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Posted: 6/29/2003 7:33:52 AM EDT
Just wondering how you felt about civilians owning deadly weapons like AR-15's? Does it trouble you that you might have a gunfight with a guy with one? I'm sure most of you agree in the right to bear arms, but at what point do you stop feeling safe?
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 7:53:22 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 9:17:40 AM EDT
The incidents involving so called "assault weapons" is really quite small, and always sensationalized by the media. As a firm beliver in the Second amendment, I feel that all individuals have the right to own and defend themselves with the finest weapons that they can afford. I am more likely to encounter thugs with cheap crapola concealables than with quality weapons. The fact that I may encounter a criminal with a AR is not enough to make me run in fear, screaming gun control. After all, I will one day retire, and want to be able to continue collecting and shooting those weapons that I have grown to know and love.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 10:41:35 AM EDT
This is not a very good topic. I could have answered the questions myself. Don't think that I think AR-15's should not be owned by civilians. I just thought there might be some conflict with the love for the weapon and the fear you might encounter someone with it that wants to break the law. Thanks for the responses.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 12:35:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SaranWrap: This is not a very good topic.
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BINGO!!!!!!
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 1:37:41 PM EDT
I have worked more Agg Assaults where the "weapons" in question were feet, fists, ice scrapers, pointy sticks, telephones, extension cords and anything else that was laying around than with actual weapons, like knives, clubs and firearms of all types, and firearms are at the low end of the mix, compared to all of the other deadly weapons. Just about any object can be used in manner to seriously injure or kill another human being. If my opponent has an AR, it doesn't matter, in the long run. If they outlawed ARs, bad guys would still have them. I will win anyway, because of superior tactics, training and the will to suceed. Unless I get ambushed and shot in the back, which could happen with the cheapest zip gun ever cobbled together, and even then I'll try to be the most "expensive" cop ever taken out in the line of duty.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 2:01:03 PM EDT
Me, I am afraid of spiders...I hope badguys never get some kind of spider mind control machine... The good guys always win, it doesn't matter what the bad guy has, or what YOU think is "scary" for that matter. -Derek
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 2:14:04 PM EDT
Statistically, using real facts and definitions, AW's are far less likley to be used in criminal acts than other firearms. Revolvers and pump shotguns seem to be the weapons of choice, for criminals. AW's by definition fire intermediate power rounds. Meaning more powerful than handguns, less powerful that "conventional" rifles. Now are you trolling or just in a curious mood? This may be "Brothers of the Shield" but it's still part of AR15.com. How do you think people feel about AR-15's if they are members of AR15.com?
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 2:29:10 PM EDT
I would like them to ban "Tri-Star" steak knives in my town....WHY.... It's the weapon of choice for domestic violence.. In fact 8 out of 10 domestic violence users prefer them for stabbing their mates..it's preferred over all other brand of cheap ass dollar store steak knives. Actually we have enough steak knives to open a dollar store in evidence. And enough bats to open a sporting goods store. The last honest to God assault weapon we seized in a crime was believe it or not a rare pre ban street sweaper, only because the drunken dumb ass owner was shooting it off in the streets one New Year's Eve.
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 2:51:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SaranWrap: Just wondering how you felt about civilians owning deadly weapons like AR-15's? Does it trouble you that you might have a gunfight with a guy with one? I'm sure most of you agree in the right to bear arms, but at what point do you stop feeling safe?
