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Posted: 12/18/2002 9:38:47 AM EDT
Can someone give me the history of why the CAR stock was created? It doesn't quite add up to me. Assuming the stock is in the extended position when using, what is the advantage of the telescoping stock and when is it used in the closed position. Sure, I like them too, just confused on military purpose.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 9:57:44 AM EDT
1) Paratroopers need a weapon to be as small and light a package as possible, so it doesn't hang up in all their equipment, or weigh them down too much. 2) Armored vehicle crews need a weapon that that's small enough to be able to bring with them outside the vehicle in a hurry (it's a real bitch trying to get out of a tank in a hurry ANYWAY, much less having to do it with a full-length M16).
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:28:29 AM EDT
Sure, those 2 examples make sense. But what doesn't make sense is that ALL the marines/soldiers are using them, not just paratroopers and tank crews. There must be another reason?
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:52:54 AM EDT
Special Forces are using the M4 with the telestocks and every soldier wants to be like the SF guys. And I think there's a desire to have everybody using the same thing for simplicity and cost-cutting. But they're finding out that a carbine really isn't the best weapon for most soldiers.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:55:21 AM EDT
they also works better for smaller indigenous peoples and to make up for the thickness of all the crap you have slung on your back.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:56:35 AM EDT
They are nice if you have to wear tactical armor. I have a 6 position and I am glad I have it on gun calls. It also makes the gun more compact to fit in gun racks in vehicles. PAT
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:56:36 AM EDT
I don't know if this was part of the original military consideration or not, but another handy aspect is setting the length to go with your attire. Put on t-shirt, BDU's, then any combination of the following: Kevlar, load bearing vest, any system with suspenders, a backpack, a parka, or any other gear that will add more matierial between your shoulder and the butt of the gun. Now shoulder an A2 quickly without snagging or feeling like your rifle is four feet in front of you. Much easier to do with a colapsible dropped down a few notches.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 2:52:19 PM EDT
I don't have it in print, but I remember reading that the very earliest CAR's were actually for Air Force flight crews, as a survival rifle. It was made to be as compact as possible for storage on the plane.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 5:52:18 PM EDT
Compact, lightweight, adaptable, the origional XM177's were a simple tool. I fit in a cockpit and was light enough for the snake eaters to add a few more rounds or a claymore to their packs.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 7:46:44 PM EDT
When the military first decided to go w/ a carbine version of the M16, they (in usual military fashion) performed a number of scientific studies and tests. In the end, they determined that a collapsible buttstock had several utilitarian benefits, all of which have been mentioned above. However, what prior posters have left out is the primary reason a collapsible stock was adopted: IT LOOKS COOL! Shortly after introduction in Vietnam, there were several reports of indigenous peoples who, after being shot w/ CARs, were heard to ask with their dying breaths: "What kind of gun was that? It really looked cool. It's a shame my guts are all blown out and I'm gonna die, because I'd really like to own one of them. I'd also like to make the world a communist state, but after I get my hands on one of them cool guns." As reports of the "really cool gun" comments filtered back to the Pentagon, the decision was made to go to full production on the collapsible stock. Not only did our soldiers have larger penises than the enemy, but our guns looked cooler too. (This was significant, as the AK-47 is a really cool looking gun too.) Fear spread among the Cong, as many contemplated the possibility that Jane Fonda would start supporting our side again, and have her picture taken with our military men and weaponry, because it would be cooler to do so. Alas, however, Tet came and the politicians ran for cover. CAR stocks never made it to every soldier in the field, and we ultimately had to come home without planting our flag in Ho Chi Minh's ass. We've made up for it in every conflict since. [USA] Now you know.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 8:20:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Rifleman308: In the end, they determined that a collapsible buttstock had several utilitarian benefits, all of which have been mentioned above. However, what prior posters have left out is the primary reason a collapsible stock was adopted: IT LOOKS COOL! Now you know.
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ROTFLMFAO...[img]http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/grinser/grinser009.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 9:35:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/18/2002 9:35:18 PM EDT by knightone]
One useful thing is adjusting the length of pull, A full stock is only really useful for offhand shooting. Target shooting is defferent from combat. A shorter length of pull makes the rifle more stable in a combat stance. It also allows a faster cheekweld and target acquisition. I much prefer my preban with a collapsing stock over any of my post bans with fixed stocks. If the SHTF, that preban is coming with me.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 9:42:38 PM EDT
They look pretty cool.
Link Posted: 12/18/2002 11:08:45 PM EDT
When mixed with an M4 and a bayonet, the enemy really thinks you're the real fu man chew. -Steve
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