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Posted: 1/28/2006 3:30:51 PM EDT
Hello. I'm pretty new to AR15s. But I'm going to buy one soon! But can't decide which one is good and which's not! I mean there is many brands out there! Really need some help!

I need a rifle that is robus, durable, relieble you know all that "standard" kind of stuff which everybody wants! I know it's difficult to say which one is THE BEST, but there must be ONE BEST! Money is not a factor here only EXTREMELY WELL BUILT TOP HIGH QUAITY is concerned! I prefer durability rather than something very complex of design for competition target use! I want something like GLOCK working under every imaginable conditions! And still it must be pretty to the eye, and have a fair tolerance, but if durability/reliability reduced due tight tolerance then durability/reliability is most importnant. Please anyone with great knowledge within this please help me with OBJECTIVITY in mind and please also tell which length is the most reliable!

Like I said, I'm new to this, maybe the request is TOTALY impossible then please show me the right way to enter this great AR15 thing!

How many rounds can the upper/lower receiver and barrel takes before out of service?

Thank you very much for the time you spend on this text!!

regards,
AjilicQ
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 3:34:45 PM EDT
Welcome to Arfcom, the best online resource pertaining to the Black Rifle.

The best way to learn is read, read, READ. Looking for experts? You found 'em. Now you just need to read, learn, and decide for yourself what will best suit your needs.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 3:40:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2006 3:41:30 PM EDT by James16688]
welcome Dude,

Read some threads before you post....your queston is sorta like, hey, what kind of car should I buy? What makes a "good" car?

Do some homework then post, and you'll get the most out of the site...
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 3:42:47 PM EDT
Your going to get too many answers on which ones the best. I suggest reading as well, and make up your mind for yourself. Won't hurt to go to a couple of gunstores and take a look at what they have and compare in person.

If price is not a factor, I suggest getting the real thing, and buy an M16.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 4:14:16 PM EDT
Hello. That was FAST replies! Man, 24/7!!
I live in Denmark, so my chance for going to a shop and see it for myself is not as available as in U.S. They don't carry AR15 they say TOO BRUTAL, but legale!

But what is "getting the real thing, and buy a M16"???? I mean a brand like Armalite, RRA, Sabre Defence, and Bushmaster aren't they the real thing also? Or did I misunderstood something very seriously, are they "wannabees" or what? And why particular a M16 the longest?? Why not a M4 model or mid-lenghts?
I have read, and read, and read for about 19hours, and that is ONLY TODAY! I really need something "served on the plate" informations. My eyes just can't take it anymore!
But thanks alot for the 24/7 fast input!!

Best regards,
AjilicQh.gifhy.gifh.gifhug.gif
Just a test!!
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 4:22:53 PM EDT
An AR15 is semi automatic where as a M16 is fully automatic.

My suggestion would be to find a decent mid length set up, and go take a shooting class if you have that option. If not, read as much as possible and practice, practice, practice. Also try to find someone close to your area that knows about AR15's and can teach you about the firearm properly.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 4:32:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2006 4:32:55 PM EDT by KorpiszZ389]
+1 on practice and a class.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 5:20:02 PM EDT
Aha! Full and Semi! So AR15 is each squeeze per shot.

Jeff from gunblast told me that there is no differences between a 20" and 16" except for the velocity!
Is this really true? There gotta be something more!

Ok guys, I have options between RRA, Bushmaster, Armalite, or Knight's Armament! With the demands on my first text in mind?!
Or build one from scratch?

Which options?

By the way did anyone know how many rounds a well built AR15 can take before out of service?

AjilicQ
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 5:25:02 PM EDT
Build one from scratch.
You will be able to use the very best components, have a rifle that meets your needs exactly, and you will gain a great working knowledge of your rifle, as you have assembled it yourself.

As far as your other question, your AR15 will take tens of thousands of rounds before you need to replace minor parts, and hundreds of thousands of rounds before you need to replace a barrel, and you may never fire enough rounds in your life to need replacement of the upper or lower receiver.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 5:28:39 PM EDT
If you've got the money, then a KAC rifle (KNIGHT's ARM.) will have a lot of options, and they are saught after.

