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Posted: 2/1/2006 11:08:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 11:10:42 AM EDT by RustedAce]
After forever of waiting becuase my local range decided no more FMJ ammo, I finally got to try it out on some land a friend owns. Only shot steel targets out to 300 so by no means an accuracy test, but for performance it rocked.

Not one problem, shot 700+ rounds out of my AR10 with it, not one problem, magically my AR10 didnt even have a single jam, which is a first for it. No light strikes, no mistimed firings, no problems, it didnt work loose during the firing, I figure if it works with the higher recoil of the AR10 then it should stay put with 556 forever.

Trigger was so nice and light I basically kept forgetting good trigger control and just jerked at the trigger, still didnt miss.

Overall very impressed, I will be ordering another one for one of my AR15 lowers as soon as funds allow.

mandatory gun porn:
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:16:29 AM EDT
nice
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:20:47 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:26:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 11:30:01 AM EDT by DevL]
STOP IT!!!! All this talk makes me want to sell my KAC trigger and buy a Geissele. It is the only thing that has stayed on every build I have rebuilt and sold and built up again over the past years. Must...resist....urge...

Was this the Service or Match version?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:43:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bigbore:
Good to hear, but I knew you'd like it. And to think you originally wanted an RRA trigger

I'm well over the 2K mark with the Geissele trigger in my SBR and no issues either. I expect the trigger to hold up just as well in my AR10. I just dont run through as many rounds at a session with the .30



As soon as funds are available I will have to grab up another one from you, I cant stand my stock trigger on my 15 now.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 12:58:56 PM EDT
The trigger that you sell on the ADCO site...is it a service or match version? I'm not sure if you offer both because I didn't notice the choice to select between the two?

Was it a drop in install on your AR-10, bigbore?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:14:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Mthr1:
The trigger that you sell on the ADCO site...is it a service or match version? I'm not sure if you offer both because I didn't notice the choice to select between the two?

Was it a drop in install on your AR-10, bigbore?



It goes in just like a normal trigger, took me about 2 minutes to do.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 2:50:56 PM EDT
That's it. I'm ordering one tomorrow.....
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 3:37:44 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:30:23 PM EDT
I will not be using it on a carbine. I would be using it on a 22" AR-10.

I would imagine the match variant would be a better fit. You carry both? How would you specify when ordering?

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:32:16 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:01:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 3:16:49 AM EDT by watersniper]
Having tried both I would agree with bigbore's comments, the service trigger "feels" almost like a single stage. I will be installing one at my next range trip. Like I've said before, this is one of the best upgrades to an AR15...

Anyone wanna buy my RRA 2-stage?

Yea I like to live dangerously, so I may get the service grade and adjust it to the lighter side...

Here's a video of this trigger in action
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:06:39 PM EDT
Can you confirm these numbers?

On the match trigger, the weight on the second stage is 4-14oz? On the service, it's 8oz-1.5LB?

Hmmm...I'm wondering, for non-competition shooting, whether or not the match is a bit light? Perhaps for the leisure range shooter, if the service trigger is perhaps the better option?

What do you think?

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 7:12:42 PM EDT
Isn't the only difference in the springs you install with the trigger? And aren't both SR and MR springs shipped w/each trigger?
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 7:27:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:17:59 AM EDT
Just ordered one from ADCO a couple hours ago. And splurged for a Lyman digital trigger scale from Midway.

Can't wait now.......
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:07:20 AM EDT
I actually have a GA waiting for a build (barrel is taking a while). Haven't gotten to shoot it yet, but now I really want to throw it into one of my other guns just to shoot it.

-C4-
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 4:27:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 12:13:32 PM EDT by SWO_daddy]
Got mine today from Steve at ADCO. It was waiting for me in the mailbox.

I just got done installing it (not hard at all), and did some dry firing.

That is an awesome trigger!!!!!!! Whooo Hooooo!!!!!

Since my trigger scale has not come in yet, I didn't monkey with weight adjustments, just sear engagement as directed. So I am assuming that the first stage is around 4 lbs and the second at .5 to .75 lbs.

A dramatic improvement over a tuned RRA.

In the words of Ferris Buehler: "It is choice. If you have the cash, I highly recommend it".

ETA: range report due either tomorrow or Sunday.

ETA: Range report will have to wait at least another week. I am NOT going out in this rain/snow quagmire.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:05:22 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:17:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/3/2006 7:18:34 PM EDT by SWO_daddy]

Originally Posted By bigbore: Dont you love the installation kit too?


NO SHIT!!!!!!!

