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Posted: 7/17/2003 4:41:11 PM EDT
I'm sure this question gets asked every so often but I'll throw it out there anyway. I picked up an Olympic 20in, A2, FS, bayonet lug, 98% today for $550.00 good deal right? Better because I called Olimpic and they verified production date of Feb. 1994. Well I asked how it left the factory to make sure it was a complete rifle. I was told all records where destroyed in fire and they couldn't tell me, as I'm sure is old news to most here. I've search my memory and can't remember but doesn't the burden of proof lie with the owner to prove it was a rifle when it left the factory if "evil" stuff is to be added? The Olympic rep. told me it was a "gray" area. So heres my question: What do I do if I have to prove it was a complete rifle? Thanks

Glockdog

Airborne!!
Link Posted: 7/17/2003 5:04:07 PM EDT
Receipts for parts such as pistol grip, collapsable stock, barrel, etc. would help. I had an old 1982 Oly receiver I built into a CAR, had no receipts, threw them out long ago before any whiff of the AWB. But somewhere I have pics.. In any case, I sold it so it is not an issue anymore. In about 1 year it will not be an issue for any receiver, anyway. Stay out of trouble so no accusation can be made, you should be alright.
Link Posted: 7/17/2003 7:48:06 PM EDT
Last time I checked, you are innocent until proven guilty in the US. You can prove the lower was made before the ban. They can't prove it wasn't a complete rifle.
Link Posted: 7/17/2003 9:23:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/17/2003 9:27:23 PM EDT by A_Free_Man]
It would be unreasonable to expect for you to have to keep receipts from a time that it was not necessary. You just bought the rifle, you have no way of obtaining nearly 10 year old receipts for parts. Besides, parts receipts would not exist if it left the factory as a complete rifle.
Link Posted: 7/17/2003 10:53:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Vinnie: Last time I checked, you are innocent until proven guilty in the US. You can prove the lower was made before the ban. They can't prove it wasn't a complete rifle.
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You guys really need to read the law & Legal section a little more often.. All the have to prove is that its configured as an assualt weapon. You cant deny that. Then there is an exemption is that it was pre sept 94...That you have to prove... ALL 'Assault Weapons' are banned, there are expemtions.
Link Posted: 7/18/2003 12:14:29 AM EDT
You are fine.
Link Posted: 7/18/2003 5:51:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/18/2003 5:52:16 AM EDT by neilfj]
Originally Posted By CavVet: You guys really need to read the law & Legal section a little more often..
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Then how are we going to be able to make stuff up as we go? [:)]
Link Posted: 7/20/2003 9:41:56 PM EDT
you did excellent on the price.....that's a lot less then post ban go for. as for the verification it being a pre-ban, your fine. records where destroyed as to how it came from the factory, so how is anyone going to prove it was a receiver, or a complete rifle?
Link Posted: 7/20/2003 11:21:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/20/2003 11:22:03 PM EDT by Boom_Stick]
Originally Posted By CavVet: All the have to prove is that its configured as an assualt weapon. You cant deny that. Then there is an exemption is that it was pre sept 94...That you have to prove...
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My Oly lower was made between Jan and May of 1994. I was extremely ticked off to find that I couldent get positive proof that my rifle was officially put togather as a kit or rifle, but I know it was. Who'd let a lower sit around unmade as that ban went into effect! Besides, the ban WILL...let me repeat that, WILL SUNSET! That means that ALL "assault" rifles will no longer be in any catagory of PRE or POST ban because there will be no more AWB. That is unless bush extends it. Still, we only have 421 days, so buy a few lowers and dont worry about your rifle. I dont. The only way you'll be questioned is if you commit a crime or defend yourself with it, so keep a post ban around for self defense.