And you can choose from a platform, for any type of shooting you'd like to perform.



An LMT MRP (Monolithic rail platform) with a few barrels could be another option. MRP's have quick change barrel setups so you can shoot a 16" one day(or minute), and go long range the next with a 24".

$$$$$$$$$ can buy happiness.
Link Posted: 1/28/2006 5:42:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
Hello. That was FAST replies! Man, 24/7!!
I live in Denmark, so my chance for going to a shop and see it for myself is not as available as in U.S. They don't carry AR15 they say TOO BRUTAL, but legale!

But what is "getting the real thing, and buy a M16"???? I mean a brand like Armalite, RRA, Sabre Defence, and Bushmaster aren't they the real thing also? Or did I misunderstood something very seriously, are they "wannabees" or what? And why particular a M16 the longest?? Why not a M4 model or mid-lenghts?
I have read, and read, and read for about 19hours, and that is ONLY TODAY! I really need something "served on the plate" informations. My eyes just can't take it anymore!
But thanks alot for the 24/7 fast input!!

Best regards,
AjilicQh.gifhy.gifh.gifhug.gif
Just a test!!



AjiilicQ: You could read here quite a while and get great answers to questions you probably haven't even thought of yet.... But what you're asking is still a little bit broad for this board. You might want to try reading a very good AR-15 site like:

http://groups.msn.com/TheMarylandAR15ShootersSite/_homepage.msnw?pgmarket=en-us

If you have specific questions about the info there, then you can ask here and be assured of many inormed responses.
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 9:12:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Build one from scratch.
You will be able to use the very best components, have a rifle that meets your needs exactly, and you will gain a great working knowledge of your rifle, as you have assembled it yourself.

As far as your other question, your AR15 will take tens of thousands of rounds before you need to replace minor parts, and hundreds of thousands of rounds before you need to replace a barrel, and you may never fire enough rounds in your life to need replacement of the upper or lower receiver.



For his first one, I'd recommend a factory and not a build...
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 9:23:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/29/2006 9:28:22 AM EDT by phillyd2]
Check out www.atlanticfirearms.com as a good place to buy if you lived in the States.

16" for a AR15 is about as perfect as you can get. If you want a longer barrel look at a .308 rifle like M14, HK 91, PTR 91, etc.

If $$ is really not a issue, this is what I have:

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/programming/expand.asp?Prodid=55

But since you live in Denmark I can be of any help as to what is avail, local laws, etc.

Good Luck and let us know what you finally did. Oh, don't forget tons of ammo and at least 100 mags

Link Posted: 1/29/2006 11:13:09 AM EDT
Thanks for all the replies.

I think I'm going to purchase one complete! Building one from scratch may not be a good idea since I'm a novice!

But anyways, I think the choice would be RRA for it's fit and finish, but then again how combat ready is it when dirty due to the tight tolerances?

2. Bushmaster seems to be a very great choice, but they didn't reply my question regarding "european customer" it's like they don't want to deal with me! Damn I hope not, I really start to like their rifles!

3. What about Knight's Armament? The top brands in this forum is RRA, Bush, Stag etc.. But what about KAC? How is their tolerances, and chrome lined barrel and do they use 4150 barrel steel? Howcome no people talk about them? Is it because it is too expensive but really great quality if you can affort it, or is
it just a bunch of crap nobody likes??

My final decision would be between the KAC, Bush, and RRA!
Second is: I can't decide what length!
1. 20" standard for reliable and smoother operations
2. Mid-length for a compromise between the 20" and 16"
3. 16"

What is the differences between an 16" and an 16"(18"??) Mid-length besides the gas-system placement, and longer handguard? I mean can I make a Mid-length to look exactly like a 16" non-mid-length(By the way. what do you call a 16" non-mid-length?? Just CARBINE??) I have been looking around a whole day try figuring out what the differences are between a mid-length and the rest!

Link Posted: 1/29/2006 11:17:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/29/2006 11:37:56 AM EDT by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
I live in Denmark

They don't carry AR15 they say TOO BRUTAL, but legale!




