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Posted: 3/11/2006 6:15:37 AM EDT
A local store has one of these on clearance, a good price I think. This will be my first AR. I was looking at M4's, but this one's $150 less, tele stock, removable handle, flash hider, etc. I like the weight and balance of the skinny barrel, but is it too skinny? Does it get to hot too fast? How is accuracy?
This will mainly be a plinker toy, coyote killer, home defense tool, not a serious paper puncher. I might put some sort of optic on it and use it for 2-300 yard shots at coyotes on the farm.
Anyway, will this do what I want it to, or should I try to get a heavier barrel?
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 6:28:50 AM EDT
You will not regret a superlight. That $150 can buy lots of practice ammo and mags.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 6:41:52 AM EDT
i love the bm superlight bbl.


heats up faster but in turn also cools down faster and i would say the accuracy with std off the shelf ammo the two configs. will be similar.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 6:45:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lab:
A local store has one of these on clearance, a good price I think. This will be my first AR. I was looking at M4's, but this one's $150 less, tele stock, removable handle, flash hider, etc. I like the weight and balance of the skinny barrel, but is it too skinny? Does it get to hot too fast? How is accuracy?
This will mainly be a plinker toy, coyote killer, home defense tool, not a serious paper puncher. I might put some sort of optic on it and use it for 2-300 yard shots at coyotes on the farm.
Anyway, will this do what I want it to, or should I try to get a heavier barrel?



Just so you know, the term "Superlight" is simply Bushmaster's term for "pencil barrel" which was the standard barrel on AR for many, many, years.

Pencil barrels ROCK...and in all honesty...any M4 or Gov't profil barrel is only heavy from the Front Sight Band forward....beneath the handguard ( where it counts ) it is still a pencil barrel.

SO BUY THAT BUSHIE!!!! NOWWWWW!!!!
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 7:20:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By desertmoon:

Originally Posted By Lab:
A local store has one of these on clearance, a good price I think. This will be my first AR. I was looking at M4's, but this one's $150 less, tele stock, removable handle, flash hider, etc. I like the weight and balance of the skinny barrel, but is it too skinny? Does it get to hot too fast? How is accuracy?
This will mainly be a plinker toy, coyote killer, home defense tool, not a serious paper puncher. I might put some sort of optic on it and use it for 2-300 yard shots at coyotes on the farm.
Anyway, will this do what I want it to, or should I try to get a heavier barrel?



Just so you know, the term "Superlight" is simply Bushmaster's term for "pencil barrel" which was the standard barrel on AR for many, many, years.

Pencil barrels ROCK...and in all honesty...any M4 or Gov't profil barrel is only heavy from the Front Sight Band forward....beneath the handguard ( where it counts ) it is still a pencil barrel.

SO BUY THAT BUSHIE!!!! NOWWWWW!!!!



How many "superlight" barrel M-16s were produced? 6-8 MILLION?

They obviously work just fine.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 8:13:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 8:30:04 AM EDT
You are not going to be using it for 1000 yard head shots, right?

Here are my two lightweights, one of a Bushmaster 16 inch that I cut down to 14.5 and had a Phantom permently mounted, the other is an Oly light weight 16 inch barrel.

Both are mixmaster guns.



Link Posted: 3/11/2006 10:20:34 AM EDT
A+ I carry mine 10 times as much as I do my 20" hbar.Quick on moving targets you' love it.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 10:42:15 AM EDT
Love my Superlight!



Link Posted: 3/11/2006 11:05:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ipschoser1:
Love my Superlight!

pic15.picturetrail.com/VOL615/3680850/9209955/131954830.jpg




+1

Link Posted: 3/11/2006 12:50:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/11/2006 12:52:04 PM EDT by Lab]

Originally Posted By Stickman:
With what you are describing, it sounds like a great deal. As already stated, it heats up and cools down quicker than other barrels. Accuracy shouldn't be an issue at all for you with that barrel.

Just out of curiosity, how much are they asking?



Arrrgggghhhh!!!!!! hereheyAre these decent prices? He has the best price I've found locally. Where's on the internet has the best prices?heThanks.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 3:00:52 PM EDT
Love that Barrel!