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[:K]
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 5:17:41 PM EDT
I'm with all the other people here. None of the idiots I've had dealings with ever owned a good quality weapon, its always an Iver Johnson break-top or Mossberg pump from Kmart, the assorted pocket knives, kitchen ware, tire irons etc. I did remove some nice weapons once from a house after a domestic call, husband left prior to arrival. The soon to be ex-wife wanted them out of the house because the "frightened" her and she wanted to piss off the old man. (He later got them back)
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 5:57:48 PM EDT
oh great, a freakin' [:K]
Link Posted: 6/29/2003 6:12:52 PM EDT
so, if civilians did not own ar15's you would feel safe ?? maybe you should move to england it real safe over there. civilians cant own any guns.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 8:58:39 AM EDT
Natez, an ice scraper in Texas? What was he? a refugee from Michigan? DJ, I DID NOT need to hear the spider thing. I seem to be the only one that has come across quality weapons. None of them qualify as assault weapons though. (An SKS is neither an assault weapon or quality. We see them every so often) Jenning 380's and 9mm's tend to predominate. If it's a quality pistol it's stolen. Took a brand new Winchester Defender out of a guys car just the other day, and SRT shot a barricaded suspect with a AR a few years ago. When it comes down to it, I really don't care WHAT the guy is shooting at me, It's the bare fact he's SHOOTING at me in the first place.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 9:45:33 AM EDT
Yes, an ice scraper. The last time I worked patrol, in fact. About three or four months ago, one of the shifts was short-handed, so I worked two weekend night shifts for OT. Two drunks at a bar. Somehow, they just barely manage to make it home. The male drunk driver says something that offends the female drunk passenger just as they are pulling into the parking lot. She wails the living crap out of him with the nearest object at hand, and ice scraper from the door pocket, tearing big gashes in his scalp, face and neck. They make up, somehow, then she changes her mind and chokes him out. It looked like all of the blood vessels in his eyes were broken. I think she bit him a couple of times, too, and may have broken some of his ribs kicking him in the chest while he was down. We get there and he is on the ground, moaning and bleeding all over the place. He also had a blue warrant. The female was one of the absolute nastiest drunks I have ever dealt with, and that is saying alot. I wisely decided to interview the "victim," while the rookies dealt with the screaming b***h. She let herself be handcuffed, but then went off on the officers when they tried to walk her to the car, and she sliced both of their arms up with their fingernails. The "victim" got somethin like 45 stitches and got arrested when the hospital released him the next morning. The screaming lady got Agg Assault w/ a Deadly Weapon-Family Violence, two counts of Felony 3 Assault on a Public Servant, Resisting Transportation and POM. There may have been a Criminal Mischief too; I think she may have kicked some windows out of the car, and I think she gave the folks at the jail a hard time, and they may have filed some more stuff on her. She kept up her constant rain of abuse in Holding when everyone was doing their reports, and they may or may not have filed some Retaliation charges as well. [b]I LOVE working nights![/b]
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 2:04:25 PM EDT
Officer safety. When you are conducting a vehicle stop, an AR style rifle is not easy to hide or deploy quickly. What I fear more is a stolen Thompson Contender single shot handgun with just about any rifle cartridge, or some of the newer .17 rimfire calibers. The former would go through a vest just as quick as through a t-shirt. A .22lr stops at the last layer of your vest. A .22 mag or .17 will probably get through. Now, there is the other thing about attention to detail. We were leaving the range. There were about $15000 in guns in the back of the truck and in the back seat. The local cop (a field training officer f.t.o.) was lecturing me in a parking lot about window tint and officer safety. (limo tint was still legal in AZ then). The contact (not a stop) was in Kalifornistan. My brother almost blew a fuse, being a Sergeant and training officer. Kinda blows that officer safety thing when you are focused on window tint (I had my window down) and completely miss all of the firearms, including the personal concealed weapons.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 2:06:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/30/2003 2:11:00 PM EDT by wildearp]
Forgot to mention the lecture item of the day. Civilians. This one will get the lecture. Cops are civilians too. District attorneys are civilians. Unless you are sworn an oath and serve in the US military, you are a civilian. This 'them and us' thing gets out of hand with some officers. There is no superior/inferior mentality that is going to gain you a thing in this politically correct world.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 2:21:38 PM EDT
I resent being referred to as a "civilian" all the time by cop's. It rings of being something less. Know what, I'm a CITIZEN of the United States of America, cop's are here to serve me. Cop's are no better than me as I am no better than a cop. Personally I don't care what any cop thinks of my owning any particular kind of firearm. Cop's are not who decides what I can own and not own. The Constitution of the USA is and of course my budget determines that too. [:D] What's up with the "deadly weapons" comment too?? I can use a rock to kill somebody, what makes an AR any more a "deadly weapon" than a pile of rocks?