A functional AR-15 is not legal in Denmark.

Sorry.
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 11:19:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/29/2006 11:21:57 AM EDT by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
I think I'm going to purchase one complete!



Not going to happen.


Plus, you cannot import firearms (or even firearms parts) into Denmark without a government import license (given only to manufacturers)



ETA: But, if you join the army, they'll let you use one (with a VERY NICE Elcan optical sight on it), and you might even get a free trip to sunny Iraq.
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 11:23:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
Hello. I'm pretty new to AR15s. But I'm going to buy one soon! But can't decide which one is good and which's not! I mean there is many brands out there! Really need some help!

I need a rifle that is robus, durable, relieble you know all that "standard" kind of stuff which everybody wants! I know it's difficult to say which one is THE BEST, but there must be ONE BEST! Money is not a factor here only EXTREMELY WELL BUILT TOP HIGH QUAITY is concerned! I prefer durability rather than something very complex of design for competition target use! I want something like GLOCK working under every imaginable conditions! And still it must be pretty to the eye, and have a fair tolerance, but if durability/reliability reduced due tight tolerance then durability/reliability is most importnant. Please anyone with great knowledge within this please help me with OBJECTIVITY in mind and please also tell which length is the most reliable!

Like I said, I'm new to this, maybe the request is TOTALY impossible then please show me the right way to enter this great AR15 thing!

How many rounds can the upper/lower receiver and barrel takes before out of service?

Thank you very much for the time you spend on this text!!

regards,
AjilicQ




A Bushmaster would fit your criteria.
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 11:55:06 AM EDT
1) What are you going to use it for?

2) Who's funding the project?
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 12:40:27 PM EDT
A functional AR15 not legale in Denmark??

Maybe it's the english terms that confuses me. But try this site: www.ebh98.dk he sells a series of Armalite! If that thing is not a AR15 then I got confused!
Hey by the way DK-Prof, I think you are refering to the old laws, because they are actually discussing about the use of carbine size semi-automatic only for civilians
It is true that it is not legale yet. but going to happen very soon. Hope so!!

Going to use it for IPSC! But after 9/11 you never know when Iraq comes to Denmark! :)
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 1:24:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/29/2006 1:25:36 PM EDT by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
A functional AR15 not legale in Denmark??

Maybe it's the english terms that confuses me. But try this site: www.ebh98.dk he sells a series of Armalite! If that thing is not a AR15 then I got confused!
Hey by the way DK-Prof, I think you are refering to the old laws, because they are actually discussing about the use of carbine size semi-automatic only for civilians
It is true that it is not legale yet. but going to happen very soon. Hope so!!

Going to use it for IPSC! But after 9/11 you never know when Iraq comes to Denmark! :)



Can you provide a link to ANY official information that would indicate that any changes in Danish weapons law is being considered?

Because I have not heard of any such changes, and what you are describing would be SWEEPING and DRASTIC changes in gun laws. To my knowledge, NO PRIVATE CITIZEN in Denmark is currently allowed to own a semi-automatic rifle. Period. To even be allowed to own a bolt-action rifle, I believe you need to be an active member of a shooting club, or have a valid hunting license. Similarly, the ONLY way to be allowed to own a pistol is to be an active member of a shooting club, and you will lose your license if you stop being an active participant in sport shooting.

So your claim that it will soon be legal for private citizens to buy semi-automatic AR-15 carbines, in a country where it is extremely difficult to even own a .22 bolt action rifle, sound highly strange to me.

So I'd be very grateful if you could provide some evidence of these drastic changes in the law. I would imagine that the Danish news would be all over that (but I have heard nothing about it), and that there would be a very vigorous debate in parliament, with S and SF and others arguing violently against such changes to the law.


Perhaps there is a legal way for the shooting CLUB to own the rifles, and members of the club would then be allowed to borrow the rifles while on shooting club facilities to use in shooting competitions. Certainly that is the case with many shooting clubs in Denmark, where shooters do not actually own their own rifles. However, I have not heard of ANY shooting club in denmark that has semi-automatic rifles, even for members to borrow.

