was alluding to above. On the thread in the Suppressor section and the AE owners FB page, there's been a pretty solid number of posts where people have sent in "OPS Inc" brakes and collars to him and he's found a lot of issues, especially with concentricity, and the threading. I don't know if he's straight up identified the source of these various brakes and stuff but it's my understanding that there absolutely are other brakes/collars being made out there not by him, and that they are causing problems. I remember when I was hunting for the 12th Model all those years ago, and learned that Ron had split and started AE. I don't think the clone community had quite warmed up to the idea of using the M5 can as opposed to the OG 12th Model yet. We've come a long way since then and I'm not sure I'd use anything but AE parts for a Mk12 build. Not unless it was new-old-stock OPS Inc. parts, that is. Ron's the absolute man and his design is still very relevant I think. It's been fun to see AE get the respect and admiration that Ron and his company deserves. There are a lot of attention whores, drama queens, and charlatans in the firearm/silencer industry, but Ron is a bright light, always classy, and a straight shooter, and I just really love his cans, and it's nice to see a lot of other people do too. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 5:50:12 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mra4523: Well, I think I'm going to trade off my MK 4 Leupold in pursuit of a Nightforce NXS instead. I think for me at the end of the day, the scopes got to be what I want vs. clone correct. Anyone have any experience with the newer NXS 2-10x42 vs the 2-10x32 of old. I want to see if anyones thrown that on their MK12 and had preferences. I use a 32mm np-r2 on my mod 1. I feel the 2.5-10 nf is the perfect x range for the purpose of the rifle/cartridge. Any of the 2.5x10 nf scopes would be better than the leupolds IMHO. Out of the three 2.5.10's I'd opt for the 42mm objective, with the 32 in second and the 24 last. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2020 8:37:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Honda4828: I use a 32mm np-r2 on my mod 1. I feel the 2.5-10 nf is the perfect x range for the purpose of the rifle/cartridge. Any of the 2.5x10 nf scopes would be better than the leupolds IMHO. Out of the three 2.5.10's I'd opt for the 42mm objective, with the 32 in second and the 24 last. That’s kind of what I was thinking. I got the leupold on a killer buy and pulled the trigger but now I wish I would have just waited and bought the Nightforce instead. You live and you learn I suppose. No trade offers so I’m probably just going to list the MK4 for sale and get the Nightforce. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/24/2020 9:22:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: stainlineho]
[#30]
edit
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Posted: 5/24/2020 9:55:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: kmcale]
[#31]
Has anyone here ever modified a full 1913 swan sleeve for the double/uneven spacing? Pulled the trigger on the one that was posted earlier today in the EE..
Depending how its done/recommendations, I'm debating on just leaving it as it is because of the rarity of the item. I dont want to mess with a unicorn of a gun part in permanent way, the only idea I have would be a "permanent" modification Eta: unless there's a full 1913 railed swan sleeve that's been seen itw??
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Posted: 5/24/2020 10:27:12 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: Has anyone here ever modified a full 1913 swan sleeve for the double/uneven spacing? Pulled the trigger on the one that was posted earlier today in the EE.. Depending how its done/recommendations, I'm debating on just leaving it as it is because of the rarity of the item. I dont want to mess with a unicorn of a gun part in permanent way, the only idea I have would be a "permanent" modification Eta: unless there's a full 1913 railed swan sleeve that's been seen itw?? Lol, you already know who you seek. YO! @Hunterex! As to the full pic, we never saw any ITW pics but there was a prototype 6.8 Late Mod 0 pic with one hand cut for the Gen 3 handguard. Allegedly full pic were requested at some point, and could maybe have gotten a small amount of use somewhere. But, no concrete proof on that. It does make sense though, as with the PVS-22 coming online the desire for mounting clip-on NV became more desirable IMO than running a PEQ-2 on top, which pretty much nobody ever did. Except @Stukas87, but he actually had a PVS-17 mounted when he did that, instead of the Vari-X III that usually was on his SPR. But he was also a guy that ran an ACOG on his as he preferred the lower magnification for how he was using his SPR. |
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Posted: 5/24/2020 11:25:19 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lancecriminal86: Lol, you already know who you seek. YO! @Hunterex! As to the full pic, we never saw any ITW pics but there was a prototype 6.8 Late Mod 0 pic with one hand cut for the Gen 3 handguard. Allegedly full pic were requested at some point, and could maybe have gotten a small amount of use somewhere. But, no concrete proof on that. It does make sense though, as with the PVS-22 coming online the desire for mounting clip-on NV became more desirable IMO than running a PEQ-2 on top, which pretty much nobody ever did. Except @Stukas87, but he actually had a PVS-17 mounted when he did that, instead of the Vari-X III that usually was on his SPR. But he was also a guy that ran an ACOG on his as he preferred the lower magnification for how he was using his SPR. I thought Hunterex to be the one to talk to about that. After reading your reply, sticking to just the full rail seems to be most appealing to me.. the functionality of the full rail makes the most sense, I certainly can understand the reasoning behind the request for them. An ACOG? That would be an interesting thing to see. Would there happen to be a picture of that on one of your glorious picture threads? |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 1:06:50 AM EDT
[#34]
Remember this drawing?
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Posted: 5/25/2020 1:22:14 PM EDT
[#35]
Can someone school me on when & why KAC started marking FF long rails as p/n 21318 versus p/n 99167?
