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Posted: 5/29/2003 6:27:57 PM EDT
Take 6000 men and divide them in half. 3000 will carry AR-15's, and 3000 will carry AK-47's. All rifles are semi's. No smart bombs, missiles, etc. Just rifles and grenades. Now, place these 6000 men in a Jungle environment and see who comes out the winner in a war. Next, the same platform only in a desert. Finally, same platform in an urban setting. My vote goes for the fighters carrying AK-47's.
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 6:42:13 PM EDT
what are you trying to start here again? geez...not even worth to comment [pissed]
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 6:49:28 PM EDT
You're still here? [>:/]
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:04:25 AM EDT
Not sure why I'm replying, but the scenario you project doesn't test the superiority of one weapon over another, it tests tactics and soldiering ability. You could take 1000 men with good training and conditioning and give them Lee-Enfield bolt actions and put them against your 3000 with AKs or ARs and they will kick their butts. During the retreat from Russia, German forces considered it an even match if they were only outnumbered by 7 or 8 to one. More than that and they were in trouble. Less than and you could count on the German forces to win. In the tremendous majority of cases, it is the man behind the weapon that is the deciding factor, not what he is carrying. The quality and features of the weapon, or the lack thereof, merely enhance or detract from his potential, they don't swing it one way or the other. Rob Leatham with a bone stock, iron sighted 1911 will still kick butt over probably anyone we know personally, know matter how good they are on our local range with their $3000 red-dotted, compensated racegun. Why? Because of superior skills.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:09:28 AM EDT
Actually the dividing them in half part would kill most right from the start.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:12:41 AM EDT
It isn't the tool, it's the knowledge, skill, and training of the man using it. As my grandmother told me "It's not what you have between your hands. It's what you have between your ears." She was a damn good shot, too, and packed a .45 for guard duty at a naval installation during WWII.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:27:19 AM EDT
Tactics not tools. Either you are looking for trouble with your post, or you are very lacking in your basics.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:31:47 AM EDT
Trouble IBTL
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:34:02 AM EDT
Its the magician not the wand. IMHO if i had to have a semi-auto only rifle it would be an AR-15 or a M14. AKs are only good for spray and pray, they pattern not group. BTW stop trolling.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:35:42 AM EDT
I thought for sure that Kevin locked your account last night. Damn, guess I was wrong. IBTL
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 10:11:14 AM EDT
Easy answer: Assume all 6000 men are equally well trained, motivated, and skilled (or fairly close to that). Also, assume other than weapons/ammo they will be clothed & equiped identically. If they are all untrained peasants then the AK wielding troops are more likely to come out on top. Since untrained troops are not likely to keep the weapon clean and the AR has a special procedure to clear a stuck case the peasants aren't likely to know about. If they are moderately to highly trained then the guys with the AR are more likely to win; as they will know how to keep their rifles running and could take advantage of its superiority in range & accuracy. They also have another advantage (see below) Its interesting thing to note that given equivalent weight to carry the guys with the ARs get 50% more cartridges than the guys with the AKs (even more if you consider the AK & magazines are heavier). Allowing for more suppressive fire. However, if you keep the round count the same, the guys with the AR have another advantage - they will be carring less weight (about 4 lbs if you are only carring 210 rounds). Less weight is less fatigue and the ability to move faster. As the others have stated ultimately is the skill & training of the soldiers that is the most important. I don't think you'll find 6000 equally trained soldiers to conduct your experiment.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 10:41:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 10:42:05 AM EDT by Cutter75]
Originally Posted By Forest: I don't think you'll find 6000 equally trained soldiers to conduct your experiment.
