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Posted: 9/2/2003 10:51:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2003 10:51:59 PM EDT by texasblueline]
Ok, I'm slowly building up my Bushmaster (A2 fixed handle) as money permits for use as my patrol rifle at work. I'm to the point where I'm about to purchase an EOTech and will soon thereafter purchase an M3 light as well. To save money I was thinking a handguard set with the integrated rails would work well to handle the M3 and to mount the EOTech on top, as well as give me the ability to add other extras in the future if needed.

My question, though, is are the handguards with the integrated rails acceptable for mounting the EOTech? Will they have any problems shifting or moving and therefore causing the EOTech to have to be re-zeroed? Do they position the EOTech high enough to use correctly or would I have to look into those risers? Lastly, if they're okay to use with the EOTech what brand would you suggest? I saw a First Samco brand on the Bushmaster sight that looked decent but I don't really know what else is out there and what's good.

I'm looking forward to hearing your expert opinions since I'm fairly new at all this. Thanks, and try to go easy on me if I'm way off-base with my ideas.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 3:15:19 AM EDT
Are you talking carbine(16 inch barrel)or rifle length A2? If it is a carbine length, check out the ARMS #39A2 Bi-level rail. The EOtech should be able to be mounted forward of the carry handle on this rail system. The EOtech would then be set up to co-witness with your iron sights. This way, you can keep your existing handgaurds and keep your investment to a minimum. Check out sableco.net Here is the link http://www.sableco.net/id9.htm copy and paste in your browser window.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 3:50:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By HighStrung1: Are you talking carbine(16 inch barrel)or rifle length A2?
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Sorry, it's the Patrolman's carbine (16" barrel).
If it is a carbine length, check out the ARMS #39A2 Bi-level rail. The EOtech should be able to be mounted forward of the carry handle on this rail system. The EOtech would then be set up to co-witness with your iron sights. This way, you can keep your existing handgaurds and keep your investment to a minimum. Check out sableco.net Here is the link http://www.sableco.net/id9.htm copy and paste in your browser window.
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Yeah, I've seen that one advertised alongside the EOTech, but if I got it I'd still need to purchase some type of mount for the M3 and any future accessories, which would most likely end up being a handguard with integrated rails anyways. Since the ARMS Bi-Level Rail is $125 and the handguards with integrated rails that I saw were in that same price range I was hoping that a handguard system would be able to accomodate the EOTech. That way I could just buy the handguards for $125-150 and have all my mounts taken care of; EOTech, M3, and any future possibilities (vertical foregrip, etc).
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 4:44:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/3/2003 5:00:36 AM EDT by C4iGrant]
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 8:28:39 AM EDT
KAC and DD FFRAS are both good choices, albeit expensive. I prefer the SIR based systems on flattops, but... This is a A2 based system, and the DD FFRAS wins out here. If you want to keep your gun lightweight, this is the way to go, as it only weighs an ounce or two more than the parts it replaces. -Cap'n
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 9:04:48 AM EDT
Ditto what C4iGrant says. Also, don't mount optics to a plastic railed type handgaurd. They're really only good for lights, vertical grips, and maybe bipods.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 9:20:30 AM EDT
For instead snap on handguards with rail that could possibility handle a Optic, your only choices are KAC RAS, SIR #51 which is free float and clamps to your handle or the new but soon to arrive GG&G FF handguards. the GG&G handguards will require you to remove the delta ring which can be accomplish by slicing it in quarter with a dremel. the handguard clamps to your barrel nut with a top and bottom piece, it is fasten by allenscrews. the rail are multi-position adjustable. I don't know the performance of the handguard because I am still waiting for one to do a test but from what I see so far, it is very promising. the top rail is in the same plain with the flat top rail so if you decided to mount an EOTech, it will co-witness perfectly with your A2 carrying handle upper. The SIR #51 is a great piece, but the height of the ARMS rail forward of the handguard is the same as the ARMS #39, which is too high for co-witness with EOTech. the KAC RAS is not a free float piece and you might experience some POI shift if the handguard become loose, but probably anything torso size within 200 yard are fair game using the EOTech/KAC RAS combo. I think the GG&G is the cheapest with KAC RAS to follow and the SIR being the most expensive and most technology driven. Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 2:28:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Capn_Crunch: KAC and DD FFRAS are both good choices, albeit expensive. I prefer the SIR based systems on flattops, but... This is a A2 based system, and the DD FFRAS wins out here. If you want to keep your gun lightweight, this is the way to go, as it only weighs an ounce or two more than the parts it replaces. -Cap'n
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"DD" ??????? elaborate the acronym. Oh yeah, your damn cereal cuts up the roof of my mouth. GG
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 3:47:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 5:23:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy: KAC = Knights Armament Corp DD = Daniel Defense FF = Free-Floating RAS = Rail Adapter System -Troy
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Thanks, I was going to have to ask too.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 5:41:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SMGLee: For instead snap on handguards with rail that could possibility handle a Optic, your only choices are . . . the new but soon to arrive GG&G FF handguards.