Link Posted: 7/21/2003 2:20:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/21/2003 2:23:04 PM EDT by 1ar4me]
be very careful of the preban police. they are everywhere. hundreds.....thousands of preban police walk the gun shows by day and at night looking for the scurge of the earth who have preban items on a post ban weapon. They are armed with assault rifles and loaded with armour peircing bullets. Ready to drop that 1 innocent civilian that has pre banned his post ban weapon......Trust no one. The pre/post ban police are paying informers every day to snitch on other comrades that have slipped in to that criminal element of post ban modification! I have seen it time and time again a secret society that lives in the tunnels and sewers. All of them huddle with there post ban weapons in Pre ban confugurations. They get no sleep they have no jobs because they are constantly on the run from the pre ban post ban police.... it is against the law Much like sodomy was in Texas but you never saw anybody inforcing those hideous laws. Are you really worried about it? I'd be more worried about contacting my local fed politician to make sure this ban goes away once and for all. See you in the sewers! for the next post ban preban meeting
Link Posted: 7/21/2003 3:58:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 1ar4me: be very careful of the preban police. they are everywhere. hundreds.....thousands of preban police walk the gun shows by day and at night looking for the scurge of the earth who have preban items on a post ban weapon. They are armed with assault rifles and loaded with armour peircing bullets. Ready to drop that 1 innocent civilian that has pre banned his post ban weapon......Trust no one. The pre/post ban police are paying informers every day to snitch on other comrades that have slipped in to that criminal element of post ban modification! I have seen it time and time again a secret society that lives in the tunnels and sewers. All of them huddle with there post ban weapons in Pre ban confugurations. They get no sleep they have no jobs because they are constantly on the run from the pre ban post ban police.... it is against the law Much like sodomy was in Texas but you never saw anybody inforcing those hideous laws. Are you really worried about it? I'd be more worried about contacting my local fed politician to make sure this ban goes away once and for all. See you in the sewers! for the next post ban preban meeting
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Am I really worried about it? Ya, I've got my tin foil headgear, windows blacked out, put everything in my Moms' name, and always make sure my pillow case isn't inside out. As far as the Secret Police go I've heard about them but I've never met one, have you? I'm glad I got a reply that makes some sense these other guys where talking about those laws and stuff and I don't care about that crap. I don't know where this sodomy thing came from but uhhhhh... it's cool I mean Texas might just be the next big Liberal hotspot right on! Don't waste bandwidth being a dick, dick. If you think it's OK to turn a Post-ban into a Pre-ban config then do it fine no problem but don't try to make everyone else feel all warm and fuzy about them doing it. I don't like the law, I fight it but I don't break it. I have nothing to gain from doing so. Now why don't you stop being an ass and take one of your illegal guns and stop all these damn Mexicans from crossing YOUR border. Glockdog Airborne!! See you in the sewers! for the next post ban preban Texas sodomy meeting, he he
Link Posted: 7/21/2003 5:57:38 PM EDT
Being an LEO for over 20 years, I am going to say we don't have any pre-ban Police at the gun shows. Last Friday, I worked with ATF Agents on recovering a stolen Colt ar-15 carbine and some other guns. We recovered some of the guns before the victim reported the break in. You know we have so many criminals that need our "attention", and deserve our special "love", that we could care less on proving post or preban. You don't know how much satisfaction I get from recovering someones property after they have been violated! The guy that did the burglary was 4X convicted felon and had been out of the pen less than a year. He was trying to sell the guns for crack. The Colt had an A2 flash hider, and a telescopic stock. Not once did anyone mentioned to check the rifle for being correct for the date of manufacture. I remember several years back at a Gun Show at the local Shriner Hall, some LEOS from another county, saw some guys selling potatoe launchers at a table outside the hall. The young LEOs were telling the guys at the table that were breaking the law. The LEOs made a big mistake by calling one of our uniformed officers out to the table. Basicly the uniformed officer told them that in our county, the DA had ruled the launcher to be OK, and they need to go back to there county if they want to do law enforcement. Before I was a Police Officer, I loved to go target shooting and rat hunting at one of our local dumps. I had never went to a real firing range until I was hired as a Policeman. All these LEOs who think regular citizens should not have guns, will also be regular citizens when they retire. I welcome all the help I can get from these regulars citizens I can get! Take away the guns from the citizens, and you will have more victims. There is always the unknown X factor when a burglar breaks into an occupied dwelling. In our good ole boy area, there is a good chance he will meet up with the homeowner with a firearm. We are seeing more and more home envasions and car jackings. Thanks to CCW permits, we have seen some of these "victims" come out on top by shooting suspect. Then the media always talks about the poor old suspect who is now pushing up daisys and how the victim should have tried something less than leathal force. Of course we just say "the supsect was tried in a higher court." The next time a thuglidite thinks about carjacking or home envasion, he has to think about the X factor whether or not his next "victim" is going to smoke him in his tracks. Amos
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