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Posted: 11/5/2002 8:05:14 PM EDT
Now that Blagojevich is gov and the Demoncrats did a clean sweep in Illinois I have to get ready for the chicago style ban that they promised is going to happen. My question to you is, is it legal for me to take my rifles over the border to Indiana and store my rifles in a storage unit in that state till I move to Texas? Since I wouldn't be in posession here, I assume they won' t be able to do anything about that.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 2:54:12 PM EDT
I would think (just guessing--knowing nothing about what sort of law they will write in the future) that with your guns out of state (out of jurisdiction) there wouldn't be anything they could do. Are you sure you can't move now?
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 3:11:40 PM EDT
i don't see a problem if they are not "registered". if they are registered the only problem you would have is if they come to pick them up and you can't produce them. pack your bags and come on down. That's Right (You're Not From Texas) (Lyle Lovett, Willis Alan Ramsey, and Alison Rogers) You say you're not from Texas Man as if I couldn't tell You think you pull your boots on right And wear your hat so well So pardon me my laughter 'Cause I sure do understand Even Moses got excited When he saw the promised land That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway See I was born and raised in Texas And it means so much to me Though my girl comes from down in Georgia We were up in Tennessee And as we were driving down the highway She asked me baby what's so great How come you're always going on About your Lone Star State I said that's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway Oh the road it looked so lovely As she stood there on the side And she grew smaller in my mirror As I watched her wave goodbye Those boys from Carolina They sure enough could sing But when they came on down to Texas We all showed them how to swing Now David's on the radio And old Champ's still on the guitar And Uncle Walt he's home with Heidi Hiding in her loving arms That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway They're OK in Oklahoma Up in Arkansas they're fair But those old folks in Missouri They don't even know you're there But at a dance hall down in Texas That's the finest place to be The women they all look beautiful And their men will buy your beer for free And they'll say that's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway So won't you let me help you Mister Just pull your hat down the way I do And buy your pants just a little longer And next time somebody laughs at you You just tell 'em you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas That's right you're not from Texas But Texas wants you anyway
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 9:18:43 PM EDT
Hey thanks everyone. I would love to move tomorrow. Only problem is that I just signed a new lease last week. Talk about bad timing. Looks like I'll be here another year. My dad suggests I just take the recievers and put them in a safe deposit box over the border. Why in the world did I have to get stuck in this state? The rest of the country sees the light, but NOooo I gotta get stuck in the next Kalifornia! It's gonna suck not getting to shoot next summer.......
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 3:42:22 AM EDT
how much to break the lease? usualy it's one to three months rent.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 7:36:22 AM EDT
Illinois cannot prevent you from owning a posession in another state. That is the job of the state where the property resides. I'm sure there are plenty of trustworthy members of the AR15 Army here in Indiana, including myself. Alas, I do not posess a significant gun safe (yet) or I'd step up.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 7:56:56 AM EDT
Thanks for the offer. That brings up one of the questions I have about the whole transaction: I have an uncle in Indianapolis that would probably store them for me, but I don't know the rules that apply to crossing the border and giving them to him. I was always under the impression that this was legal, but now I'm starting to wonder if it doesn't have to go through a FFL. These laws are too convoluted.........
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 10:01:05 AM EDT
Good lord, man. Just keep your mouth shut, don't tell everyone, and keep them. AND DON'T FREAKING REGISTER ALL YOU GUNS! Av. <-- I moved to WI to get out of IL. Av.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 10:06:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Avalon01: Good lord, man. Just keep your mouth shut, don't tell everyone, and keep them. AND DON'T FREAKING REGISTER ALL YOU GUNS! Av. <-- I moved to WI to get out of IL. Av.
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DITTO
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 10:26:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/8/2002 10:31:25 AM EDT by rkbar15]
You can legally transport your firearms interstate for any lawful purpose as long as: 1. It is legal in the state you are moving them to. 2. You are not transferring them to another party. You can't legally "give" (transfer) them to your uncle without going through an FFL in his state. Get yourself a safe where you are moving them to and get yourself a non-resident hunting license and/or join a range or gun club in the other state.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 10:38:31 AM EDT
It's too late to keep quiet about them. I bought 4 of them through dealers. it looks like I have to get them out. I'm just making a contingency plan for the day which I hope will never come. I don't have any faith in politicians though. (especially not anti-gun chicago democrats) I though that there would be some wierdness in the law like that. Does that mean it's not legal to go to a gun show or dealer in another state and purchase a rifle either? Or what if I went to visit a relative in another state, showed them a rifle, and they liked it. Would it be illegal to give it to them? How about the safe deposit box scenerio? Would it be illegal to put my reciever in a safe deposit box in another state, or would that be considered transferring ownership to the bank?
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 10:48:30 AM EDT
How long do you think it will take for them to implement this "ban" in Illinois? What part of Texas do you plan on moving to??? Maybe someone could baby sit them for ya.... or store them here in TX in a safe deposit box....
