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Posted: 3/30/2006 9:26:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 10:45:46 PM EDT by POF-USA]
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 10:07:26 PM EDT
Are upper receivers only also available for sale? Price?
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 10:18:39 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 10:44:28 PM EDT
Are you going to be selling the silicon nickel plated upper receivers? As in just the receiver, no bolt, barrel etc.
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 11:35:45 PM EDT
Is this not the exact same gas piston upper that you have been selling for a while now? New news?
-jls7
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 11:47:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/30/2006 11:54:59 PM EDT by STG77]


When the M16 was introduced, it was claimed that it required no cleaning or lubrication.

We all know how that worked out.

From TBR, pg 87, yes really 87, 1962 Colt AR-15 manual:



The Colt AR-15 rifle will fire longer without cleaning or oiling than any other known rifle.



Link Posted: 3/31/2006 12:03:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:


When the M16 was introduced, it was claimed that it required no cleaning or lubrication.

We all know how that worked out.

From TBR, pg 87, yes really 87, 1962 Colt AR-15 manual:



The Colt AR-15 rifle will fire longer without cleaning or oiling than any other known rifle.






+1
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 1:36:55 AM EDT
I have to admit that I am a real fan of POF's products BUT this is a tough one to understand: NO LUBRICATION???

I guess I need to research "silicon nickel plating". It must be slippery stuff. I know that the hard-chromed bolt carrier is slippery smooth but I still lube it.

I definitely understand why the gas system requires no lubrication. It appears to be designed so that the tappet "rides on a cushion of air" down the gas tube. It is a very interesting design.

I am going to enjoy trying to break it.


Link Posted: 3/31/2006 1:53:47 AM EDT
How does this new material w/Patent Pending, compare to the one Colt has adopted (or purchased rights to)?

IIRC, they make similar claims about their product which included nickel in its' composition.

And BTW, if your product performance achieves even half the claim -- it will be a very big winner

Congratulations!!!
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 3:11:35 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 3:24:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 3:40:57 AM EDT
Sounds pretty cool. After cleaning my carbine after some serious range time this part weekend, it would be nice to puch the bore and wipe off a few parts. Looking foward to hearing some first hand experiences.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 4:32:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By STG77:

From TBR, pg 87, yes really 87, 1962 Colt AR-15 manual:



Coincidence? I think not!
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 4:36:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

Originally Posted By jls7:
Is this not the exact same gas piston upper that you have been selling for a while now? New news?
-jls7



It is our gas piston upper but with MORE enchancements/upgrades.
We are the only AR15/M16 weapon system to have and offer a
Heat Sink Barrel nut. This is a very effective way to eliminate Heat
from the barrel. It also provides strength and rigidity to the barreled
upper.

Our entire gas piston operating system is hard chrome plated STANDARD (C.R.O.S.).
Now with the addition of the silicon nockel plating of the charging handle and
upper receiver (interior only), the weapon /operating system doesn't require Oil or Lube.
You can still use oil/lube if you elect too.

Our gas piston weapon system eliminate Heat and Carbon from the bolt carrier assemble
and upper receiver, shoot steel cased ammo, operate at reduced heat having fluted barrels
and Oversized Heat Sink Barrel Nuts, and and don't require oil or lube.
Best regards,



When are they going to be available in .308 ?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 5:13:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2006 5:17:26 AM EDT by Duffy]
Thanks Frank for bringing out new US designed and made products
I think folks here will be more inclined to believe the hard-to-believe claims if you have test data to back them up.
I wonder about the necessity of a barrel nut/chamber heat sink though. Does a barrel in the first two inches heat up more rapidly than other parts? How about heat in the rest of the barrel?
Or does the barrel nut have to be that size, which then also, as a fringe benefit, acts like a heat sink?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:02:11 AM EDT
How much does the new and improved barrel nut weigh?

It looks to be a solid and well-machined addition, but weight is a concern.