Y'all, Bill Geissele includes the following with his trigger to aid in installation:

(1) finely machined (looks centerless ground), extra long stainless steel alignment pin

(1) oversized hammer pin (in case you need it)

(1) 2 oz bottle of synthetic oil for pins and pin bores

(1) tiny vial of molybdenum disulfide grease for sear surface lubrication

(3) assorted hex wrenches for adjusting 2nd stage weight, overtravel, and sear engagement.

On top of that, the trigger and hammer are nicely oiled and wrapped in machinist's paper to make absolutely sure you will get them in pristine condition, like they just came off the mill.

That man's attention to detail and quality borders on the fanatical.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:34:01 PM EDT
Tallow Creek?

Bill
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:48:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Another-Bill:
Tallow Creek?

Bill


what?
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:50:17 PM EDT
I hate you people...



I was timid at an LMT 2 stage, but after seeing that video... I'm damn near sold on this one... that is just impressive...

so much for paying off the credit card
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 2:32:38 AM EDT
anybody know if they make one for Colt rifles with the oversized pin holes?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 3:59:11 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:03:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JE3146:
...but after seeing that video... I'm damn near sold on this one... that is just impressive...




I've watched the video a couple of times, but I still can't tell what it is about the firing that is clearly a result of the better trigger. Rate of fire?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 12:50:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 12:50:26 PM EDT by bigbore]
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:02:17 PM EDT
The thing that caught my eye, was the high ROF with no jerking the trigger around...

Take into consideration I've used nothing but a stock trigger, so my experiences with doing rapid fire sessions like that sway a tad more

Course I'm also new to that. Most of my rapid fire sessions have been directed towards pop cans in the dirt.

Trying though!
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:03:23 PM EDT
Thanks -- for the reply and the T&E. This trigger sounds so great that it's going to be hard for many to wait around until they become 'time proven'. Lots of hard use reported here sure helps.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:05:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Another-Bill:
Tallow Creek?

Bill



Yep!
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:05:51 PM EDT
Bigbore, for comparison.. do you happen to have a video of another trigger like the RRA 2 stage or the LMT 2 stage being "fired as fast as they can pull the trigger"?

After thinking about it, my comment on it being impressive was a bit ahead of itself as I have nothing to compare it to other than a stock trigger, and that's apples to oranges...
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 1:50:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 2:02:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigbore:

Originally Posted By JE3146:
Bigbore, for comparison.. do you happen to have a video of another trigger like the RRA 2 stage or the LMT 2 stage being "fired as fast as they can pull the trigger"?

After thinking about it, my comment on it being impressive was a bit ahead of itself as I have nothing to compare it to other than a stock trigger, and that's apples to oranges...



The only relevancy to “fast as you can pull the trigger” is the use/abuse and how it holds up. 1K rounds of pulling the trigger once every 60 seconds, doesn’t seem to say as much for the trigger. The Geissele does have an shorter reset, and over travel, but it would be next to impossible to compare how fast 2 people could pull 2 different triggers. I can get off 10 aimed shots with my SBR and the Geissele in 1.46 seconds. There are probably people who can do that with a 8lb stock trigger.



Basically it comes down to this.

I've only been into AR's and guns in general for about 2 years; multiple thousands of rounds through my rifles with stock triggers. Always told myself it wasn't worth investing in a nice trigger unless I could shoot decently with a stock one. Which I can shoot pretty decent to about 200 meters with a stock trigger, the limitation I've seen lately (with my shooting) is excessive jerking the trigger while doing doubles, and tripples.

What's your take on this? Worth upgrading to a lighter trigger or practice till I become better at it?

Also after seeing these vids and information threads, how could a person like myself who has no experience with a 2 stage trigger, understand the difference one makes without actually using it?

Basically trying to justify an expensive purchase with knowledge instead of first hand experience... Any help in this regard or is it impossible to understand without first using one? That is if I even go this route. Something tells me I should just suck it up and practice more.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 7:36:43 AM EDT
No piece of kit can overcome lack of training. If you want a top notch trigger, this is it. But trigger control is about your brain and body. Steve shoots a bone stock glock as well as a $3000 1911. That is what practice/training gets you.

damian@adcofirearms.com
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 10:23:01 AM EDT
Update:

Well, no range report this weekend due to extremely crappy weather.

I did get my trigger scale today (Lyman digital) and the trigger is perfect as it comes if the second stage engagement and weight setup instructions are followed. 3 lbs 15 oz on the first stage and 13 to 14 oz on the second.

Brilliant trigger
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 3:40:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigbore:

Originally Posted By Mthr1:
On the match trigger, the weight on the second stage is 4-14oz? On the service, it's 8oz-1.5LB?



Those are the adjustable ranges for the two triggers. Its not the weight that makes a trigger nice, its the sear engagement.