I want a 14.7 L.W. 1/7 twist

instead I bought the LMT14.5
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 3:11:29 PM EDT
I can't wait 'till mine arrives. BM said mid-late March for delivery
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 10:39:41 AM EDT
I paid $915 & $930 for two of my BFI M4/A3s last year. I'd say the price @ $915 if it's a flat top M4 isn't too bad, but all of my M4s are 16"+ flash suppressor. Not the 14.5+Perm attached muzzle device. I personally don't care for the 14.5" barrels cause I just can't stand not being able to switch the muzzle devices out to my hearts desire. (Although my Marine bayo would look awesome on a 16" carbine)

Ultimately it's up to you to decide if the M4 is a good deal... The great deal, IMHO, is the one you missed on that 16" SL A/3. If a similar carbines were on the shelf when I purchased my M4s, even at a slightly higher cost- I'd have less M4s. To me the weight savings and handling characteristics are worth a bit more considering the extra machining the factory has to perform to the barrel... I will have a BFI SL some day. Too bad you missed out. IMO, it's a great little carbine that would handle the use you detailed.

Sly
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 11:04:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By eklikwhoa:
i love the bm superlight bbl.


+1 my favorite barrel, just as accurate as any of my other BM barrels.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 11:42:17 AM EDT
As I get older the HBAR`S suck

I might just swap barrels on my A1 shorty 15HBAR Bushwacker

My LMT 14.5 M4 copy is so much lighter than my A1 15HBAR

FOREST can you tell alot between the L.W. 16 and LMT 14.5M4 copy?
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 11:57:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FMJ:
FOREST can you tell alot between the L.W. 16 and LMT 14.5M4 copy?



I can tell the difference blindfolded, but it's not much. The difference is about 2.5oz (16LW+A2 vs. 14.5"M4+Vortex). But the difference does allow my LW to balance better.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 12:24:43 PM EDT
Its not a BM barrel, but its just as good. Its a Colt.






And once you go light, you won't go back!
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 12:29:07 PM EDT
I love a SL barrel with the small taperd handguards.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 1:15:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 12:03:49 PM EDT by John44]
.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 1:36:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By John44:

Originally Posted By Lancelot:
Its not a BM barrel, but its just as good. Its a Colt.

coloradoshooting.org/ipw-web/gallery/albums/bbadmin-Album-1/CMT_CAR_020.sized.jpg

And once you go light, you won't go back!

Really? I guess I am a very odd fellow. I mean you people complain a bought how heavy the M4 is. The first time I heard this I fell off my chair! I all ways thought that the A2 was light. Not trying to brag but how many here have carried a 40lb pack+15lb web gear on a two day 32 mile hike at altitudes ranging from 9,000 to 11,000 feat? Yea it was hard and no I am not a Navy Delta Seal, I am planning on joining the Army soon though. I mean how do 18 year old 155 GIs carry M249s+gear day after day after day? Or the 125 lb VC in nam carry 10lb grand's and 20lb BARs+ gear??? Sorry not trying to piss any one off, but some people need to get real and work out! Rant over!



Where do you see people complaining about how heavy the M4 is?

I just see people pointing out that the lightweight/government barrel is superior, since there is no reason to carry more weight than you need to.

Having spent a LOT of time marching in the army with much heavier rifles than the AR15/M16 system, I can tell you that dropping a pound here or there makes a huge difference as the miles add on. When you are doing your 32 mile hike would you deliberately have chosen a backpack that weighed MORE, with no benefits to show for it? I think that's all people are saying - that the government profile is a BETTER CHOICE because it has the exact same functionality, but saves weight. Nobody is suggesting that the M4 is heavy - just that a govt profile 14.5-16" is generally a better choice.

For example, I recently bought a 20" government profiled upper, and I am NEVER getting an HBAR again, unless it is specfically a heavy barrel for match shooting. So I'm in the "once you go light, you won't go back" crowd, but I certainly don't think the M4 is heavy. I think it is very light (and small and CUTE too, compared to the things I had to carry around in the army )
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 1:54:38 PM EDT
lightweights or govt, they are both great

HBARs...i'm walking away from

regardless, sounds like a great deal, get it
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 1:57:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By John44:

Originally Posted By Lancelot:
Its not a BM barrel, but its just as good. Its a Colt.

coloradoshooting.org/ipw-web/gallery/albums/bbadmin-Album-1/CMT_CAR_020.sized.jpg

And once you go light, you won't go back!

Really? I guess I am a very odd fellow. I mean you people complain a bought how heavy the M4 is. The first time I heard this I fell off my chair! I all ways thought that the A2 was light. Not trying to brag but how many here have carried a 40lb pack+15lb web gear on a two day 32 mile hike at altitudes ranging from 9,000 to 11,000 feat?