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 11:23:12 AM EDT
I don't know. I heard the ISRA (illinois state rifle association) talking about them doing it in June. Since then I've heard May. Now I hear on the news talk about a hundred mile ring around Chicago. Maybe they won't do the whole state. They've already taken them away in Chicago, even from police, though I understand that some of the suburbs are holding out. I hear that the Chicago politicians put a lot of pressure on the small city governments to ban guns as well. I live 135 miles outside of Chicago. Sure hope the ban doesn't extend this far. If they decide to go for the whole state, we're all screwed.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 11:32:00 AM EDT
Safe way to hand over your weapon: bullets first-- so they know your gun is empty... hehe
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 12:00:38 PM EDT
What part of Texas do you plan on moving to???
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I've lived all over Texas and I like it all, even west Texas. I have family in Houston, Austin, San Antonio, Dallas, as well as a lot of small towns. I've been looking for a sys-admin job down there for a few months now, thought the markets not too good right now. I finally reached the point where I needed to commit in my current situation, so I went ahead and signed another lease. Going back to Texas would be like going home though. I grew up there. Moving back is the eventual goal. My wife even liked it when I took her there. I have a family to look out for, so I just can't just pack up and move without work, like I used to.
Maybe someone could baby sit them for ya.... or store them here in TX in a safe deposit box....
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That's not entirely a bad idea, I just want to avoid any legal entanglements if the JBT's come kicking in the door. In Illinois you are supposed to keep information for 10 years (I think) about who you sell your guns to. The question would come up. If I don't have the guns, then who does? They would want to know. If I worked a legal transfer to another state, I would have to pay $$ for each rifle. If I could somehow retain ownership of the rifles in another location that just happened to NOT be my residence and just happened to NOT be in this state, I don't think I'd have to concern myself with such things. I just want a legal way of owning the things I own, while still complying with their law.
Link Posted: 11/8/2002 3:46:42 PM EDT
You can legally transfer a long gun from a licensed dealer in any state under federal law as long as it's not prohibited in your state of residence or the dealer's state. You can only transfer a handgun in your state of residence under federal law. You can only transfer a long gun or hand gun in YOUR state of residence to a resident of YOUR state unless it's prohibited by state or local law. You cannot legally transfer a firearm to a non-resident of your state of residence without going through a licensed dealer.
Link Posted: 11/9/2002 2:16:35 PM EDT
Thanks I guess that answers the question about taking it to another state and entrusting it to someone else. So there is just one question left in this thread: Can I take it over the state border and rent a place to store it? I'm thinking a storage unit or safe deposit box. Am I correct that I would still be in ownership of the items if I did that, so no transfer would be required?
Link Posted: 11/9/2002 2:41:44 PM EDT
I am no legal expert. That said...I see no problem. IF i own two houses, I don't have to abide by the laws of one while i am in the other. IF you are a resident of the future "Illinoistan" and you can legally posses a firearm in Indiana, you are under Indiana's laws. Illinois can't tell you what to do when you are in Indiana. Make sense? I am in the Air Force Stationed at Scott AFB . I like the area. But, the day they pass any statewide firearm law like you describe, is the day i put in transfer paperwork.
Link Posted: 11/9/2002 8:48:39 PM EDT
Don't sublease your apartment just yet. Even if Blagojevich were to introduce a bill banning handguns statewide, it wouldn't get passed. Same for the rumor about the supposed increase in FOID card fee's, up to $500/yr from $5.00 every 5 years. Too much political backlash downstate. I am born and raised in Southern Illinois, and transplanted in the Chicagoland area. You try to take the guns away from the downstate population, and you're likely to start an intrastate civil war! As for Chicago taking the guns from their cops... I have yet to see that. Most of the Chicago officers I've talked to have huge personal collections...
Link Posted: 11/9/2002 8:56:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rkbar15: You can legally transport your firearms interstate for any lawful purpose as long as: 1. It is legal in the state you are moving them to. 2. You are not transferring them to another party. You can't legally "give" (transfer) them to your uncle without going through an FFL in his state. Get yourself a safe where you are moving them to and get yourself a non-resident hunting license and/or join a range or gun club in the other state.
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you are incorrect, you can give someone a gun in indiana
Link Posted: 11/9/2002 9:40:44 PM EDT
Thanks trooper for the kind word of encouragement. I am holding my breath at this point. I don't have any faith at all in politics. The more I get interested in constitutional ethics the more I get upset about what I see going on on this and many other fronts. It seems as though we may die "the death of many cuts" and what disturbs me most is that I see that me and my "assault" rifles will be among the first to get cut. I don't think I own a rifle that is not on the ban list and I don't like being a sacrificial lamb so that hunters (who's right to hunt is not protected under the constitution) can have the right to continue until that too is cut "to protect the children". I wonder when we will show some solidarity and say "no more gun laws". I don't know how our constitutional right could get any clearer. I wish someone somehow could help the soccermoms see that they can pass these laws, but they won't do any good. Crime will always be there. In the end all they will do is help to turn their children from free men, into surfs. The rest of the world seems to have no trouble with serfdom, but our nation was founded to be something different. We are all supposed to be free men. What is happening to this great nation of ours?