I have a match trigger in my AR10, that people think it feels like its set to 2 pounds max, when it a 3lb trigger. 2lb 1st stage, 1lb second.

In my carbine I have 4lb first stage, and 1lb second for a total of 5lbs.

The triggers are the same, but they only come with 1 set of springs. I think the extra spring sets are around $10



Got my trigger today. Everything posted above is TRUE! I was a died in the wool Jewell trigger fan for ages until one of mine went south in the middle of a match and my replacement parts didn't work so well. I got smarter and went up to KAC triggers for my more serious social rifle clones. The Geissele is everything that the KAC is, only not combat tested. I have a service model, and out of the box I got 4lb2oz first and a 14oz second stage. Only had to turn the overtravel 1/4 turn from the factory settings (after reading and following the directions, that's where it all ended up!). I will definately be getting another. I managed to get 300 rounds through mine already, and not one single hitch. I love it.

I'm given to understand that the springs are standard ones? Hmmmmmmm......just thinking out loud, anyone tried the JP or Yellow Tavern light weight trigger springs yet to see how things work out?

Also, anyone know about how much drag using a KNS trigger pin is going to add until the circlip breaks in?

Tom
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 3:51:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 4:46:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigbore:

The only relevancy to “fast as you can pull the trigger” is the use/abuse and how it holds up. 1K rounds of pulling the trigger once every 60 seconds, doesn’t seem to say as much for the trigger. The Geissele does have an shorter reset, and over travel, but it would be next to impossible to compare how fast 2 people could pull 2 different triggers. I can get off 10 aimed shots with my SBR and the Geissele in 1.46 seconds. There are probably people who can do that with a 8lb stock trigger.



Holy crap! I need to get to the range more often! Any books/videos/ that can help teach fast follow-up shots like that, or is this something you have to be taught by someone knowledgeable?
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 5:06:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/21/2006 5:08:49 PM EDT
I had the KNS pins installed for about 3 days. I think the pins that came with the trigger are smoother.

-C4-
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 6:04:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 6:04:30 PM EDT by Hokie]
tag, just got my Geissele trigger in, can't wait to try it. I too have a set of KNS pins, but I'm hesitant to use them if I don't 'have' to or if they're unwarranted.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 6:11:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 6:12:13 PM EDT by RustedAce]
As I stated in another trigger thread, I just used mine with a SIM kit, and shot over 3000rds with no problems. If it can work with those crappy things it can work with anything.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 6:42:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 7:17:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bigbore:

Originally Posted By Hokie:
tag, just got my Geissele trigger in, can't wait to try it. I too have a set of KNS pins, but I'm hesitant to use them if I don't 'have' to or if they're unwarranted.



Dont use KNS pins with the Geissele.



I'll take that advice,
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 4:03:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/6/2006 4:06:03 AM EDT by Hokie]
I held off on installing the trigger until I let some time pass. I find I mess stuff up and do things improperly if I head to the workshop immediately when I get home from work.

So....10 minutes later....

I installed the Geissele trigger per the instructions and those pins fit TIGHT....as they're supposed to. I had to tap them into my Stag lower but they did go in as the instructions said they would. You can tell by looking at the Geissele pins that the grooves will better hold the springs and walk outs won't be a problem. I found it easy by keeping the push pin (provided along with allen wrenches, lube, etc) in the lower as I tapped the new pins into place. So yeah - no need for KNS pins here, keep em in the drawer or sell em off - you don't need them with a Geissele.

All I can say is "wow." This trigger is a rugged sucker. I can see the inherent quality and the engineered advantages over virtually every other trigger I've seen over the years. I look forward to trying this out over the next couple weeks. Pulling the charging handle, you can feel the carrier knock the hammer down right away which is neat. Also, I notice when dry firing, the trigger mechanism itself is rock solid with no wobble or movement - very rigid. I'm also very impressed with the packaging and accessories that come with the trigger kit.

My testing inquiries aside from trigger function will encompass how the Geissele trigger performs with my MGI buffer in a mid length Recon barrel from Global Tactical. Figure I'll use some 62grain SS109 and see how that fares. I'll probably take along the standard buffer and my 9mm buffer for comparison purposes. We'll see!

Also worth noting....my once cherished RRA NM trigger now suddenly seems obsolete and the 1st stage of the RRA trigger went from "not bad" to "wtf!!!"...I now have enough time to pick my nose waiting for the 1st stage to end.

lol....great.....I've yet to try this trigger at the range but I have a sneaking suspicion I'll end up with another Geissele.....

Looks like it'll be worth two hundred and eighty three one-dollar bills!
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