Quoted: I've never used a rod guide on my ARs, just on my M1A. What kind are you guys using?

I use the JP ent. one because I like the o-ring.

JP rod on brownells

Cool, thanks. I just bought a guide, jags, and a chamber mop from Sinclair. Funny I had all this stuff for my M1A and FALs and used GI stuff for my ARs. The mop is kinda neat, it looks just like an AR chamber brush but it's cotton.

Thanks for the tips!

Quoted: I've never used a rod guide on my ARs, just on my M1A. What kind are you guys using?

Sinclair o-ring AR15 bore guide
Replaces your bolt carrier.

It blows me away how much controversy boils up every time someone asks a simple question about cleaning a rifle.  

My first reaction:  I'll never understand why so many guys ask how or when to clean a machine as if it fell from the sky.  If you buy a commercial AR, it comes with a manual that tells you how the maker of that firearm expects it to be cleaned a lubed.  WHY THE RELUCTANCE TO DO WHAT THE MAKER SUGGESTS? If you bought a used AR, or whatever else, the Army and Marine Corps manuals are available free on the web.  Why not check them out?

Secondly, I'm always dissappointed at how many guys get pissed off and hostile about this or that preference.  I mean, after all, don't we have enough real enemies out there that we don't need to bite each others' heads off if the guy next to you doesn't do exactly the same thing to clean his piece?  Save it for the anti-gunners, the invaders and the late-night intruders, right?  

Since buying my first AR15, I have cleaned all of them (I now own four) the same way: I do exactly what my USMC manual says to do and I do it every time I shoot.  I know I could skip a cleaning and the rifles would work fine but I'm not under fire when I get home from the range so why not take care of my weapons?

I wipe them down but I don't worry about every little scratch.  And I have not experienced one single malfunction of any kind whatsoever.  

It's just my personal choice but it seems to work.  

Good shooting.

Quoted: It blows me away how much controversy boils up every time someone asks a simple question about cleaning a rifle.   My first reaction:  I'll never understand why so many guys ask how or when to clean a machine as if it fell from the sky.  If you buy a commercial AR, it comes with a manual that tells you how the maker of that firearm expects it to be cleaned a lubed.  WHY THE RELUCTANCE TO DO WHAT THE MAKER SUGGESTS? If you bought a used AR, or whatever else, the Army and Marine Corps manuals are available free on the web.  Why not check them out? Secondly, I'm always dissappointed at how many guys get pissed off and hostile about this or that preference.  I mean, after all, don't we have enough real enemies out there that we don't need to bite each others' heads off if the guy next to you doesn't do exactly the same thing to clean his piece?  Save it for the anti-gunners, the invaders and the late-night intruders, right?   Since buying my first AR15, I have cleaned all of them (I now own four) the same way: I do exactly what my USMC manual says to do and I do it every time I shoot.  I know I could skip a cleaning and the rifles would work fine but I'm not under fire when I get home from the range so why not take care of my weapons? I wipe them down but I don't worry about every little scratch.  And I have not experienced one single malfunction of any kind whatsoever.   It's just my personal choice but it seems to work.   Good shooting.

 I agree, clean regularly.  But, sometimes I will shoot only 50-100 rounds an outing.  Should I really clean the barrel after that?  I might regardless because I feel compelled to, but is it overcleaning?

Quoted: You are less likely to shoot a weapon that you have spent hours cleaning.  Most of mine are 'dirty', so they are range ready.  I will wipe the bolt face, check the chamber and swab it if necessary, punch the bore wipe the bolt and receiver with a CLP covered cloth, and re-lube.  15 minutes or less, ready for zombie defense. A detail cleaning is good if a drill instructor is going to put a boot in your butt, but it really serves no purpose, other than glorifying your safe queen.

Thats about how I do it also. I clean it in 15-20 minuets.... And it's ready for the next time. I also use a Otis kit... I don't scrope carbon off the bolt. I solvent it and hit it with a stiff bristle nylon tooth brushs. ( The wifes tooth brush,not mine 0.... WARdAWG

Quoted: Quoted: I've never used a rod guide on my ARs, just on my M1A. What kind are you guys using? www.sinclairintl.com/images/gold/full/RGAR.jpg Sinclair o-ring AR15 bore guide Replaces your bolt carrier.

I like that - is that white polymer?
How come I never heard of Sinclair?  $18, wish I had known before I bought the JP.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I've never used a rod guide on my ARs, just on my M1A. What kind are you guys using? www.sinclairintl.com/images/gold/full/RGAR.jpg Sinclair o-ring AR15 bore guide Replaces your bolt carrier. I like that - is that white polymer? How come I never heard of Sinclair?  $18, wish I had known before I bought the JP.

Yep, white UHMW polyethylene.  Has a little o-ring at the front to keep the crap from leaking into the already clean chamber.