Can I ask you how old you are, and what club you are a member of??
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 1:28:10 PM EDT
welcome!
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 12:57:09 AM EDT
Yeah of course.
I member from KS Københavns Skytteforening. 23 yrs
I can't provide you any official info regarding the change of the law, but as soon as I get an AR15 I'll provide you a picture instead.
I spoke with the president of Armalite DK and it was him who told me that, so I believed in him because I had no reason to think he lied! But anyway, maybe you right, he also told me they are about to discussing that thing, it is not 100% yet!



Link Posted: 1/30/2006 2:10:37 AM EDT
Maybe its bastardized to fire single shot or a pump. Wouldn't that be legal?
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 2:59:30 AM EDT
Last thing you want to do is waste that extra money buy spending more than you should. Keep looking at prices on the EE. Plus just keep reading the boards. At least you came here first before going and buying one immediately.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 4:16:12 AM EDT
I like Bushmaster, but you can't go wrong RRA, or Armalite either.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 4:29:07 AM EDT
Bushmaster, RRA, or Colt if you want to spend a little more money.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 6:57:31 AM EDT
I think Bush or RRA would be a good choice.
But how come no one answer the question about the Knights Armament?
How good is it compared to RRA and Bush??

I read a article that Bush would be more combat reliable when dirty than RRA due to the little play between the upper and lower?? Is that true just a littel bit??

How much difference is there in power and precision between a Mid-length and Full size, and 24"??
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 7:20:26 AM EDT
KAC (Knights) is a very good rifle, but fairly expensive and hard to find.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 8:55:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
Yeah of course.
I member from KS Københavns Skytteforening. 23 yrs
I can't provide you any official info regarding the change of the law, but as soon as I get an AR15 I'll provide you a picture instead.
I spoke with the president of Armalite DK and it was him who told me that, so I believed in him because I had no reason to think he lied! But anyway, maybe you right, he also told me they are about to discussing that thing, it is not 100% yet!




There is an "Armalite DK" (i.e. a Danish branch of Armalite) - with a president in Denmark?? That sure seems odd for a company that is not allowed to sell their product in Denmark. Do they sell airsoft in Denmark? Maybe that's why they would have a branch there.

If the law would be changed, that would be fantastic (don't get me wrong - nobody would be happier than me) - I just have a very hard time believing it, since it would be such a drastic and complete change of danish firearms laws.


I've emailed an old army buddy of mine who is in PET - if there is a change in the gun laws coming, he will probably know about it.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 12:31:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2006 12:31:56 PM EDT by DK-Prof]
Thought I would reply one more time - just in case ANYONE cares.

I just heard back from my buddy, who is very familiar with gun laws in Denmark (since he is a shooter and hunter, in addition to his job). I wont explain his job, but AjilcQ should know what PET stands for.


His response was "he is insane"

He suggested that perhaps it is possible to convert an AR-15 to a single-shot, manually operated rifle - in which case it MIGHT be legal to buy, assuming all the permits and gun-club active membership and sportshooting requirements are met. He also said he was not aware of any changes to current gun laws being considered. In fact, he pointed out that weapons laws have recently been TIGHTENED in Denmark, and that now knives are also restricted and require "permits" - even for hunters. In addition, a valid hunting permit is required to even own shotgun ammunition now, and it will be illegal for people who own shotguns (which are considered "lightly" regulated in Denmark) to also own shot shells unless they have a valid hunting license. Given that kind of legislative environment, he cannot imagine that laws would suddenly be loosend to allow civilian ownership of semi-automatic rifles. Hell, even the lightly regulated shotguns in Denmark are only allowed TWO rounds, if they are magazine-fed. (and no semi-auto).

So, his professional judgemnt is that the belief that someone could buy a semi-auto AR-15 is completely crazy. I also spent some time reading the weapons laws, recent notes from parliament, as well as permit requirements (check out rigspolitiet's webpage) - and there is no indication that laws are undergoing any changes - and IF they are, it will likely be to tighten them.


