Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 1/4/2006 1:30:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 1:34:30 AM EDT by Bill2k]
well i picked up one of those fake cans at a gun show for 50 bucks..it threaded on to my m4gery and is solid metal..it is designed to look like the knights can. i picked it up because my m4gery is extremely light to me(coming from shooting m1as). i thought that it might add some weight to the barrel and steady my rifle a bit more... my groups with a 3x9x40 leo at 100 yrds went from about 2moa to 1 moa..i put up 3 different targets with all the same results off bipod..i know its a fake can but it helps my groups and to me looks great so its a keeper..just an idea for those who want a cheap trick to add some muzzle weight but arent concerned with quick draw mcgraw fast tactical shooting
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:40:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 1:42:07 AM EDT by AK_Mike]
It changes your barrel harmonics. Depending on your barrel it may become more accurate, less accurate, or stay the same. There is no guarantee that your accuracy will improve. If it is indeed solid metal then you may trim the length off a very little at a time until your accuracy peaks. You must stop as soon as you see the accuracy decrease as you have passed through the most accurate point. This will peak your accuracy for your barrel using ONE SPECIFIC LOAD. It may throw the accuracy off when using other loads.

This is the principal of the Browning/Winchester B.O.S.S. system. It allows one to move a weight near the muzzle to "tune" the rifle/barrel to a particular load. It will be different for different loads. The is the converse to working up loads that are accurate for your rifle/barrel - tuning the barrel rather than the load. With the B.O.S.S. system, the tuning is repeatable so you can move the weight to the set point determined for each load.

There are also barrel tensioning devices of at least one ("The Accurizer", "Counter Poise"? I can't recall) that does the same thing, tensions the barrel to adjust barrel harmonics. The trick is to get the bullet to leave the muzzle when the barrel vibration wave is at it's peak or dip consistantly.

For this reason your rifle may shoot better or worse when the bayonet is attached. For example most of my SKS's shoot better without the bayonet mounted.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:51:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 1:52:14 AM EDT by Bill2k]
well it is a bushmaster m4 profile barrel 16in freefloated the fake can adds 5 1/2in to length making it 21 1/2in barrel length...the ammo is adcom m855...isnt the m855 most effective out of the 20in barrel and maybe why it is more effective with fake can extension than with the 16in??.i am goin to try to use some wolf and olympic as well as federal..i will post results with differences in accuracy
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 2:07:58 AM EDT
So would this be akin to a "Running Boar" style of barrel?

Also, I don't believe this would make an effective 21.5" barrel (unless it is perfectly concentric
and threaded?)

Funny, no one's ever accused my M4 of being too light!
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 3:10:07 AM EDT
So you live in Cali, you have an "M4gery" and you stuck a 3x9 scope and a fake can on it.


Go figure
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 3:29:56 AM EDT
Fake can or not, we still do not serve fried chicken and watermelon in my mess hall on a daily basis.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 4:04:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bill2k:
well it is a bushmaster m4 profile barrel 16in freefloated the fake can adds 5 1/2in to length making it 21 1/2in barrel length...the ammo is adcom m855...isnt the m855 most effective out of the 20in barrel and maybe why it is more effective with fake can extension than with the 16in??.i am goin to try to use some wolf and olympic as well as federal..i will post results with differences in accuracy



No. All you did was add a weight onto the end. You will get an infintesimal free bore velocity boost, but doubtful it would be noticeable. It's not more "effective" with the fake can extension, it is more "accurate". It is more accurate because for the load you are shooting with the new harmonics of the barrel due to the weight on the end, the barrel is now more tuned for that load and you are achieving increased accuracy because of it. If you talk of effective, that is to say the round has more velocity and energy because the propellant has a longer time to burn and build pressure behind the bullet with a longer barrel. I doubt your fake can is rifled and contacts the bullet so gas is going to escape around the bullet and what doesn't a marginal boost in velocity which is the effect of freebore boost - the boost given by contained pressure with the absence of friction of the bullet by contact with a bore.

The same fake can on another barrel may or may not make it more accurate. Accuracy is not a function of length, a short barrel can be just as accurate as a long barrel, perhaps more because it is stiffer and whips less, but you will lose velocity thus range and alter your trajectory.

If you happen to get more accuracy out of the load you are using and others, you simply got lucky and the weight of the fake can extension is conducively accurate to the harmonics of your barrel.

Again, simply putting an extension onto your barrel does not guarantee increased accuracy, it could go either way or not at all. Unless the extension is a true extension of the barrel and the gasses are sealed behind the bullet, you aren't going to reap a whole lot more velocity/effectiveness, some but not alot.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 4:11:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By USNTopGun378:
Fake can or not, we still do not serve fried chicken and watermelon in my mess hall on a daily basis.




WTF
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 4:52:33 AM EDT
Bill2k. Please go to the range and shoot groups with a bunch of loads with out the can, put it back on, do it again. Send me the results or post them here. If you have the time of coures. Should help you understand your weapon better and frankly I'm plain curious. Would like to see to what extent adding X pounds to the bbl changed POI. Thanks bud.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 5:59:55 AM EDT
Users of real sound suppressors encounter this effect, there is almost always a shift in POI. With my M4-96 it's about 1.5MOA. It is not the same for everyone using the same can on the same length free floated barrel, nor is the direction it changes in.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 7:22:06 AM EDT
Sounds a bit like the "tuners" the guys in the rimfire world use in competition.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 7:35:12 AM EDT
Uhhhhhhhh......

What's a "Fake can?"

Link Posted: 1/4/2006 7:37:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By USNTopGun378:
Fake can or not, we still do not serve fried chicken and watermelon in my mess hall on a daily basis.




