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Posted: 3/10/2006 3:35:52 PM EDT
I'm considering getting some plates. I'm wondering... does anyone have experience shooting your AR-15 with some SS109/M855 at steel plates vs. some .308 ball?

Level III is rated to .308 ball (and is only tested against .308 ball), Level IV is rated to .308 AP (and is only tested against .308 AP)... I just want to know if .308 ball will out-penetrate SS109/M855.

I would figure .308 ball would beat 5.56 AP hands down, but I'm just assuming, I have no idea.
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 3:52:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MlTCHELL:
I'm considering getting some plates. I'm wondering... does anyone have experience shooting your AR-15 with some SS109/M855 at steel plates vs. some .308 ball?

Level III is rated to .308 ball (and is only tested against .308 ball), Level IV is rated to .308 AP (and is only tested against .308 AP)... I just want to know if .308 ball will out-penetrate SS109/M855.

I would figure .308 ball would beat 5.56 AP hands down, but I'm just assuming, I have no idea.



Past tests have shown the opposite...

M855 (which is NOT AP) out-penetrates 7.62mm ball when fired at steel plates (eg 855 can still penetrate farther down range)...

Immagine what the AP round does in the same scenario
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 3:56:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/10/2006 4:11:42 PM EDT by MyakkaVice]

Originally Posted By Dave_A:

Originally Posted By MlTCHELL:
I'm considering getting some plates. I'm wondering... does anyone have experience shooting your AR-15 with some SS109/M855 at steel plates vs. some .308 ball?

Level III is rated to .308 ball (and is only tested against .308 ball), Level IV is rated to .308 AP (and is only tested against .308 AP)... I just want to know if .308 ball will out-penetrate SS109/M855.

I would figure .308 ball would beat 5.56 AP hands down, but I'm just assuming, I have no idea.



Past tests have shown the opposite...

M855 (which is NOT AP) out-penetrates 7.62mm ball when fired at steel plates (eg 855 can still penetrate farther down range)...

Immagine what the AP round does in the same scenario



I just shot some steel with 855 today, did not go through the thick end (sides) of an I-beam, but went through the thinner "center".



Two rounds of 62 grain wolf next to an M855 impact, you can almost see how the tip dug in. would'nt go through , at least from 100 yards.
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 4:06:57 PM EDT
Should be noted: Test I was referring to is ability to penetrate a same-thickness plate at varying distance...

Not how thick of a steel plate the round can penetrate at a fixed distance....
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 4:13:48 PM EDT
dude you must mean the level 3a plates, they will stop AP 5.56 and and AP 7.62x39,
level 3 will defeat up to a 44mag
level 4 will stop a AP 30-06
go wit the level 4 its worth the money
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 5:16:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/10/2006 5:19:31 PM EDT by thanegrooms]
I have not seen documentation that IIIA will stop 5.56.

Here's a link to the classifications:

www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/body-armor1.htm


Has anyone here tried m193 and m555 or Mk262 on vests (IIIA or III), since level IV inplies ceramic plates.
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 5:46:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/10/2006 5:48:12 PM EDT by DevL]
One of the tests to be certified level three NIJ standards is sustaining 5.56 hits. If it cant it cant be certified level III. Military certifications are different.
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 5:47:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TORQ:
dude you must mean the level 3a plates, they will stop AP 5.56 and and AP 7.62x39,
level 3 will defeat up to a 44mag
level 4 will stop a AP 30-06
go wit the level 4 its worth the money



No IIIa is soft armor. Level III is the plate and it stops 5.56
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 6:25:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Past tests have shown the opposite...

M855 (which is NOT AP) out-penetrates 7.62mm ball when fired at steel plates (eg 855 can still penetrate farther down range)...

Immagine what the AP round does in the same scenario


I thought M855 has a steel core, like SS109?
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 8:00:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MlTCHELL:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Past tests have shown the opposite...

M855 (which is NOT AP) out-penetrates 7.62mm ball when fired at steel plates (eg 855 can still penetrate farther down range)...

Immagine what the AP round does in the same scenario


I thought M855 has a steel core, like SS109?



M855 has a steel tip with a lead "base" the ammo-oracle page has some good drawings of it. I think they also have a cut in half M855 bullet picture that explains it very well.
Link Posted: 3/10/2006 8:12:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MlTCHELL:

Originally Posted By Dave_A:
Past tests have shown the opposite...

M855 (which is NOT AP) out-penetrates 7.62mm ball when fired at steel plates (eg 855 can still penetrate farther down range)...

Immagine what the AP round does in the same scenario


I thought M855 has a steel core, like SS109?



The M855 ROUND uses the SS109 BULLET. And the above post is correct, the actual "core" is lead, only 7 gr (out of the 62) are steel.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 12:02:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/11/2006 12:03:44 AM EDT by Glockfan]

Originally Posted By TORQ:
dude you must mean the level 3a plates, they will stop AP 5.56 and and AP 7.62x39,
level 3 will defeat up to a 44mag
level 4 will stop a AP 30-06
go wit the level 4 its worth the money



Little off. 3A will stop up to a 4 4mag.
Level 3 which is hard protection will stop 308 ball ammo.
Level 4 will stop 308 AP ammo.

Whopps guess that was already corrected.

Pat
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 4:59:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/11/2006 5:06:09 AM EDT by Phoebus]
Level III will stop M855, I have seen it firsthand. My plate took a hit, and after I got a replacement we shot the old one a couple of times.

I wanted to keep it but the Army took it back

ETA: Of course, these are the ceramic SAPI plates, but all Level III plates should have equivalent protection.

Edited to change IIIA to III
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