Thanks for any information!

BTW, the slim predator forend is a great idea.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 6:08:33 AM EDT
How's the heat transfer to your hand when using a mag-well hold with this system? I note that there is a solid "collar" before the heat ribs that might mitigate heat somewhat but it's also the closest part to the chamber...

FWIW I think it's great that you and other companies are coming up with new, innovative products to improve the AR platform. But I'd still oil it.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:08:24 AM EDT
What is the EXACT material the receiver is lined in? Is it electroless nickle impregnated with silicon carbide or something different? Silicon nickle is a bit vague. If it is lined with electroless nickle silicon carbide the coefficient of friction and wear characteristics blow hard chrome away and its more corrosion resistant to boot. I have an electroless nickle silicon carbide plated bolt already and if you will sell me a receiver please give me a price and direct me to a place to order the upper only, no barrel, but with forward assist and dust cover installed. The upper has M4 feed ramps I assume?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:58:50 AM EDT
Man I remember back what 2-3 years ago when POF posted his piston upper here on ARFCOM and nearly everyone about bludgeoned Frank to death over his upper. It was new and it scared folks I suppose. Funny how things work out.

I dont own one but have heard good reviews. Regardless of that three cheers for US drive and ingenuity. Thank Heaven there are people still willing to compete in the market.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 9:35:45 AM EDT
I have to admit that I am a pessimist. Fortunately for me, I am also an experimenter. I love trying new things. I have usually found that when something sounds too good to be true, it usually is; BUT there are those rare occasions when something turns out to be as good as advertised.

Frank's products have been those rare occasions. I love my POF gas-piston rifle. I love the Predator rail system he designed, and have you seen his new quick release bi-pod.

This guy has more tricks than Houdini!!!

Keep em coming Frank.
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 10:06:29 AM EDT
Nice. Keep innovating.

Low heat conductivity and frictionless coatings can do wonders for firearms once the process is perfected
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 10:28:15 AM EDT
Off to Google wtf silicon nickel plated is
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 10:32:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 3:10:11 PM EDT
Dear Frank/Chris , the question many people would like to know? when will the POF piston .308 be ready and how much for the fun awww I mean gun?
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:26:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:29:25 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/31/2006 8:41:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/31/2006 8:44:26 PM EDT by POF-USA]
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 2:30:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

Originally Posted By redfisher:
How does this new material w/Patent Pending, compare to the one Colt has adopted (or purchased rights to)?

IIRC, they make similar claims about their product which included nickel in its' composition.

And BTW, if your product performance achieves even half the claim -- it will be a very big winner

Congratulations!!!



Thank you.

Never heard or seen any options offered by Colt that allows their weapon system to operate without oil/lube. You would think they would have displayed this at the Shot Show.

Our entire gas piston operating system is hard chrome plated and now our charging handle/ upper receivers have a silicon nickel interior (think of a harden metal sleeve in the interior of the upper receiver), while maintaining the mil-spec anodize on the outside of the upper receiver/charging handle.
Best regards




Here is an announcement of the Colt/UCT technology

It is worth noting that you have a product that includes integration of heat resistance and friction fighting elements.......and is in use now.

This could be big
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 3:40:19 AM EDT
How long until the slim rail system hits the market?
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 6:24:29 AM EDT
Wreakdiver's post reminded me of something:
When I was originally researching POF's gas piston upper I came across a reviewer who had wonderful things to say about the gas system but thought the Predator rail system with the full length rails on all four sides was too wide. I had just about decided to order the model with the M4 plastic hand guards.
The gentlemen I placed the order with at POF convinced me that I should try the Predator for my self.

I am glad I did! The Predator came with the thin "ladder rail" covers and it fits my medium sized hands perfectly. I like the option of the slimmer rail but I think I am going to stick with the standard rail for my second POF rifle.

The reviewer must have had very small hands.