WTF hr


HARTMAN
What's your name, scumbag?

SNOWBALL
(shouting)
Sir, Private Brown, sir!

HARTMAN
Bullshit! From now on you're Private
Snowball! Do you like that name?


SNOWBALL
(shouting)
Sir, yes, sir!

HARTMAN

Well, there's one thing that you won't like,
Private Snowball! They don't serve fried
chicken and watermelon on a daily basis in
my mess hall!


SNOWBALL
Sir, yes, sir!
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 8:04:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AJ-IN-JAX:
Uhhhhhhhh......

What's a "Fake can?"

hr


It's a fake sound supressor, or silencer.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 8:06:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 8:08:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
So you live in Cali, you have an "M4gery" and you stuck a 3x9 scope, bipod and a fake can on it.


Go figure





Exactly.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 8:48:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Red_SC:

Originally Posted By AJ-IN-JAX:
Uhhhhhhhh......

What's a "Fake can?"

hr


It's a fake sound supressor, or silencer.



Thanks. That's what I thought, just wanted to be sure.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 8:56:57 AM EDT
Hey, don't knock the guy, I have one on my SPR and it hasn't caused me any problems.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 9:29:16 AM EDT
to each his own but I see no point in putting something on a firearm that serves no purpose but to look like you have something that serves a purpose. I could see putting one on a firearm you were going to hang on a wall as a display but I just don't see why someone would want to do it to a firearm that gets used.

it's gotta be kind of strange to shoot the thing with a supressor on it but it still has the regular report

As I said to each his own and do what ever floats your boat
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 9:39:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 9:39:56 AM EDT by redfisher]
someone mentioned the added weight is to thank for the accuracy improvement

makes sense given a lot of competition shooters actually add LOTS of weight to their AR15s

Front



and Rear 3 and 3/4 lbs!



caution: Comes with LEAD warnings!

Link Posted: 1/4/2006 10:49:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 10:54:32 AM EDT by Bill2k]

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
So you live in Cali, you have an "M4gery" and you stuck a 3x9 scope and a fake can on it.


Go figure




Originally Posted By Stickman:

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
So you live in Cali, you have an "M4gery" and you stuck a 3x9 scope, bipod and a fake can on it.


Go figure





Exactly.



gee man..sorry i live in california. i was just curious about something...didnt expect the snide remarks, people knock me for having a scope i actually use to hunt yotes with on the farm and so what if i stick something on the end of the barrel to help with my shots. does this mean i can make fun of people that spend thousands on armchair commando items that will never see any kind of action justifying the cost. it was just a cheap trick and random idea of mine. calling an m4gery might not be politically correct but who cares..its my rifle and couldnt be anymore pleased with it. everybody has their own taste and needs so dont be so quick to judge
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 10:58:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 10:59:57 AM EDT by bigbore]
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 11:05:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/4/2006 11:10:17 AM EDT by bigbore]
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 11:12:09 AM EDT


Originally Posted By Bill2k:
its my rifle and couldnt be anymore pleased with it.



Thats all that matters man, don't worry about what everyone else has to say about your gear

I got knocked a few times for having fake cans on some of my rifles but ya know what....Fuck'em. IT's your stuff, if they don't like it, tuff shit.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:02:49 PM EDT
Where did you pick that up? I wouldn't mind one.

Hardwarz
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:06:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By LArifleMAN:

Thats all that matters man, don't worry about what everyone else has to say about your gear

I got knocked a few times for having fake cans on some of my rifles but ya know what....Fuck'em. IT's your stuff, if they don't like it, tuff shit.



Damn it, your never going to be allowed in the tactical club with an attitude like that.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:19:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bill2k:
well it is a bushmaster m4 profile barrel 16in freefloated the fake can adds 5 1/2in to length making it 21 1/2in barrel length...the ammo is adcom m855...isnt the m855 most effective out of the 20in barrel and maybe why it is more effective with fake can extension than with the 16in??.i am goin to try to use some wolf and olympic as well as federal..i will post results with differences in accuracy

As another poster already pointed out, the fake can is not rifled. It's not part of the barrel.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 1:21:38 PM EDT
what kind of barell are you using? My groups with the adcom aren't much to brag about... A little bit worse than xm855pd actually...
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 6:26:37 PM EDT
Advantages to using a fake can besides changing the barrel harmonics which may or may not benefit accuracy with your particular barrel...

An incredibly minute amount of added freebore boost.

Extra weight to stabilize the barrel when shooting free hand as it makes it more resistant to "wobble" (or whatever you want to call it).

Extra heat capacity. The metal will absorb some of the heat transfered to it from the barrel allowing more shots before heat makes your barrel sag, however, the extra weight on the end may cancel that out.

Bad:

Looks cool until you are caught, then you are scummed out for being a poser. Makes for nice pictures though.

Makes your barrel more unwieldy - lengthens your barrel without adding velocity like the old Bushy 11.5" MG barrel with 5" flash suppressor, you still get only the velocity of an 11.5" barrel.

Makes your rifle heavier.


Granted, it's necessary if you want the look when you can't have the real thing for one reason or another. But they remind me of those fake cell phones. When caught your credibility takes a major hit, but if you are that kind of guy, that probably won't make much difference.
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 6:54:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
So you live in Cali, you have an "M4gery" and you stuck a 3x9 scope and a fake can on it.


Go figure



If you're such a bad ass why aren't you out killing terrorists with your bare teeth rather than terrorizing the naive here?

Do really still think it makes you look big by making someone else look small?

Top Top