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OK, so let's get 6000 Democrats(starting with the ones in Washington)... let them have their choice of weapon - AR or AK... And pit them against 100 of us(team members)... That's 60 rounds each (2 mags)... Who'd win??? Battle would be over in less than 2 minutes... Why, you ask??? Don't think a Democrat(especially politicians) know the difference between a safety and a trigger... [snipper2]
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:13:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 11:14:08 AM EDT by Ridge]
Is this just a sneaky way to start another. [size=5]AR vs AK thread [/size=5] [nono] [beathorse]
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:17:52 AM EDT
ibtl
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:25:22 AM EDT
Your three thousand guys with AK's against Mike Ditka with an AR. Ditka.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:37:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Halfcocked: Actually the dividing them in half part would kill most right from the start.
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The only post worth reading in tHIS WHOLE STUPID THREAD!!
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 12:40:01 PM EDT
are we talking about a team of ditkas, or just one. just one..... ok, ditka, 276-3....
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:50:11 PM EDT
And then the side with AR15 had the Playboy Bunny chopper pull in after dark. Boy were those men re-invigorated to fight, or what. The AK47 bunch was whooped, BUTT good......
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 2:00:34 PM EDT
OK, Ditka's only a foot tall...and his AR is GI Joe size. Ditka
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 7:48:00 PM EDT
Frankie is either a 12 yr old kid or a fag. Or both.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 8:06:54 PM EDT
Captainpooby- I think Chris Farley said it best.DITKA NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.Frankie I rarely post replies to such topics as this,but you sir are a TOOL.Why waste your time on this board??Try to do something positive with your time,Its never to late.Jm03
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 8:28:04 PM EDT
My Uncle BS once said something about sittitng a bunch of monkeys down, behind so many typewriters(?),for so many years.... Through the alcohol induced fog, I seem to lack the whole quote.... I think the gist of the quote was that the typewriter(?) would actually make the "monkey" that had it stuffed up his ass be the recipient of instant enlightenment... Or some Spearshakin' shit like that... I think I'll have another drink. I suggest you do the same.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 8:31:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Terrato: You're still here? [>:/]
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Sorry i ran out of ammo.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 9:09:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Cutter75: OK, so let's get 6000 Democrats(starting with the ones in Washington)...
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Hey, not all Dems are anti-gun. Let's start with 1 million Moms . . .
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 9:21:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Halfcocked: Actually the dividing them in half part would kill most right from the start.
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HA! That was good. First laugh I've had on this forum all night.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 10:11:41 PM EDT
Originally Posted By threefiftynone: My Uncle BS once said something about sittitng a bunch of monkeys down, behind so many typewriters(?),for so many years.... Through the alcohol induced fog, I seem to lack the whole quote.... I think the gist of the quote was that the typewriter(?) would actually make the "monkey" that had it stuffed up his ass be the recipient of instant enlightenment... Or some Spearshakin' shit like that... I think I'll have another drink. I suggest you do the same.
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it goes something like "give 100 monkies typerwriters and they will eventually produce the entire works of Shakespeare if given infinate amount of time."
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 10:17:34 PM EDT
I WILL! [devil]
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 10:21:18 PM EDT
Frankie, I thought you were leaving?
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 10:30:17 PM EDT
This is a pretty pointless topic.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 10:58:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 20iner:
Originally Posted By threefiftynone: My Uncle BS once said something about sittitng a bunch of monkeys down, behind so many typewriters(?),for so many years.... Through the alcohol induced fog, I seem to lack the whole quote.... I think the gist of the quote was that the typewriter(?) would actually make the "monkey" that had it stuffed up his ass be the recipient of instant enlightenment... Or some Spearshakin' shit like that... I think I'll have another drink. I suggest you do the same.
View Quote
it goes something like "give 100 monkies typerwriters and they will eventually produce the entire works of Shakespeare if given infinate amount of time."
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You, Sir, are a genius. Thanks for the clarifiacation. Now, if you will, please excuse me while I go downstairs to get a shot of Makers Mark. Will someone please IM me to remind me not to drink and post, and please include the "Spearshakin'" reference.....[?]
Link Posted: 6/1/2003 2:37:02 AM EDT
HAHA! Ditka... [LOL] IBTL +1
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