Well that would be me. I was in the 10th Mountain Division. Ever humped an M-60 at altitude? Lets see, my M-60 was 23 pounds, plus my ruck, plus my ammo, plus...... No wait you haven't been in the milirtary. Guess you don't know.

Yea it was hard and no I am not a Navy Delta Seal, I am planning on joining the Army soon though. I mean how do 18 year old 155 GIs carry M249s+gear day after day after day? Or the 125 lb VC in nam carry 10lb grand's and 20lb BARs+ gear??? Sorry not trying to piss any one off, but some people need to get real and work out! Rant over!





I did not complain about the weight of an M4. I just said I liked the light one better. Be careful who you rant at. Someday its gonna bite you.



Now we can get back on topic.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 2:26:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By desertmoon:
Just so you know, the term "Superlight" is simply Bushmaster's term for "pencil barrel" which was the standard barrel on AR for many, many, years.


Is that true? I was never really clear about that? I guess the marketing worked on me because I always assumed it was somehow thinner (and hence lighter) then a Colt 6520 barrel?

From Bushmaster's site:
Diameter tapers from .670 inches at the chamber end to .600, then steps up to .625 at the sight base, and tapers to .570 from the sight base to the muzzle - similar to the original Vietnam era A1 barrel profile.


Is that exactly the same as the Colt? I didn't think the Colt's tapered from the sight base to the muzzle?

Thanks
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 4:27:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
Originally Posted By John44:
Originally Posted By Lancelot:
First Lancelot I was not ranting AT you or a bought you. Sorry if you thought I was!
Where do you see people complaining about how heavy the M4 is?
I saw one or two people who said it was to heavy
I just see people pointing out that the lightweight/government barrel is superior, since there is no reason to carry more weight than you need to.

Having spent a LOT of time marching in the army with much heavier rifles than the AR15/M16 system, I can tell you that dropping a pound here or there makes a huge difference as the miles add on. yes it dose When you are doing your 32 mile hike would you deliberately have chosen a backpack that weighed MORE, with no benefits to show for it? Yes because when I get to Ranger school I am going to carry lot of heavy sh*t a long way and I need to get prepared for that. I think that's all people are saying - that the government profile is a BETTER CHOICE because it has the exact same functionality, but saves weight. Nobody is suggesting that the M4 is heavy - just that a govt profile 14.5-16" is generally a better choice.

For example, I recently bought a 20" government profiled upper, and I am NEVER getting an HBAR again, unless it is specifically a heavy barrel for match shooting. So I'm in the "once you go light, you won't go back" crowd, but I certainly don't think the M4 is heavy. I think it is very light (and small and CUTE too, compared to the things I had to carry around in the army )


It was not a rant against light weight bbl, it was a rant against being out of shape. If you are in shape and could carry the HBAR 30mi but you carry the LW, more power to you. Carrying the LW is ok just so long as you don't become so out of shape you cant carry the heavy stuff. So if the shtf you need to be prepared to carry really heavy crap. Its just that so many people in the US are out of shape. A2s and M4 are plenty light for me so I don't plan on owning any LW bbls. I guess being 17 gets the best of me some times, so like Lancelot said get back on topic !

I just think that there should be more emphasis on being in shape than getting lighter gear.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 5:28:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/13/2006 5:29:18 PM EDT by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By John44:

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
Originally Posted By John44:
Originally Posted By Lancelot:
First Lancelot I was not ranting AT you or a bought you. Sorry if you thought I was!
Where do you see people complaining about how heavy the M4 is?
I saw one or two people who said it was to heavy
I just see people pointing out that the lightweight/government barrel is superior, since there is no reason to carry more weight than you need to.

Having spent a LOT of time marching in the army with much heavier rifles than the AR15/M16 system, I can tell you that dropping a pound here or there makes a huge difference as the miles add on. yes it dose When you are doing your 32 mile hike would you deliberately have chosen a backpack that weighed MORE, with no benefits to show for it? Yes because when I get to Ranger school I am going to carry lot of heavy sh*t a long way and I need to get prepared for that. I think that's all people are saying - that the government profile is a BETTER CHOICE because it has the exact same functionality, but saves weight. Nobody is suggesting that the M4 is heavy - just that a govt profile 14.5-16" is generally a better choice.