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Is this ([url]http://www.gggaz.com/products/tmfff.php[/url]) the GG&G one you're speaking of? So, I'm gathering from the responses that a free floating handguard system that attaches solidly to the barrel nut or upper is what's needed in order for the EOTech to work correctly if mounted on it? Thanks again.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 5:46:31 PM EDT
Tex- EO-Tech sells it own mount that attaches to the carry handle and will co-witness. Very similar concept to the Arms #39. BTW- Insight is coming out with a much tougher version of the M3. IMHO, you may be better off mounting a Surefire 6P type on a mount. It will be a slight bit more expensive but it will have a longer service life than the current M3.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 9:37:57 PM EDT
Tex that is the exact handguard I am talking about. Free float will help in accuracy and the GG&G handguard seem to mount pretty solid. I should be getting one soon to do some testing with it. the free folat handguard is fasten to the barrel nut and it is solid with not change in rail position. this inturn makes repeated accuracy possible. like I said, I am not sure how will the GG&G will stay on the barrel nuit until I have a chance to play with it. EOTech don't make any forward rail, but do endorse two forward rail by two seperate company. Precision Reflex forward will only work with CAR or standard ahndguards and BC Cam will work with either.
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 10:00:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Mike_T: BTW- Insight is coming out with a much tougher version of the M3. IMHO, you may be better off mounting a Surefire 6P type on a mount. It will be a slight bit more expensive but it will have a longer service life than the current M3.
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Any idea when the tougher version of the M3 is due out? The reason I'm planning on getting the M3 is so I can carry it in a pouch on my duty belt and use it on both my Glock and my AR. Down the line I'd like to get a tougher and brighter light (such as a Surefire) exclusively for the AR, but as of right now finances are my main deciding factor, and since the M3 is affordable, compact, and can be switched from my belt to my Glock to my AR with ease it'll probably be the one I go with for a while.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 4:36:25 AM EDT
Why does all the cool stuff have to be so expensive! [;D] That is a great looking system, I like the off set rail in the front. Hey TexaxBlueline, can't you write all of this off at the end of the year since it is for work? If so, lucky bastage! [;)]
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 5:05:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By JRussell: Hey TexaxBlueline, can't you write all of this off at the end of the year since it is for work? If so, lucky bastage! [;)]
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I've never written stuff off that I've bought for work just to avoid any potential problems with the IRS for accidentally writing stuff off that isn't allowed or not doing it correctly, but with how much all these accessories are costing for my AR I may have to think about it this year.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 5:15:38 AM EDT
Hey Texasblueline, and any others interested. I was talking with a Sure Fire rep., at a shoot a couple of weeks ago, and told him that I'd like to replace my M3 on my Glock with a Sure Fire, but theirs you have to use the rail that bolts on. The rep told me to wait until the end of the year, and hinted that Sure Fire is coming out with a new line of handgun lights. I sure hope so, cause my Sure Fire's are much better lights that my M3.
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