Sinclair caters only to competitive precision (HP and benchrest) riflemen.  That's probably why it's not well known in the "tactical" circles.

Their products are the shiznit, though.  You should order up a catalog and prepare to drool.  The reloading tools they carry are amazing.

Quoted:  I agree, clean regularly.  But, sometimes I will shoot only 50-100 rounds an outing.  Should I really clean the barrel after that?  I might regardless because I feel compelled to, but is it overcleaning?

If you have a chrome bore, it won't corrode if that's what you are asking. If you don't have a chrome lined bore, or a stainless barrel, you'll at least want to run some CLP soaked patched though the bore.
Any humidity, with powder residue in the barrel, and a moderately long storage period and a plain steel barrel is a recipe for corrosion.

IMO there is no such thing as "overcleaning". It's either clean, or it's not. Only you can make the determination of what "clean" really means.

Quoted: . I read about the reliability issues many AR15.COM members are having on these boards, and I have to conclude many issues are related to poor maintenance and operator error. I suppose we will just have to agree to disagree.

I'm not saying rifles are finicky from overcleaning.   I've ran enough clinics for new shooters to see that most of the finicky rifles are from 2 reasons - cheap, out of spec parts or improper cleaning and lubing.


I'm not arguing for a dirty rifle - clean is good - just not anal clean, not eat-off clean.    

Unless we have a cleaning party sometime and compare notes, we'll just not be talking the same language here.   I'm guessing our difference in "clean" isn't all that different, especially since we both have rifles that run and run without problems.

Quoted: Quoted: . I read about the reliability issues many AR15.COM members are having on these boards, and I have to conclude many issues are related to poor maintenance and operator error. I suppose we will just have to agree to disagree. I'm not saying rifles are finicky from overcleaning.   I've ran enough clinics for new shooters to see that most of the finicky rifles are from 2 reasons - cheap, out of spec parts or improper cleaning and lubing. I'm not arguing for a dirty rifle - clean is good - just not anal clean, not eat-off clean.     Unless we have a cleaning party sometime and compare notes, we'll just not be talking the same language here.   I'm guessing our difference in "clean" isn't all that different, especially since we both have rifles that run and run without problems.

Could be you are right.
I'll also admit that I'm very set in my ways.  

I read an interesting aside related to this from an ex-SAS operator; he was all about clean weapons, however he believed, and his unit commonly practiced, shooting a magazine through their weapon after cleaning it to make sure it worked after reassembly. Or maybe it was shooting a full mag through it before going on an op.

Quoted: I read an interesting aside related to this from an ex-SAS operator; he was all about clean weapons, however he believed, and his unit commonly practiced, shooting a magazine through their weapon after cleaning it to make sure it worked after reassembly. Or maybe it was shooting a full mag through it before going on an op.

Probably his version of a function check - or test fire, so to speak.

I just bought some Break Free CLP and sprayed it on my finish and internally, did good internally but not to impressed on its job on the finish, I sprayed it on and wiped it down real good, not to impressed with its finish work.

Quoted: I just bought some Break Free CLP and sprayed it on my finish and internally, did good internally but not to impressed on its job on the finish, I sprayed it on and wiped it down real good, not to impressed with its finish work.

One has to ask, what were you expecting?

To much I guess, it will do the job though

Well since we are on the cleaning subject here.
I do not agree with the carbon is self limiting idea that I have seen posted many times here on ARFCOM. I feel that if left unchecked a piece of carbon might get dislodged and cause a malfunction. But I also do not scrape the inside of the B/C with sharp metal objects either. I use empty 223 brass on the back of the bolt to scrape carbon off. Then use a nylon jag for a 9MM  with cotton patches until I was satisfied. I have always left some carbon buildup in the B/C.

Now to the mane point of this post.
I bought some Slip 2000 carbon cutter at the fun show last weekend. I went all out because the Rep was there and great deals were to be had. So I bought the entire kit.
The guy was proud of his product and it showed. He had a butt load of bore and chamber brushes also. All the brushes were at a great price a buck a piece so I bought plenty of chamber brushes.

Well now that I have used this stuff this is my opinion. The recommended dip time was 15Min. For my B/C in my carbine with 3k plus down the pipe it took a lot longer. But with submerging rinsing in hot water and wiping it out, it did come clean. About 7 sessions or a couple of hours I did not keep perfect time. I had no expectation that one session would do the job as stated. My B/C out of my 20incher was a different story. Fewer rounds shot through this rifle, somewhere between 300 to 500 rounds. One session and clean it came.

The first B/C group did fade a bit, But the product did warn against this. All and all I think this is good stuff. I feel if used regularly carbon will never be a problem to clean out. I like the way the parts feel when there done you can feel and see the cleanness. I went ahead and bought some of there CLP also. I soaked the B/C groups
In a tray of it overnight, though this was not my intention. I just ran out of time and had to leave them lay. After reinstallation and cycling the weapons they felt smother and quicker. But this could just be my imagination. I will follow up with a range report when I get the chance.