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 7:07:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By armed-to-the-teeth-1:
Originally Posted By rkbar15: You can legally transport your firearms interstate for any lawful purpose as long as: 1. It is legal in the state you are moving them to. 2. You are not transferring them to another party. You can't legally "give" (transfer) them to your uncle without going through an FFL in his state. Get yourself a safe where you are moving them to and get yourself a non-resident hunting license and/or join a range or gun club in the other state.
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you are incorrect, you can give someone a gun in indiana
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We're talking about an interstate transfer of a long gun between residents of different states. Whether you give, sell, or dispose of a firearm you are effecting a transfer and you are required to transfer the firearm through an ffl under this scenario.
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 11:48:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By rkbar15: We're talking about an interstate transfer of a long gun between residents of different states. Whether you give, sell, or dispose of a firearm you are effecting a transfer and you are required to transfer the firearm through an ffl under this scenario.
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Incorrect. I will post the exact answer if i can find it. Interstate sale of HANDGUNS require an FFL. IT is legal to purchase a long gun from a state bordering your home state. So, for his handguns he's need to go through an FFL, but the long guns can be privately sold in a bordering state.
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 11:59:48 AM EDT
[url]http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b1[/url] B. UNLICENSED PERSONS (B1) To whom may an unlicensed person transfer firearms under the GCA? [Back] A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his or her state, if the buyer is not prohibited by law from receiving or possessing a firearm, or to a licensee in any state. A firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector. [18 U. S. C 922( a)( 3) and (5), 922( b)( 3), 27 CFR 178.29] (B2) From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the GCA? [Back] A person may only buy a firearm within the person's own state, except that he or she may buy a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any state, provided the sale complies with state laws applicable in the state of sale and the state where the purchaser resides. [18 U. S. C 922( a)( 3) and (5), 922( b)( 3), 27 CFR 178.29] (B3) May an unlicensed person obtain a firearm from an out-of-state source if the person arranges to obtain the firearm through a licensed dealer in the purchaser's own state? [Back] A person not licensed under the GCA and not prohibited from acquiring firearms may purchase a firearm from an out-of-state source and obtain the firearm if an arrangement is made with a licensed dealer in the purchaser's state of residence for the purchaser to obtain the firearm from the dealer. [18 U. S. C 922( a)( 3) and (5), 922( b)( 3), 27 CFR 178.29]
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 1:41:01 PM EDT
i stand corrected, i focused on the giving of the gun and not the interstate part. yes, i recently read somewhere that you can't transfer a gun to someone not residing in the same state, and that it's a felony w/ 5 years in prison for each firearm (if my memory serves me correctly) i don't see any problem with him renting a storage unit out of state and storing, seeing that he would be the only one having access to it.
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 1:57:14 PM EDT
Thanks so far for all the replies everyone. The part about securing my rifles in an out of state storage facility appears to be the big question. I think we've ruled out letting my uncle keep them. I have been digging around for this information, but I keep finding stuff on storing guns at your house.........
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 2:16:28 PM EDT
Under this scenario, what kind of proof would you need to show that the guns aren't in Il? Would you need to provide the storage locker location so that a local field agent could verify? I would assume that you'd need something more than just saying, "They're in storage in Indiana". Then, once you gave the storage facility location, they'd contact that place. Since you probably would have to sign a rental agreement that had rules against storing weapons,combustibles/flammables, etc., they would open the locker and seize the property. Hopefully you wouldn't get prosecuted for something.
Link Posted: 11/10/2002 8:33:27 PM EDT
Those are exactly the kinds of questions that run through my mind when I mull this whole thing over. I imagine you MUST be able to store guns in a storage facility. How else would you get them out of the house, away from small children? I can't imagine the libs not wanting THAT to happen. I don't ever assume that anything is legal anymore........... The stuff that just seems absurd is often times the stuff that is most true in dealing with guns these days. I think I'll call the state police in Indiana tomorrow and see what they have to say about the whole thing.
Link Posted: 11/13/2002 6:58:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/13/2002 7:03:46 PM EDT by Boomvang]
Some of this is getting really silly. So long as the guns are legal to possess in your uncle's place of residence, you can: 1) Loan the guns to your uncle for any lawful sporting purpose [18 USC 922(a)(5)(B)], 2) Bring your guns to your uncle's house and leave them there for your own use [18 USC 926A], or 3) Make your residence in your uncle's state (maybe at his house?), leave your guns there, and be a temporary resident of Illinois.
Link Posted: 11/14/2002 5:34:19 AM EDT
That's awesome! Thanks for the reply. That was very helpful.
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