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Posted: 9/14/2003 3:37:17 AM EDT
I just read something in another thread that says SBRs dont fall under the AW ban, but this is opposite of what I heard before.

Where is the truth?
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 3:53:10 AM EDT
The AWB applies. The only way around it is a registered MG, at which point it is no longer a semi-automatic assault rifle and therefore no longer subject to the AWB. The ATF/NFA will be kind enough to remind you of this when you register an SBR...they stamp it on the paperwork.
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 3:54:21 AM EDT
It falls under the AWB if the SBR is semi-auto and accepts a detachable magazine.
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 3:59:40 AM EDT
Yes, SBR's fall under the AWB. If you build with a pre ban reciever then you may use pre ban features. If you build with a post ban reciever then you must comply with post ban restrictions. NFA status does not negate the AWB. That being said, If you use a pre ban reciever for your build and you decide to remove your rifle from SBR status in the future, then it becomes a post ban reciever because at that point, you are building a NEW rifle and it can not have pre ban features.
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 6:51:27 AM EDT
Originally Posted By white32golf: If you use a pre ban reciever for your build and you decide to remove your rifle from SBR status in the future, then it becomes a post ban reciever because at that point, you are building a NEW rifle and it can not have pre ban features.
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Could you show some evidence of this?I've never heard that before and I'm a little concerned because I plan on SBRing my preban.
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 8:56:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2003 8:57:17 AM EDT by DOA]
That is incorrect. If you have a pre-ban gun, SBR it, then decide to change the upper to full length, then it is still pre-ban. Not post-ban. They all follow the AWB unless it is considered a MG, then the AWB does not apply.
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 9:32:17 AM EDT
DOA, I believe white32golf was refering to taking your rifle off the NFA books through the ATF process, not by simply putting a 16+ barrel on it. Tex78
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 9:45:23 AM EDT
Correct Tex78, I was refering to the removal from the registery, not a temporary switch. Removal from the resistery involves the "manufacture" of a new firearm, one that must comply with the AWB. Redbone- Looking for that information, I've got it here somewhere.....
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 10:16:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2003 10:52:08 AM EDT by SBR7_11]
You are not manufacturing. The registered part is just changing status, Title-2 to Title-1. The firearm (serial #) has existed since day 1 when by made and registered by Bushmaster, Oly, whoever the name is on the lower.
Originally Posted By white32golf: Redbone- Looking for that information, I've got it here somewhere.....
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Subguns.com NFA Firearms Discussion Board [url]http://subguns.biggerhammer.net/mgmsg.cgi?read=308525[/url]
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 10:20:41 AM EDT
Well there is no reason to ever remove it from the registery since if it becomes an SBR you can use any length upper on said lower reciever. If this is law it is a silly technicalilty. I am not so sure this applies to AR's
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 5:24:31 PM EDT
As I said in the first place, if you have a SBR from a pre-ban gun, removing it from the registry, it would still be pre-ban. There is a letter out there stating exactly what I said, and a thread on NFA board on subguns with a guy who has the ATF letter. http://subguns.biggerhammer.net/mgmsg.cgi?read=308525
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 6:19:07 PM EDT
Well I'd a thought so!
Link Posted: 9/14/2003 8:52:17 PM EDT
I think it was a comment I made in another thread that raised this question. I actually, in the thread about suppressors said the AWB does apply to SBRs, because...by definition they are admitting themselves to be a rifle. There are other NFA classifications that do supercede or disqualify the weapon from the AWB. Machine gun (autosear) as previously mentioned and AOW are two I can think of off the top of my head. The thread was asking if it is legal to put a sound suppressor on a post ban AR...and how could it be if you cant have a threaded barrel. Just another minor conundrum of the ATF.
