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Posted: 12/21/2004 4:53:36 PM EDT
[#1]
I understand if you like it, fine. But why have the weight of the Garand without the punch of the Garand? I mean 5.56mm ball has it's benefits, but 30-06 military ball it is not. When Eugene Stoner came up with the super-high tech (for it's time) AR15 one of it's biggest features was it's light weight. If you are going to use an 8.5 Lb weapon why not just get an M1A or an AR10? |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 6:58:18 PM EDT
[#2]
Because the extra weight helps me keep the rifle on target at extreme ranges. A 7, 8, or 9 at 600 yards is not as good as a 10 or an X. I would not mind a few more pounds to steady it even more. I shoot .30 cals too, but less often due to the extra expense. This is a case of having rifles at both extremes and loving shooting them all. A shooter like Zac Smith probably does not need the extra weight, but then he could probably outshoot us all even if he was using just a Daisy BB gun. |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:02:49 PM EDT
[#3]
I see your point. My DCM Armalite was a heavy S.O.B., but it was a tack driver. I sure would hate to go to war with it though.
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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:08:25 PM EDT
[#4]
in LE6920 terms, means 1 of 300 and an extra $1000
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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:12:55 PM EDT
[#5]
Aww, what'd that poor machine gun ever do to you? 
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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:19:04 PM EDT
[#6]
prolly broke his back.
the M240B(G) is much better IMHO |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 7:19:48 PM EDT
[#7]
+1 |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 8:57:57 PM EDT
[#8]
Bushie 16" M4 profile is 8 OZs less than thier 16" Hbar.
I don't like getting involved in flame wars, but if that is a big deal... you need 24 Hour Fitness!  BTW: I like all ARs and I like all profiles, and honestly Hbar, M4, A1 whatever...I want them all! ETA: Seriously, most of us are not going into combat anytime soon, so I think there needs to be less critism on barrel profile, because for most of us (I know not all of us) it wont matter. YMMV |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 9:13:45 PM EDT
[#9]
All that extra weight when taking your gun from the safe to car, to the stall at a range is sooo tiring with an 8.5lbs rifle you know. pansy asses  You wonder how those old timers with garands functioned. Unless someone is literally posting from Iraq they need to pull the tampon out and stop whining. Get a treadmill. I walk around for hours with my bushy hbar when varminting and it really isnt a big deal |
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Posted: 12/21/2004 9:24:16 PM EDT
[#10]
There's got to be at least some, minimal, even negligable difference that would make the HBAR better for sustained semi-auto fire than not having and HBAR. Understanding that they hold up better during full auto fire, means that they would hold up better under less than full-auto fire too, right? It's like having a motorcycle grade helmet for riding a bicycle. You don't really need that much protection, but it's more protective nonetheless. The heaviness should also have some benefit in countering the effects of recoil too, right? I don't know... just hypothesizing here.
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Posted: 12/21/2004 9:35:29 PM EDT
[#11]
I like the heavier barrel for shooting prairie dogs. I go through a lot of ammo
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Posted: 12/22/2004 6:25:19 AM EDT
[#12]
Someone correct me if I'm wrong (like that won't happen) but one of the northeastern states considered an AR with a "govt contour" barrel an "assault weapon", but with an HBAR it was a "target rifle" and therefore "sporting".
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Posted: 12/22/2004 10:24:11 AM EDT
[#13]
That is correct - but it's not a 'northeastern state' - the state is south of the Mason-Dixon line and was a slave state prior to the Civil War. Maryland. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 10:28:06 AM EDT
[#14]
WOW! That has to be the most absolute stupidest categorization I've seen yet. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 10:37:16 AM EDT
[#15]
Trying not to get into the arguement over accuracy, barrell longevity, or the like...
i just want to say if you think the extra weight of a HBAR makes that big of a difference, especially since we are not in combat, your a damn sissy And to compare a HBar to a RICER,????...i dont think of my heavy barrell as a expression for my AR.. to RICE up an AR would be to have those blue/pink colored handguards, new grips, etc. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 10:48:28 AM EDT
[#16]
I was going to have my 14.5" HBAR 1/9 Bushy turned down, but it is so accurate (sub MOA) that I decided to leave it alone. According to the Bushmaster website, it is a whole 0.5lb heavier than the military M4 barrel; I think I can stand it.
Perhaps if you have a HBAR that shows outstanding accuracy, leave it alone or maybe flute it, if it's only MOA or worse, turn it down? |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 11:04:42 AM EDT
[#17]
If you buy an HBAR with an ordinary bore and chamber because you think the external profile will make it really accurate, then you're as clueless as somebody who puts a big fin on their car without doing anything to the engine. Accuracy in a barrel starts with the quality of the bore and chamber and without quality on the inside it really doesn't matter what's on the outside. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 11:21:57 AM EDT
[#18]
My ar has a heavyier profile than I would have preferred, but then again I only paid $575 for it brand new. If its a bit heavier, oh well, I got it cheaper. Now later on I'll probably due a pencil barrel rig to keep it lightweight, maybe even put it on a carbon fiber lower, but until then my "HMG" profile barrel (thats what oly is calling it) will have to do.