Now I still have to admit that I would like to see Frank come up with a slimmer barrel nut so we can have the option of using the A.R.M.S. SIR system with his gas piston upper. I love options. Until he does, I will use and enjoy the Predator rail system.
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 6:39:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 6:49:20 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 7:13:43 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:08:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

Never heard or seen any options offered by Colt that allows their weapon system to operate without oil/lube. You would think they would have displayed this at the Shot Show.




They did display it at the Shot Show. That is where I saw it.
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:09:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/1/2006 8:13:28 AM EDT by rsilvers]

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

As far as coatings to eliminate the need for lube we have done this with our product from day one.
Our entire gas piston operating system is hard chrome plated including the Gas Block.

As of last year we have upgraded our upper receiver (interior only), to include these features.
Best regards

Patriot ordnance Factory



It seems from this last message you are saying that hard-chrome eliminates the need for lube. That is not something I have seen others say before, so did you mean to say some other coating? Or did you really mean hard-chrome?
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:15:30 AM EDT
Interesting. I would be interested to see how the plating holds up. I have never been too keen about plating on aluminum, then again never been too keen about the steel bolt carrier in the aluminum receiver to begin with.

Kudos for trying something new.
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:43:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/1/2006 8:44:30 AM EDT by Grendelizor]
I wonder if the silicon nickle coating has been tested in extreme cold? Extreme cold can play hell with all kinds of metal parts.

John

P.S. Being from Minnesota, I'm just askin' . . .
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:46:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/1/2006 8:49:51 AM EDT by rsilvers]
I think we are at the point where we can do a lubeless gun, or nearly so. In 20 years it will be common, and someone has already figured it out but we will be slow to trust them. So it is here now if we just learn which process we should believe in.

POF needs to do a dual (200 round) Beta-mag dump in full auto with temp probes embedded in the receiver -- and compare this to a normal gun with oil. When I see that data, if it looks fine (compared to a gun with lube), I will be all over it.
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 5:31:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 5:53:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 7:03:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/1/2006 7:04:34 PM EDT by SinistralRifleman]
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 7:58:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/1/2006 8:00:05 PM EDT by dsg2003gt]
how can I find out the prices on your complete rifles...they arent listed on your site?


eta: who manufatures your lower receivers,it looks like LMT?
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 8:00:15 PM EDT
What about Robar NP3 as a lubeless coating?
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 11:28:41 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 11:33:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/3/2006 12:34:35 AM EDT by POF-USA]
Link Posted: 4/1/2006 11:44:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

P-12SX: Predator (full lenght) slim version tactical rail.
www.pof-usa.com/DSC02413106.JPG




Frank, that is freaking sweet! When you get the .308's produced, I'm going to have to pick one up.

BTW, if you get 5 or 10 minutes of free time, call me at 409-622-9319 and leave your cell number on my voicemail. I came across some neat coatings that you might be interested in. I can hook you up with contact info, and give some details.
Link Posted: 4/2/2006 1:20:12 AM EDT

eta: who manufatures your lower receivers,it looks like LMT?


Not LMT.... I dunno if they want anyone to say... But their lowers are really nice. ;)
Link Posted: 4/2/2006 1:44:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By POF-USA:

Originally Posted By fdawg:
Dear Frank/Chris , the question many people would like to know? when will the POF piston .308 be ready and how much for the fun awww I mean gun?



Thanks for the inquiry. Please be patient.
They will be available in the near future.
We will let all know when they are avaiable.
We will have pricing until we let all know we
are taling orders.
Best regards


Ok, it's been a few. Hurry up already!



Please make it compatible with the AR10.....
Link Posted: 4/2/2006 3:13:28 AM EDT
Are there any plans to make a 20"? Or will the 18" be as big they get?
Link Posted: 4/2/2006 6:42:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/3/2006 12:35:04 AM EDT by POF-USA]
Link Posted: 4/2/2006 11:34:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/3/2006 12:35:28 AM EDT by POF-USA]
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