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Posted: 8/21/2002 8:49:40 AM EDT
Has anybody come up with a way to beat the "name game"? You know what I'm talking about. Dude doesn't have his ID. You get his name and DOB. No record. Dude Gangsta says, "No, I'm from Georgia". Run Dude Gangsta and DOB out of Georgia. No record. "No, Dude is my middle name, Thug is my first name." I say "Thug Dude Gangsta, DOB, Georgia?" "Yup" No record. Thug and I go to the jail, AFIS turns up he's a resident of my town with a mis. warrant. How do I beat this? I can't get on a name to name basis with every thug and dude in town. Anybody have a game plan?
Link Posted: 8/21/2002 9:13:29 AM EDT
I'm John. Fastest booking sheet in the West. Maybe it just because I'm getting older, and patience is getting REALLY scarce, but they only get one chance with me. No positive ID? Jail time. He can play his games with the drunks in the holding cell. He's lying for a reason, and needs some quality time indoors while you figure out exactly why.
Link Posted: 8/21/2002 9:34:26 AM EDT
Same here, in TN you have to have ID. He sits in holding till he plays the game. Mike Don't sweat the small stuff. "He who angers you controls you."
Link Posted: 8/21/2002 10:15:25 AM EDT
Here in 'Bama if they give a false name to avoid a warrant, etc. it's now a felony.
Link Posted: 8/21/2002 4:54:27 PM EDT
Trip them up. Ask for a Social. Ask more details, then come back to them again several minutes later. Keep going. As you get more and more conflicting information, your reasonable suspicion builds. At some point, you may even cross the threshold in to PC, and you can arrest for whatever your local equivalent to giving false ID is. If not, and they have lied enough, you should be able to articulate enough reasonable suspicion to contiue the detention at a stationhouse and fingerprint the subject for positive ID. If you have AFIS, great. If not, you may have to release (depending on how strong your reasonable suspicon is) and file a warrant later when you get the true ID on the subject. At least, that's how I've done it and its always flown in court and with the supervisors.
Link Posted: 8/21/2002 6:57:23 PM EDT
Whatever happened to taking them back to the interview room and slapping them around with 5 lbs. of truth serum aka. the telephone book? I heard that's how they used to do it.[;)]
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 6:58:32 AM EDT
Failing to ID is (fortunately) a criminal offense in most states. In mine however, it isn't. If the offense they've commited is arrestable, we arrest them. If it isn't and we can't find something else we don't sweat it. In any case, don't play games. If they give you information that doesn't check out, book them. The social security trick is a good one sometimes. The best way is with a cheat sheet. I have a photocopy of the social security prefixes for all 50 states and US held territories. It comes in REAL handy. If they try to make up a social, the first three number should match that of their birth state or the state in which they were issued their number. Ask for their birth state and where they were issued prior to checking it with the cheater. If anybody wants them, I could make up an e-mail. You should be able to get a copy from the local social security office.
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 8:40:08 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 9:03:57 AM EDT
"No ID?, come with me." Central dispatch be advised I'm taking one back to the station house for identification. He's a collar! He'll be positively ID'd after I print him on Live Scan
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 9:37:40 AM EDT
After asking their DOB don't forget to ask them their age. If they are lying they'll either take 15-20 seconds to provide you their age or they'll give you an age that doesn't match up with their DOB. It sure doesn't take me very long to remember my age. Most importantly make sure you get a back up unit ASAP. If the scumbag is lying to you it's a very good possibility he's going to resist in some way or another.
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 10:47:58 AM EDT
We have an "Obstructing Government Operations" law. I use it when I'm certain that they are playing. It just takes so much time, and a lot of radio traffic to get to the point where I can arrest for Ob Gov Opps. It sounds like different states have different ways of dealing with this. I'll keep trying different ways. The best I've come up with is so far is to get everything the first time, confirm it with dude before calling it in. But doing that makes an arrest on our Ob Gov Opps law a little thin. Keep your gameplans coming!! CMOTH- post or E-Mail the list Thankx!! Blueline279@crownvic.net
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 10:49:46 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 12:55:51 PM EDT
When that happens to me, I tell the suspect that he/she has a murder warrant and is under arrest. They usually come up with the correct name/DOB pretty quick after that.
Link Posted: 8/23/2002 11:14:21 AM EDT
Dont worry about it. Cite him under whatever name he wants to use, just get his right thumb print for the cite. Now he has a new documented alias.
Link Posted: 8/23/2002 5:20:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RNYC: When that happens to me, I tell the suspect that he/she has a murder warrant and is under arrest. They usually come up with the correct name/DOB pretty quick after that.
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I love it when they give you their cousin's info, and the cousin comes back with a warrant. Then they give you their correct info, and they don't really have that warrant that they thought they had (but get to go to jail anyway for being stupid).
Link Posted: 8/25/2002 7:17:15 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Wave: "No ID?, come with me." Central dispatch be advised I'm taking one back to the station house for identification. He's a collar! He'll be positively ID'd after I print him on Live Scan
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Absolutely, got to love live scan!
Link Posted: 8/30/2002 7:03:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Blueline279: We have an "Obstructing Government Operations" law. I use it when I'm certain that they are playing. It just takes so much time, and a lot of radio traffic to get to the point where I can arrest for Ob Gov Opps. It sounds like different states have different ways of dealing with this. I'll keep trying different ways. The best I've come up with is so far is to get everything the first time, confirm it with dude before calling it in. But doing that makes an arrest on our Ob Gov Opps law a little thin. Keep your gameplans coming!! CMOTH- post or E-Mail the list Thankx!! Blueline279@crownvic.net
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'Obstructing Government Operations'? Paging Mr.Orwell!
Link Posted: 8/30/2002 7:47:13 AM EDT
I am Constable and have this with Warrant service all the time, one guy said no he's not here as i read his name tatooed on his arm! WRONG ANSWER! I have had people say they weren't the person i was looking for then i would go to phone and call immediately after leaving their residence and they would answer with their name and i would then go arrest them because now i know for sure! Or act like a telemarketer and get them to state their name! GOD i LUV dirty pool!
Link Posted: 8/30/2002 7:51:09 AM EDT
Another one that works is "False reports to law enforcement authorities" Or If in a street sitution(Constables in PA. can arrest on sight offenders Breaching the Peace in their presence in Pa.!) you ask them ,they lie then you let them know Bubba at the Jail probably remembers their name, when they know they are going to jail either way they usually come clean!
Link Posted: 8/30/2002 10:16:44 PM EDT
Anyone know how to limk a document file to a reply post? I tried pasting but it just turned out screwed up. I have the SS# list copied into a notepad file and could link that. Otherwise, I'll have to enter the info manually. That would suck.
Link Posted: 8/31/2002 4:52:17 AM EDT
ALot of interesting replies to this one. I believe that in most places it is illegal to provide false ID either verbal or an actual ID. However the USSC ruled years ago that it is NOT legal to require someone to have proof of ID on them. This of course does not apply to a DL if your driving. But if a person is out walking and has no ID on them it is not illegal. Usually the best way to trip them up is by asking for ID info (DOD, SOC, etc) several times.
Link Posted: 9/3/2002 9:43:13 PM EDT
What I do is lie and tell them that giving false info is a felony punishable by 15 years. I then remind then that if they have outstanding warrants, the last thing they need is another felony charge for lying. I also give them one free chance to come clean with their real name. And this seems to work most of the time. Most people give in but nothings 100% foolproof
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