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Posted: 12/22/2004 11:55:28 AM EDT
[#19]
Yep but I take advantage of it all I can. Cash-NICs-Carry an HBAR, then spend the $$ to reprofile it. I'll have it back BEFORE the MD State Police have 'Not Disapproved' the 'Controlled Weapon' paperwork I'd need to do if I purchased a lighter weight profile. Oh and here is the kicker. As long as I keep the barrel an A2 or M4 profile it still says HBAR on it (the stamping is not removed) so I could re-sell it as an HBAR legally - even though it is now a 'govt' profile. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 1:45:40 PM EDT
[#20]
Hoplophile, you have a valid point, HOWEVER lets clarify this a bit. True chamber and bore quality is where its at, however lets compare apples to apples. Take two factory barrels, one light weight profile and one Hbar, accuracy advantage goes to the Hbar hands down, harmonics,barrel whip,stiffness, and recoil are all better with the Hbar. The HBAR is the shit for accuracy, however one should get a GOOD match grade Hbar such as Krieger, Obermeyer etc.
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Posted: 12/22/2004 3:35:00 PM EDT
[#21]
Hoplophile,
if you think the HBAR is that much heavier, then you ARE a sissy, it is still light weight and to compare the heavy barrell to a wing on a Ricer, no...thats apples and oranges..they do not relate. Putting some 5ft wing on a turd box import that cant go fast anyawy, and choosing a heavy profile barrell over the lighter profile ....no correlation what so ever... make a good comparison if your goin to argue that a heavy barrell has NO advantages over a light barell |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 3:42:02 PM EDT
[#22]
Wasn't the original acronym Heavy Barreled Automatic Rifle?
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Posted: 12/22/2004 4:12:33 PM EDT
[#23]
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Posted: 12/22/2004 4:19:56 PM EDT
[#24]
No |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 4:20:06 PM EDT
[#25]
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Posted: 12/22/2004 5:29:44 PM EDT
[#26]
He loves his Heavy Barrel too
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Posted: 12/22/2004 7:04:18 PM EDT
[#27]
WTF is that! Oompa Loompa with a keg?
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Posted: 12/22/2004 7:10:26 PM EDT
[#28]
HBAR argument aside, that is a funny pic.
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Posted: 12/22/2004 7:23:40 PM EDT
[#29]
i'm glad there are so many of you who like hbars.
it will mine that much easier to sell when my new m4 upper arrives. |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 7:25:47 PM EDT
[#30]
I used to be a HBAR fan. I have a 20" HBAR on a 12 pound rifle. I have a 12 pound AR
I hate the damn thing, i never shoot it. Some hbar-lover out there, make me an offer... please. Have a good one. Stainless |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 9:43:17 PM EDT
[#31]
hvy bbl.
or a pain in the A** |
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Posted: 12/22/2004 9:56:47 PM EDT
[#32]
HBAR = 12.0 ounces more than the NON-HBAR rifles. Yeah, it's almost a pound... big freaking deal. I've gained 15 pounds in the last several months and I'm faster than ever (that's because I quit smoking) Most users will not be lugging it around through the deserts in Afghanistan and Iraq, or through the jungles of Vietnam, and rather taking it to the range or some other non-life-determining situations. Get real. The difference in weight is highly negligable. In reality, you want an HBAR if you can afford it.
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Posted: 12/23/2004 4:26:05 AM EDT
[#33]
My experience is, there IS a difference in accuracy. Both my LW and my HBAR 16in Colts shoot easily inside an inch and a half-- unless I run a mag or two through. Then the LW opens up ALOT more. Anyone else notice that?
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Posted: 12/23/2004 9:40:09 AM EDT
[#34]
Yes, I do.
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Posted: 12/23/2004 11:22:02 AM EDT
[#35]
Does anyone have a picture of a Remington 700 that is full auto? Afterall, they make Rem700s with HBars, but
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Posted: 12/23/2004 12:07:07 PM EDT
[#36]
...but that is irrelevant, since we're talking about mag-fed semi-autos, not bolt guns, which have VERY different usages, and therefore different configuration requirements. -Troy |
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Posted: 12/23/2004 12:38:50 PM EDT
[#37]
Not quite. I just assembled a second A2 using a Colt 1/7 Govt. profile barrel. My older rifle is an IDENTICAL A2 using a Bushmaster 1/9 HBAR weighs 17 ounces more than the Govt. profile assembly on a digital kitchen scale. Both uppers have the standard FSB, A2 handguards, etc. The point some of you continue to miss it that above a certain weight, shooting a 5.56 platform becomes "inelegant", ineffecient, and LESS EFFECTIVE than something in 7.62 NATO. I'll agree that on an A2 with no "bling" hung on it, an HBAR holds and handles nicely, even offhand standing. But once another pound or two or three of optics, bipod, arms rings, etc. is added, the extra pound of useless barrel "fat" is unwelcome IMO. Paladin |
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Posted: 12/23/2004 12:45:13 PM EDT
[#38]
Full auto Rem 700VS HBAR w/ 20 inch barrel. Once your poodle shooter outweighs her, you need Jenny Craig in your life... Paladin 
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Posted: 12/23/2004 1:59:11 PM EDT
[#39]
My Remington 700 IS mag fed, and as for bolt vs. semi auto, that puts them both into your catagory of Not Full Auto, which means for the purpose of this comparison, there is no difference. As for difference uses, they may have different uses to YOU, but I try to get as much accuracy as possible out of anything I shoot. And if an HBAR provides more accuracy for a .223 bolt gun, why wouldn't it do the same for a .223 AR gun? |
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