User Panel
Posted: 1/23/2002 6:16:58 PM EDT
I mean this as a serious question. It seems almost everyone nowadays is against it but I almost never hear anyone clearly state what it is.
Is it stopping a pickup truck full of thirty mexicans heading north from the US/Mexican border because they may be illegals? Is it pulling over three teen-age-looking black men driving a $50,000 car at 2:00am in a crime-ridden part of town? Is it covering your wallet (or ccw as the case may be) as you walk down the street next to a herd of gangbanger-looking thug-types? Is this racial profiling? I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm just at a bit of a loss as to what racial profiling really is. |
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Yes
Yes Yes Yes It is also, paying more attention to non-citizen young arab men attempting to board an airplane than to an old white woman from Alabama with no baggage. |
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You have the right idea. It means targeting groups of people based upon their race, among other factors, without having any specific target or goal.
For example, black men, especially young black men, are often pulled over for no other reason than they are driving a nice car. Though this occasionally happens with white men, it is far, far more likely to happen to blacks. Generally, cops will be looking for weapons, drugs, or stolen vehicles, and will pull over anyone who matches their "profile" regardless of whether or not any infractions were witnessed. There are lots of other examples, but you get the idea. -Troy |
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It's the eficient use of avaialble technology to combat crime!
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"No slam bam soul brotha, Too boo koo too boo koo...!" is racial profiling.[BD]
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Quoted: Its just damn good police work! Keving67 View Quote That's what I thought. So what's the problem? Even Jesse Jackass once said he feels fear when he hears footsteps behind him on the street at night, but is relieved if it ends up being a white person rather than young black man. |
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Quoted: You have the right idea. It means targeting groups of people based upon their race, among other factors, without having any specific target or goal. For example, black men, especially young black men, are often pulled over for no other reason than they are driving a nice car. Though this occasionally happens with white men, it is far, far more likely to happen to blacks. Generally, cops will be looking for weapons, drugs, or stolen vehicles, and will pull over anyone who matches their "profile" regardless of whether or not any infractions were witnessed. There are lots of other examples, but you get the idea. -Troy View Quote Funny thing is, you don't know the race of the driver of the car you're pulling over at least 95% of the time until you get up to the drivers window. So much for profiling. |
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Quoted: Funny thing is, you don't know the race of the driver of the car you're pulling over at least 95% of the time until you get up to the drivers window. So much for profiling. View Quote TCSD1236, I often think of this. I spend a great deal of time driving on Interstates and very often have blacks absolutely fly by me. I mean, I'm going 70 in a 65 and they blow by me like I'm sitting still. 90% of the time these drivers are black. I have no idea why. I am in a 4X4 truck, so I can see down into the vehicles and notice it is often middle-aged folks too. The thought crosses my mind--the story on TV will always be--"I wasn't doin' nothin', just driving while black, I guess!" I know better. In case anyone thinks my observations are somehow "racist," please be advised my business is conducted far disproportionate to the ratio of blacks in my town, with blacks. I am very close to many, many families--like family. I am only relating my observations. I recently heard Sean Hannity refer to "racial profiling" as "statistical profiling." This is a much better term, I think. [i]Generally[/i] profiles fit for certain areas of law enforcement. For sure, 100% of the terrorists on Sept. 11 fit a specific profile. As Americans, all of us, of all races/groups, must not allow the leftists to destroy this Country with deceptive subterfuge such as this red herring they call "racial profiling." God help us. |
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I'm not black, but I have black friends, and I have had it happen several times while driving with them. Not here in the Bay Area where I live, but in LA and Vegas both. In these cases, after getting everyone out of the car and searching it, and basically being a nusiance, they let us go without even a warning (because no one was doing anything wrong).
I have no problem with people getting stopped for breaking the law, or even if there is REAL reasonable suspicion of a crime. But pulling people over and searching cars with NO articulatible reason is WRONG. I'm not saying that this happens everywhere, but don't think that it doesn't happen. -Troy |
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You can profile based on age, style of dress, gender, ethnicity and other prejudices as well.
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Quoted: Quoted: Its just damn good police work! Keving67 View Quote That's what I thought. So what's the problem? Even Jesse Jackass once said he feels fear when he hears footsteps behind him on the street at night, but is relieved if it ends up being a white person rather than young black man. View Quote |
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There's profiling and there's racial profiling. When the FBI ( or whoever) "develops a profile" of a guy that committed a praticular crime or say someone arrested "fits the profile" thats what Hannity called "statistical profiling".
DWB is just racial profiling. Color and nothing else. Norm in NJ, known for its institutionalized racial profiling |
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Quoted: I'm not black, but I have black friends, and I have had it happen several times while driving with them. Not here in the Bay Area where I live, but in LA and Vegas both. In these cases, after getting everyone out of the car and searching it, and basically being a nusiance, they let us go without even a warning (because no one was doing anything wrong). I have no problem with people getting stopped for breaking the law, or even if there is REAL reasonable suspicion of a crime. But pulling people over and searching cars with NO articulatible reason is WRONG. I'm not saying that this happens everywhere, but don't think that it doesn't happen. -Troy View Quote What you described is an abomination, in light of the IV Amendment. I would be screaming over this. For sure there is an agenda at work nationally (encouraging anarchy/destruction of Constitutional order) by the left, but your events, as described, are wrong, wrong, wrong. [pissed] |
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Racial profiling would be:
A lowrider Honda Civic with waaaayyyyy to loud music and dark tint. Doesn't matter who is driving it is getting pulled over. [beer] P.S. I hate those damn NOPI bastards!! |
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I have been stopped often ("they" say I drive too fast[rolleyes])and I don't mind it when I am doing something wrong(until the policeman gives me the ticket [:)]) but there have been a couple of times when[b] I was stopped for no reason [/b]other than to see what he(the officer) could find.... so he could give me a ticket.