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 5:27:00 AM EDT
The threaded barrel is a seperate issue from a silencer... a silencer is a VERY EFFICIENT flash supressor SO any silencer on a Post-Ban as affected by the crime bill is a problem.... As for a Pre-Ban maintaining it's pre-ban status when SBR-ed, here is a link with letters from the ATF complements of Bishop from this forum... [url]http://www.quarterbore.com/ar15m16/micro-car.htm[/url]
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 6:00:42 AM EDT
Well whats an AOW. I have wanted a rifle with a suppressor for a long time... but cant afford a preban right now so I want to register a lower as something or another to save for later on in life. =) I cant justify spending $1300 on a preban right now. Maybe next year, but im going to assume the worst yet still fight the good fight. Can an SBR legally accept a 20 inch barrel as well as say an 14.5 inch? If you register an SBR can you go back and forth between barrel lengths? What happens if you combine the AOW and the SBR? (Keep in mind I dont know what an AOW is, so please explain the technicalities and or excuse my ignorance) Thanks!
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 9:57:42 AM EDT
AOW= Any other weapon.... No stock, ever, has to be a new recv that has never been a rifle, 5 dollar transfer fee, Im not sure if it has to have a fwd grip or not, but thats it.
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 10:13:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Knife_Sniper: I just read something in another thread that says SBRs dont fall under the AW ban, but this is opposite of what I heard before. Where is the truth?
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I don't know what you want so I'll pose some questions... -Are they banned until 2004? No. you can make one now, then, and after those bastards ban AWs for good (eventually). - So my built in 2000 receiver on my AR SBR project can have all the evil features? No. Post ban receiver = post ban config. Preban = preban config.
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 11:43:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/15/2003 12:04:48 PM EDT by thebloke]
When the AWB goes away will there be such thing as a post and pre ban? Will high cap magazines be produced again for sale? Can i still own the parts now that would be a pre ban configuration, threaded barrel, flash hider ect,so I have them when the ban goes away?
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 2:44:21 PM EDT
Can I still own the parts now that would be a pre ban configuration, threaded barrel, flash hider ect, so I have them when the ban goes away?
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The BATF may view this as "constructive intent" and bust you for it...
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 3:56:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Knife_Sniper: Well whats an AOW.
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Did you see this link... [url]http://www.quarterbore.com/nfa/sbr-aow-pistol.html[/url]?
I have wanted a rifle with a suppressor for a long time... but cant afford a preban right now so I want to register a lower as something or another to save for later on in life. =)
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You have two options... buy a pre-ban or go the AOW route. As mentioned, SBRing a POST-BAN will not allow using a supressor. To build an AOW, you will need to start with a stripped lower OR at least one that has NEVER had a stock mounted to it.
Can an SBR legally accept a 20 inch barrel as well as say an 14.5 inch? If you register an SBR can you go back and forth between barrel lengths?
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Yes, just because a SBR has a longer barrel doesn't mean it is no longer a SBR nor does it mean that you can't swap back and fourth. Also note that I feel a SBR doesn't need to have a stock (AKA Pistol style) as an AR-15 with a pistol buffer and short upper would still be illegal as it would be a SBR... So, if you register it as a SBR, using it as a pistol should be legal!
What happens if you combine the AOW and the SBR? (Keep in mind I dont know what an AOW is, so please explain the technicalities and or excuse my ignorance)
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If you SBR, then you can configure your SBR as an AOW BUT an AOW fits a specific requirement of not being a rifle, pistol, shotgun or other type of weapon... So, if you start with a rifle (has a stock) it can never be an AOW as it is a rifle BUT you can register it as a SBR and add a forward grip and pistol buffer as such a configuration would be a SBR! Have I confused you yet?
Link Posted: 9/15/2003 3:59:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M4Madness:
Can I still own the parts now that would be a pre ban configuration, threaded barrel, flash hider ect, so I have them when the ban goes away?
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The BATF may view this as "constructive intent" and bust you for it...
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I don't think so... There are plenty of ways that such parts could be assembled in a way that would result in a legal weapon. All a person would need to do is assemble without a gas tube, as one example, and you can build a M4 Carbine with CAR stock, bayo-lug, silencer, threaded barrel, etc... What this would be is a BOLT-ACTION carbine.... look like the real deal... and it would be 100% legal!
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