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 4:11:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bvmjethead: I resent being referred to as a "civilian" all the time by cop's. It rings of being something less. Know what, I'm a CITIZEN of the United States of America, cop's are here to serve me. Cop's are no better than me as I am no better than a cop. Personally I don't care what any cop thinks of my owning any particular kind of firearm. Cop's are not who decides what I can own and not own. The Constitution of the USA is and of course my budget determines that too. [:D] What's up with the "deadly weapons" comment too?? I can use a rock to kill somebody, what makes an AR any more a "deadly weapon" than a pile of rocks?
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So are you sying you own a pile of rocks? Are they "assualt rocks"? [:D]
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 4:13:17 PM EDT
Yeah, I got a BIG pile of them assault rocks.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 4:48:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Johninaustin: DJ, I DID NOT need to hear the spider thing.
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That is why a nationwide ban of spiders must be immediately enforced. If spiders were to get into the wrong hands...I can't even imagine the terror... BAN AR-Spider-15's from civilian use!
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 5:04:57 PM EDT
Are we talkin about pre-ban spiders or post ban? Full auto transferable spiders, Pre-May dealer sample spiders or Post 86 full auto spiders requireing CLEO letterhead? The chief here will not sign for spiders. He's a democrat.
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 5:16:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bvmjethead: Yeah, I got a BIG pile of them assault rocks.
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Well I'm ok with you having AR's and such, 2nd Amendment and all. But I'm gonna have to think about this whole rock pile situation. [;D]
Link Posted: 6/30/2003 7:28:19 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/1/2003 8:06:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Glock918: [>:/] Hello, Let me introduce myself. I'm Art and I'm the friendly neighborhood moderator of this forum. My job is help make sure things go by the rules, to have fun myself, and keep things nice and neat especially for the Fire Fighters, EMS, and LEO's (like me)here. I'm sure you realize this, but your posting on a weapons orientated web site, with a little piece of it geared towards the above professions, but not exclusively just for them. * All members here are pro-gun, for everyone, or else I get to use this cool tool called a lock (it's multi-purpose). * I feel safe to say generally us LEO here think there are TOO MANY gun laws, and the assault weapons ban is a bunch of BS. I've never meet anyone who worked a drive by bayoneting. * An AR15 is a deadly weapon simply because it is firearm as most legal definitions would say, as are knives, bombs, vehicles driven by DUI's, improperly used hammers, baseball bats, screw drivers, and just about anything else. * I will really stop feeling safe when only criminals have firearms, because I will really be outgunned. Art in KY
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Art- on LEOs and gun ownership, including ARs, you say they think generally there are too many gun laws? I live(d) in the NY-Tri-State area and from the news reports here that widely held belief would be considered fable. As a former Peace Officer enforcing Child Protection, our unit specific to Yonkers NY, certainly felt as you - but we never did know, even through our interaction with others LEOs WTF was really on their mind.
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 11:52:47 AM EDT
What scares me are those spiders that have been modified in some back woods lab...yeah, you know the ones I mean...some times out here in the county a night you can Feel those dudes staring at you, just waiting...waiting...
Link Posted: 7/4/2003 12:33:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/4/2003 12:33:47 PM EDT by tcsd1236]
Originally Posted By wildearp: Forgot to mention the lecture item of the day. Civilians. This one will get the lecture. Cops are civilians too. District attorneys are civilians. Unless you are sworn an oath and serve in the US military, you are a civilian. This 'them and us' thing gets out of hand with some officers. There is no superior/inferior mentality that is going to gain you a thing in this politically correct world.
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] Back in the day, vaudeville performers called non-troupe members "civilians". They didn't mean anything more by it than officers today who use the word. Its simply a shorthand manner of referring to non-officers that doesn't need a lot of explaination. People who get wrapped around the axle over this "issue" have nothing much to worry about......
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