So far I will give Slip 2000 a 7 out of 10. For me that’s a good score.
The deductions were because of the real amount of time it took to get the first B/C clean
and the fading it produced. The score may change after I get the chance to go shooting again to see how they do..

Quoted: I feel that if left unchecked a piece of carbon might get dislodged and cause a malfunction..

I've seen ZERO evidence of this.    We aren't talking bit chunks - once you hit the limit, it would be mainly fine powder getting knocked off.

Like I said, I gave up scraping carbon thousands and thousands of rounds ago with ZERO problems.

Quoted: Quoted: I feel that if left unchecked a piece of carbon might get dislodged and cause a malfunction.. I've seen ZERO evidence of this.    We aren't talking bit chunks - once you hit the limit, it would be mainly fine powder getting knocked off. Like I said, I gave up scraping carbon thousands and thousands of rounds ago with ZERO problems.

What is all this scraping I hear about? I have never had to scrape carbon from my BCG. All my weapons stay well lubed while firing, and get completely cleaned after every session whether it was 10 rounds or 1000. I soak BCG in appropriate solution for at least 1 hour, or until all the powder residue comes out with q-tips and rags, no scraping needed.

I think the reason you guys are having to scrape carbon buildup out is because you are not cleaning completely after every session and/or not lubing enough. That makes me cringe, but if scraping is what you prefer to do, well, to each his own.

It is much easier to clean a weapon that was clean and lubed before you fouled it again.



ETA I have used slip 2000. You have to let it soak much longer than what they state, and make sure to lube extremely well after you rinse because it will strip ALL lubricant off the BCG. I dunk it in a pound  cake pan of 5w30 after rinsing the slip 2000 off(or similar carbon cutters), then let it sit in the oil while I work on the upper, then clean the powder residue off (never have to scrape after it has soaked long enough). Final lubricant is always a healthy dose of CLP. All q-tips come back white from every nook before she gets lubed the final time. I only shoot about every 60 days, so cleaning well is no big deal. If I had a job where I shot daily, like Combat_Diver, obviously this would not be feasible.

_DR
I do clean my weapons after each outing to the range.  I have never scraped out the carbon from the inside of the BC. Though I have used a 223 round to get the carbon off the back of the bolt because it just made the job faster and simpler. I have never used a carbon cutter before until now. I did have a fair amount of buildup on the inside of the carrier that I was never able to get out until now. I have used many things to accomplish this task from carburetor and brake cleaners to gun scrubber. I thought I was doing a good job and was not.  

Fight4yourrights
Yes, it is most unlikely that a large enough piece of carbon would break off and cause a problem. It is more likely as you stated that it would break up into fine powder. But this would be abrasive in my mind and cause unnecessary wear and tear IMO.  I am not overly anal about the weapons cleanliness being I did not go to great lengths of time and tools to remove carbon build up. However I have to say I did not like the stuff building up in my weapons. So when I came upon the Slip 2000 booth at the gun show I thought I would give it a try.    

I lucked out!  My new girlfriend went to West Point and can break down an AR faster than most guys.  She cleaned both RRA's last time we came back from the range.  Howsweet is that?

What would probably be the best product to use on the finish of my bushmaster, the Break Free CLP or Rem oil?

Hylton, CLP by a mile.


_DR, you let your whole BCG soak in oil after cleaning? I thought you were supposed to not get any kind of lube in the firing pin channel.

Quoted: Hylton, CLP by a mile. _DR, you let your whole BCG soak in oil after cleaning? I thought you were supposed to not get any kind of lube in the firing pin channel.

No, soaking in the oil is to prevent to powder residue from hardening before cleaning, and soften it up after the carbon cutter bath removes the outer layers of then encrusted residue, BEFORE cleaning the entire disassembled BCG. It gets the clp and detail q-tip. patch and brush cleaning, then then a light coat of CLP, and done. The oil soaking is in prep for cleaning, but is not a final step.

FYI, the brass marks on the deflector come off with CLP, some time soaking, and a rag.  

Some guys prefer to leave them on for character.

This was touched on earlier, but not really explained.  Enjoy the new rifle.  Part of the fun is developing your own personal cleaning regimen

ETA- _DR, how long does it take you to clean an AR?  I'll bet about as long as it takes me to do a crappier job

Quoted: FYI, the brass marks on the deflector come off with CLP, some time soaking, and a rag.   Some guys prefer to leave them on for character. This was touched on earlier, but not really explained.  Enjoy the new rifle.  Part of the fun is developing your own personal cleaning regimen ETA- _DR, how long does it take you to clean an AR?  I'll bet about as long as it takes me to do a crappier job

A thorough cleaning job before putting it away, about 2 hours. (not including pre-soak time)
A quick clean for functionality only, about 20 miutes.