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Posted: 9/11/2003 5:03:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2003 11:47:53 AM EDT by Blastech]
Hello everyone. Let me say first that this forum rocks! I have found my new home at last. Im a LEO in up-state NY. Up until about 4 months ago all I did was shoot, eat and talk AK's .... And then I made the plunge and bought a Bushmaster AR from a buddy (pre-ban of course)

I will get the digital camera out tonight and post a pic of my M4gery. It has the Aimpoint, SIR etc. on it and it is NOWHERE NEAR being done.

One question on the gas tube and the barrel length. I have seen adgustable gas tubes on the net and also the "pigtail" systems that are available to help cure the "short barrel blues" that M4's and CARs have with the 16 inch barrels(i.e. the abuse the gas system, bolt, extraction probs. etc. take because the "power curve" is way off due to the extra length of the barrel past the gas block)

Armalite makes a mid-length upper that seems to cure some of these problems better for the shooter. I need to know if either the Pigtail or the adgustable gas tube will also address these problems.

Again... Its nice to be here!

Tim
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 5:40:17 AM EDT
Blastech, Let me first say, welcome aboard. I have learned a lot from these people on this board. Everyone, as you either know or will find out, is really nice and helpful. Secondly, I have no idea. I'm not that familiar with that but I can assure you that someone will have the answer. Troy has given me a lot of good advice. That is not slighting the others by no means, but he about always replied to my posts. Everyone has different opinions on issues too, keep that in mind. Someone will answer your question soon. See ya around. [beer]
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 5:52:20 AM EDT
Not needed on a 14.5 to 16" gun. 11/12" barrels, maybe, but not a 14.5 or 16" I've ran probably 14k rounds through my 16" bushy with very, very, very few hiccups (mostly mag related)
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 6:09:54 AM EDT
Standard gas tube would do the job. I have 16", M4 (14.5") and 11.5" uppers and I use standard gas tube. I did install heavy duty extractor spring (a buck or two) and O-ring (20 cents) to ensure and prolonged extracting function.
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 7:26:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2003 7:34:28 AM EDT by Blastech]
Read octobers issue of Soldier of Fortune... New Armalite mid-length barrel (made to rectify the problem that I am talking about) mated to a mid-length new S.I.R system... According to the article, it states that this configuration was made for rectifying the short-falls of the carbine length gas system mated to the 16" barrel length... It states that it causes exessive bolt wear, gas system wear and throat errosion... As far as the 16" barrel is concerned, it states that the additional length of the barrel in front of the gas block (compared to the standard issue length) and the distance from the gas hole to the chamber (again, compared to the original specs of the standard issue length barrel) is the culprit in the pre-mature wearing of the bolt, gas tube and throat erosion.... Hi operating temps/pressures. The gas "curve" is thrown off of equation. Read the issue and tell me what you think.. The weapon that is used as a example is awesome! Armalite rifle, SIR mid-length rail config., EOTech site, Surefire light forend and a pic of it firing with the new USMC issue suppressor... Nice pics of brass flying through the air...They say you can stand next to it and not have to wear ear protection at all. TimH.
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 1:52:36 PM EDT
Soldier of Fortune?? How about Seller of Bullshit? You came to the board with a question. You came to the right place. There's more AR knowledge on this board than the pen pushers at SOF will ever have. Don't know who wrote that BS in the magazine, but if it happened to be Peter Kokalis, you should know that he takes payoffs from manufacturers and importers. Probably wasn't him tho. I think even SOF got tired of his taking bucks, booze and favors for good writeups, and fired hima a few years back. You got the right word on CARs from the guys who posted ahead of me, and as a 25+ year owner of a CAR, that still has the original gas tube on it, I fully endorse what they've written. The ONLY prolem I've ever had on my piece was failures to eject after some 4000 rounds; solved with a Wolff heavy duty extractor spring.[:D]
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 2:36:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2003 2:39:29 PM EDT by Blastech]
... I didnt want to start anything here. I was just wondering about the topic in whole. I just happened to see the article in SOF and thought it was worth looking into. Im not going to comment about SOF's integrity or about Pete Kokalas. ... Would it hurt to add the pigtail or adjustable gas system? Just curious...Yup, I also understand the weak ejector issue. Sounds like your weapon is running like a champ. Thanks for the info. TimH.
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 6:45:07 PM EDT
There are two viable options. Get the Fat Boy gas tube from PRI or get the LMT enhanced bolt and carrier. My solution was to do neither till I actually HAVE A PROBLEM. I suggest you take this path as the carbine "problem" in my view does not exist. Thousands of M4s are working over seas with no issues. If your bolt breaks at the cam then get the new LMT bolt group in a few thousand rounds when that happens. Then we will be able to see how it performs over time and make an educated decision. The pigtail has had many horror stories and you will screw up your rifles function if you start tinkering with a 100% functional rifle.
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 8:11:46 PM EDT
Unless I overlooked it, he did not actually say that he was having any problems (other than being concerned). So, maybe the correct advice is "don't fix what isn't broken." But, I would recommend to install a Defender-type rubber, or a Wolff extra power spring. Other than that, don't worry and enjoy your AR. By the way - WELCOME ABOARD !!!!!
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 5:58:37 AM EDT
Welcome aboard! I am a state LE firearms instructor from Oklahoma. The members of this forum are great guys and more than willing to help you with your questions. Have a great time spending all of your money on AR stuff!
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 3:13:31 PM EDT
Glad to hear that its a non-issue as far as the above mentioned stuff. I will shoot with that baby and worry about that crap later.. Thanks everyone... TimH.
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 3:23:20 PM EDT
Welcome to the board. [wave] MM419
Link Posted: 9/12/2003 5:29:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Blastech: ... I didnt want to start anything here. I was just wondering about the topic in whole. I just happened to see the article in SOF and thought it was worth looking into. Im not going to comment about SOF's integrity or about Pete Kokalas. ... Would it hurt to add the pigtail or adjustable gas system? Just curious...Yup, I also understand the weak ejector issue. Sounds like your weapon is running like a champ. Thanks for the info. TimH.
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Sorry; probably got carried away in my first post. People quoting SOF often does that to me. Won't bother to go into details, but that rag pisses me off something fierce[;D] That being said, let me also welcome you to the board. Whatever you want to know about the AR15 platform, you can find it here; from folks who have no interest other than to help out[:D]
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