For example, I recently bought a 20" government profiled upper, and I am NEVER getting an HBAR again, unless it is specifically a heavy barrel for match shooting. So I'm in the "once you go light, you won't go back" crowd, but I certainly don't think the M4 is heavy. I think it is very light (and small and CUTE too, compared to the things I had to carry around in the army )


It was not a rant against light weight bbl, it was a rant against being out of shape. If you are in shape and could carry the HBAR 30mi but you carry the LW, more power to you. Carrying the LW is ok just so long as you don't become so out of shape you cant carry the heavy stuff. So if the shtf you need to be prepared to carry really heavy crap. Its just that so many people in the US are out of shape. A2s and M4 are plenty light for me so I don't plan on owning any LW bbls. I guess being 17 gets the best of me some times, so like Lancelot said get back on topic !

I just think that there should be more emphasis on being in shape than getting lighter gear.




Hey - getting off topic is what ar15.com is all about

I don't think we are really in disagreement at all, and of course there is nothing wrong with deliberately choosing heavier gear for TRAINING. I sed to make my platoon run through the obstacle course in full battle dress and with all the platoon gear. Try climbing a 5m net ladder and down the other side with a Ma Deuce or 84mm ammo sometime I am in complete agreement with you there.

Those of us that have been in infantry are just pointing out once you are actually humping stuff around, you want all your equipment to be as leighweight as possible - and for some kind of SHTF scenario, it would be retarded to take an HBAR instead of a LW.

But for training - absolutely go crazy!! Throw some extra rocks into your backback and bring an ammo crate filled with sand on your next hike!


And I agree 100% with you that a lot of the couch commandoes out there should spend less time worrying about a few extra ounces in their barrel, and worry about a few extra pounds on their gut instead.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 6:58:40 PM EDT
Yeah I think your traning gear should be 2X as heavy as the gear you take when the shtf.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:12:38 PM EDT
I love mine ....

Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:17:12 PM EDT
Are any manufacturers offering these lightweight barrels with longer handguards, such as mid or full length?
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:21:32 PM EDT
Lightweight barrels aren't a question of what people can "tolerate". It's a simple fact that no matter how built you are, you will always swing a lightweight barrel faster, and it will always be better balanced. Toss out the meathead philosophy. You cannot defeat physics by working out.

If all you've ever shot is HBARs, try out a LW carbine. You will truly be convinced that god/stoner meant the AR to be light.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:47:16 PM EDT
I have a mid length rifle. Adco turned the barrrel to pencil profile for me. It rocks I love the way it handles.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 3:15:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jhc:
I have a mid length rifle. Adco turned the barrrel to pencil profile for me. It rocks I love the way it handles.



Just under the handguards or the whole barrel? Did they use a .625 FSB or does it step up\down around the FSB? Got a pick of it without the handguards installed?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 3:23:15 AM EDT
Buy it & if your heart is set on a heavy barrel, I will trade you my 14.5" BM HB & throw in a new vortex type flash hider for your barrel
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 3:55:22 AM EDT
Yay, a lightweight picture thread!
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 4:00:41 AM EDT
As to the he-man who thinks anyone who prefers a lightweight is a "woosie"....

I guess you don't understand basic physiology huh? Lets say you're Lou Ferigno. Now Lou, let's say you have two rifles, one which weighs 6 lbs and another that weighs 8. Go home and get a good night's sleep and come back in the morning. OK, all rested now? Good. Take this 8lb rifle and hold it out straight in front of you for as long as you can. Done? Ok we're going to call that time X. Go get some more sleep and come back in the morning again. Rested up again? Not sore are you? Now take the 6lb rifle and hold it the same way. Wow, you can hold that rifle up much longer than X. Why is that? You're not a "woosie" are you? No, I guess it's that anyone, no matter how strong or weak, can hold, carry, and fire a lighter weapon for longer than they can a heavier one and no matter how long they hold or carry it, it's going to be more comfortable if it's lighter.

The bottom line is this, having extra weight for a good reason (like a flashlight) is a good thing, having extra weight for no good reason (like an HBAR) is a bad thing.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 4:10:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By in_burrito:
Yay, a lightweight picture thread!
216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/196/196030/folders/171062/18276916520s.jpg





Nice sticks....
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:55:06 AM EDT
I ain't no he-man or wuss but I can tell you that at the 15 mile mark that 7Lb M16A1 feels like it is 80 Lbs. you just want to chuck everything on the side of the road.