I tried searching the web and here but all i get is EE posts. |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 1:44:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: kmcale]
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JLAudio: Can someone school me on when & why KAC started marking FF long rails as p/n 21318 versus p/n 99167? I tried searching the web and here but all i get is EE posts. Disregard. KAC website lists as 21318. I too am interested in this bit of information |
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USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 2:07:23 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JLAudio: Can someone school me on when & why KAC started marking FF long rails as p/n 21318 versus p/n 99167? I tried searching the web and here but all i get is EE posts. As far as I know it was just a P/N update. There are no revisions between the two, other than markings. |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 2:29:01 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dobs013: As far as I know it was just a P/N update. There are no revisions between the two, other than markings. Yep, they are the same. I have two rails. The 21318 rail I bought from operation parts about 10 months ago. The 99167 marked rail came from Chris at shark arms a few months ago. Both boxes are marked 21318, i think the shark arms stock was new old stock. I'm thinking of moving the 99167 marked rail to the mk12 mod 1 upper and using the 21318 marked rail for a nsw recce build. Both will be painted but its the little details that matter, and i caught myself searching for a new 99167 rail last night.... |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 2:56:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: footsoldier9th]
[#39]
My mod1 build so far. I have a nodak lower on backorder and my leupold is being serviced. Still need scope rings and a pri charging handle. Any critique is welcome. Rattle can will come when its all assembled.
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Posted: 5/25/2020 2:59:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: kmcale]
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: My mod1 build so far. I have a nodak lower on backorder and my leupold is being serviced. Still need scope rings and a pri charging handle. Any critique is welcome. Rattle can will come its all assembled. https://i.imgur.com/S2YOU2L.jpg https://i.imgur.com/ZlVOiG4.jpg https://i.imgur.com/C5gf0CI.jpg https://i.imgur.com/udQ2p0o.jpg https://i.imgur.com/JgCGSFF.jpg https://i.imgur.com/9xvkWFm.jpg https://i.imgur.com/NpZzR2c.jpg Looks good to go with the exception of the lower. Once that A1 NDS gets put on there it'll be mighty fine. Scratch that, I had to look at my pictures of deployment cases, its in the right spot
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 3:05:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: footsoldier9th]
[#41]
Thanks had to do the same thing. I had it moved forward and then went to store it and had to reposition it.
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: Looks good to go with the exception of the lower. Once that A1 NDS gets put on there it'll be mighty fine. Scratch that, I had to look at my pictures of deployment cases, its in the right spot |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 3:08:48 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: Thanks had to do the same thing. I had it moved forward and then went to store it and had to reposition it. That contract barrel is certainly a bread winner. With the parts I've gathered the last 2 weeks for my Mod 0, I wish I would've jumped on a contract barrel as well |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 3:12:25 PM EDT
[#43]
Yeah I was pretty excited to pick one up. I am going to feel bad covering it up when I rattle can it. Part of me almost wants to keep it black so you can still see the barrel.-
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kmcale: That contract barrel is certainly a bread winner. With the parts I've gathered the last 2 weeks for my Mod 0, I wish I would've jumped on a contract barrel as well |
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USA
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Posted: 5/25/2020 8:05:33 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: My mod1 build so far. I have a nodak lower on backorder and my leupold is being serviced. Still need scope rings and a pri charging handle. Any critique is welcome. Rattle can will come when its all assembled. https://i.imgur.com/S2YOU2L.jpg https://i.imgur.com/ZlVOiG4.jpg https://i.imgur.com/C5gf0CI.jpg https://i.imgur.com/udQ2p0o.jpg https://i.imgur.com/JgCGSFF.jpg https://i.imgur.com/9xvkWFm.jpg https://i.imgur.com/NpZzR2c.jpg We need a like button! |
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Posted: 5/25/2020 8:30:53 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: Yeah I was pretty excited to pick one up. I am going to feel bad covering it up when I rattle can it. Part of me almost wants to keep it black so you can still see the barrel.- Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: Yeah I was pretty excited to pick one up. I am going to feel bad covering it up when I rattle can it. Part of me almost wants to keep it black so you can still see the barrel.- Originally Posted By kmcale: That contract barrel is certainly a bread winner. With the parts I've gathered the last 2 weeks for my Mod 0, I wish I would've jumped on a contract barrel as well Paint the gun seperate from the barrel and maybe even paint a few components slightly different. It would make it look like it was built from used parts. |
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Posted: 5/26/2020 1:25:49 AM EDT
[#46]
Stuff paper towel roll tubes down over the barrel under the handguard.
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Posted: 5/26/2020 7:28:50 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lancecriminal86: Stuff paper towel roll tubes down over the barrel under the handguard. There you go. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 9:06:01 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lancecriminal86: Stuff paper towel roll tubes down over the barrel under the handguard. Good idea |
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 9:11:42 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By footsoldier9th: Good idea You can roll 11x18 or 8.5x11 copier paper length wise also. You can roll tighter initially to get it under the tube easy then when you let go it will expand and fill the whole area in the tube. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/26/2020 4:34:02 PM EDT
[#50]
So I think I’m gonna give this barrel nut a go. I ordered a new production barrel nut from PRI, which unless I’m delusional and I may be, is what I need to replicate except with the teeth full aft instead of forward toward the threads. So I should be able to pull all the dimensions needed off the replacement nut. I have a friend with a lathe and a rotary table so I should be able to give it a solid attempt. Thinking of making it out of 17-4 round bar.
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