Sorry to seem so negative. Like I said, I WOULD LOVE IT, if the laws were loosend in Denmark, and will apologize if I am wrong. But everything I can find suggests that it is completely impossible to get to own a functional semi-automatic, magazine-fed AR-15 in Denmark.


Link Posted: 1/30/2006 1:12:51 PM EDT
Well if you contacted your friend at PET then I believe it must be pretty reliable infomations!
But then it must be me misunderstanding the guy from Armalite. The funny thing is he also told me that ArmaLite does'nt sell to others outside US but Dnemark was an exception. I know german and belgium was banned from the Armalite but not denmark!(That's is what the guy told me!) And I'm 100% sure it isn't airsoft guns!
From your previous reply:
"He suggested that perhaps it is possible to convert an AR-15 to a single-shot, manually operated rifle"

What is a single shot exactly, and manually operated(Just in case if we misunderstood each other).
Single-shot=1 squeeze per shot, and then you have to MANUALLY manipulate with the lever to shoot again? If that is it, then I can assure you that the man I spoke with from Armalite told me he was selling ArmaLite with SEMI-AUTO, which is: 1 squeeze per shot, BUT don't have to MANUALLY manipulate with the lever to shoot again. So in short, Manually engage the lever ONCE and then are able to empty the mag with each squeeze afterwards to the last round has cleared!

Now, is that right? Or Am I in a TOTALY different world?!

But anyways, LIKE YOU, I would also be very very glad if the law is what I think it is, and not your PET fellow!he

Link Posted: 1/30/2006 8:37:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/30/2006 8:38:28 PM EDT by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By AjilicQ:
Ejer du en AR15? Måtte bare sige et eller andet på dansk!






Jeg ejer en hel masse AR15 geværer. Her er et billede af et par af dem:



Du må iøvrigt undskylde, hvis jeg virkede alt for negativ i mine tidligere posts, men det lyder bare så urealistiskt at våbenloven pludsligt ville blive så drastiskt ændret.

Det er da helt muligt at min ven ikke er klar over de seneste mulige udviklinger i Folketinget, så måske har du ret. Vi er begge helt enige om at det ville være enormt lækkert, hvis man kunne anskaffe sig semi-automatiske geværer some AR-15 i Danmark. Jeg har mange gamle venner fra Livgarden der straks ville melde sig ind i lokale skytteforeninger så de kunne købe et sådan gevær. Så jeg holder fingerne krysset for jer derhjemme!


Du må også undskylde mit skrækkelige skrevne dansk. Da jeg har boet i de Forenede Stater i de sidste femten år, så er det meget sjældent at jeg skriver noget på dansk.
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 9:20:49 PM EDT
Rifle = White Oak Armament service rifle

Carbine = Rock River Arms
Link Posted: 1/30/2006 9:37:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
I wont explain his job, but AjilcQ should know what PET stands for.




Politiets Efterretningstjeneste (PET) - Danish Police Intelligence Unit

The PET is primarily concerned with major criminal actions, such as terrorism, Organized Crime (e.g. the recent
Biker-War between Hells Angels and Banditos). PET answers to the ministry of justice and is concerned with internal security in Denmark. Main duties involves the prevention and countering of terrorism, espionage, extremism, organized crime and proliferation of WMD. It is a part of the state police and the staff consists of police officers and additional civil servants in the required specialist positions.


Found HERE

Cool shit!


Gene

Link Posted: 1/30/2006 10:38:09 PM EDT
Hej.

Det er sgu nogle fede AR15 du har! Din fremgangsmåde er helt i orden da det lyder meget utroligtharJeg er rimlig ny i det her AR15. Hvad er forskellen mellem en AR15 og M4? Jeg er mere kendt i Glocks.

PS: hvis du har spørgsmål i Glock bare fyr løs!

Translation in general: It was some cool Ar15 he got there! And the soldiers at Denmark would be glad if the laws changed! And that I'm new to AR15, so what is the different between an AR15 adn a M4. I got more knowledge about Glock, so just ask if you got some questions!

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