The M4 is nice and light, my A1 clone is nice and light, I gave away my Colt H-Bar barrel. My friend whom I gave the barrel to said, "holy shit, your not kidding, that is a HEAVY barrel, no wonder you hate it, it is like a 1" pipe with a little hole in it" My friend owns 2 "A1" style rifles with light weight barrels. He likes how the h-bar shoots on the bench, but he ain't going hiking with it.

I had a room-mate in Germany who lived in the gym, his arms were as big as your leg, this guy was strong. 100+ push ups on demand type of guy. He carries the '60 and on long marches and that pig would kick his ass. We figured that it is not totally the weight, but there is no way to carry this thing comfortably, very awkward to carry, same with a rifle, your not allowed to sling it over your back, you have to carry the thing at port-arms or ready arms when marching.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:26:04 AM EDT
You should have bought it! I love my BM superlite!!
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:38:09 AM EDT
I have a question:

Why is it okay for an AR to have a thin little barrel, and why does it still shoot accurately, but the Mini-14 has a thin little barrel and is an inaccurate POS after a few rounds?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:47:29 AM EDT
Quote by DK-Prof
"And I agree 100% with you that a lot of the couch commandoes out there should spend less time worrying about a few extra ounces in their barrel, and worry about a few extra pounds on their gut instead. " That was the point I was trying to make.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:54:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By John44:
Quote by DK-Prof
"And I agree 100% with you that a lot of the couch commandoes out there should spend less time worrying about a few extra ounces in their barrel, and worry about a few extra pounds on their gut instead. " That was the point I was trying to make.


And the point that you continue to miss is that one has nothing to do with the other.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 7:11:01 AM EDT
Alright already, enough with the BS. The kid is 17 and incase you've all forgotten, 17yo's know everything. Carrying on with this silly debate is a waste of bandwidth. Sorry kid but when you grow up, you will realize how little you actually know right now.

Back on topic. How closely does BM's Superlight barrel profile match that of the Colt's LW (6520) barrel?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 8:30:00 AM EDT
When I first clicked in I though I'd gotten the Richard Simon's weight watcher forum. I though this was about AR-15. I also noted the rant was from someone who would be "joining the Army" soon. Which means he will have plenty of time to grow up and live in the real world.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 9:03:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mr0w1:
I have a question:

Why is it okay for an AR to have a thin little barrel, and why does it still shoot accurately, but the Mini-14 has a thin little barrel and is an inaccurate POS after a few rounds?



I was curious about this, too. My Bushy currently has a 16" M4 upper, and I really enjoy it, but I was thinking about getting a 16" Superlight upper for my next one.

Why does the Mini have terrible accuracy after a few rounds compared to an AR? I had a Mini but sold it - I have no hands-on experience with a AR pencil barrel.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 9:23:16 AM EDT
I thought that part of the reason the Mini 14 was innacurate had to do with the thin barrel and the irregular pressure from the stock and barrel band.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 11:19:24 AM EDT
In light of the "couch commando counting ounces" comment check this out...

The BM 2006 Catalog lists the M4 at 6.22 lbs and the Superlight (with tele stock) at 6.25 lbs.

This can't be correct.

bradinnm
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 12:13:01 PM EDT
No I don't know every thing! I try to keep my mouth shut most of the time and listen and learn but every one in a wile some thing stupid falls out and I make a @$$ of my self. I hope this puts a end this pointless pissing contest and you all get back on topic.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 10:14:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 10:27:49 PM EDT by zragon13]
The IDF likes the thin barrels. Here is an M16 collection from our recent reserve duty. M16A2E3 in DM setup, standard 14.5 M16A1 carbine and sawed-off M16A1 converted to carbine on bottom.


Close up of carbine barrels



Personally I liked the weight and balance of the original 20 in. A1 better than the A2. The The DM rifle that I'm now issued feels much more front heavy (might be mostly because of the bipods though)
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 10:26:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 10:27:05 PM EDT by rsilvers]
I would go with a pencil barrel. It is my favorite kind of traditional M16. HBARs suck to me.
I hate my Colt HBAR 16 inch upper. I hate it even tucked in the corner for home defense. I would hate it even more if I had to carry it.
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 12:56:11 PM EDT
I just wish mine was a 1/7 or even a 1/9. But alas its an old 1/12.
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 1:31:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Kalash_223:
Are any manufacturers offering these lightweight barrels with longer handguards, such as mid or full length?



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