I recall one such stop.It was at night, so no profiling was involved .....just plain "gold digging" on the part of the officer. Lets face it.There are a few jerks out there in all professions, "too eager" to "do their jobs".Cops are no exception! I don't have a well formed opinion on racial profiling. It seems to be a tool used in law eforcement where[b] if something seems out of place,it probably is.[/b]Or maybe rephrased...it might be! So you go with the probability.Almost something like the old story of : -"why do you rob banks?" -"because that is where the money is!" I understand it can be a pain in the neck for those who fit certain profiles;and I have mixed feeling about it's use. And it certainly does not hold up to the legal maxim of :"innocent until proven guilty!" |
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I don't feel Profiling is wrong, wrong, wrong.
Based on FBI crime stats, don't most crimes like murdering while black, drive by shooting while black, robbing while black, beating the fuck out of someone while black have been found to be committed disproportionately by blacks in America. Correct me if I am wrong. It's easy to criticize law enforcement sitting in front of a computer screen, in a safe part of town. Police in charge of public safety can do only so much to fight crime, superman eyes don't come with the badge. Police see first hand the brutal handiwork of violent criminals everyday. You doves out their should visit a few bloody crimes scenes and a morgue, and see what crime actually looks like for yourselves, and then tell me how wrong it is. You Democrats just don't get it. If they feel I fit the description of a perp, then I will be stopped too. Police officers keep up the ((((good common sense))) police work. You have my full support. |
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I am with Troy 100%.......This is America the 21st century, stop that BS.
...............But then I am pro law enforcement, and hated crimes for I was a victim once.........If it looks like a duck and quack like a duck......it is probably a duck. I hate to say that. |
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Quoted: I don't feel Profiling is wrong, wrong, wrong. Based on FBI crime stats, don't most crimes like murdering while black, drive by shooting while black, robbing while black, beating the fuck out of someone while black have been found to be committed disproportionately by blacks in America. Correct me if I am wrong. View Quote [b]To some extent[/b] profiling based [b]partly[/b], not [b]solely[/b] on the basis of race and gender [b]may[/b] be permissible. As some people have pointed out, elderly women (of all races) don't tend to commit crimes. But acting upon race and gender and using them as the only reasons to indiscriminately stop people and search them for evidence of crimes that [b]there is no specific evidence that they have committed[/b] is contrary to everything that the Republic stands for. That is what really upsets people. See Troy's post above about being stopped and searched for no reason at all. Police officers keep up the ((((good common sense))) police work. You have my full support. View Quote I assume that you are a man. Since men commit nearly all violent crime, perhaps you would not mind being stopped and searched by the police anywhere you went. In fact you should show your full support by having them search your house too. "Oppressed and dispirited people neither possess arms nor know how to use them" Unknown Author View Quote It is interesting that you would use this as your sig line. Perhaps the most classic use of profiling is by the NYPD in the poorer areas of New York City like Harlem and the Bronx. As you are undoubtedly aware, you require a permit to carry a handgun in New York, and in NYC, it is almost impossible for any honest person to get such a permit. NYPD has a unit called the Gun Control unit (or a similar name), and the practice of this unit has been to "get guns off the street" in the poorer parts of the city as follows: 1) See black male. 2) Stop black male (Freeze! Police!) 3) Frisk and search black male for a gun (which is illegal only because the city says so). 4) Move on. Note the lack of warrants or any real consent on the part of the black male. He is treated like a slave. If a gun is discovered, he will be hauled off to prison, even if he was just carrying it for his own protection. In some ways, there is a correlation between gun control (which I assume you are opposed to) and the oppressed and dispirited people you seem to be concerned about. This is not intended to be a flame. But I think that if you were prejudged, stopped and harassed by the criminal justice just because of your personal attributes that [b]you could not change[/b], you would feel different. |
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I stand by my post. I don't have all day to debate every situation until a favorable counter point can be made.
Democrats always use this ploy to make victims out to be the bad guy. It ain't gonna work with me. When the crime stops, the profiling will stop. When Jesse feels safe, I will feel safe. |
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Most serial killers, child pornographers, and computer hackers are white men.
Stand and deliver, we want your lupins. |
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Quoted: ... I almost never hear anyone clearly state what it is. View Quote Racial profiling generally means the use of race or color, [b]by police[/b], to identify and [b]stop or search[/b] individuals as potential criminals without [b]any specific reasons to suspect that they are actually criminals[/b]. While other types of behavior might be called profiling, they really are not. Is it stopping a pickup truck full of thirty mexicans heading north from the US/Mexican border because they may be illegals? View Quote Possibly. In this case, they are close to and heading away from the Mexican border, which makes their ethnicity [b]one of the factors[/b], not the [b]only factor[/b]. Legally speaking, there is a big difference, and this would probably hold up in court. Is it pulling over three teen-age-looking black men driving a $50,000 car at 2:00am in a crime-ridden part of town? View Quote Absolutely. This is one of the most indefensible. None of the behaviours described above, being black, being three black men in a group, driving a $50,000 car, at 2:00 a.m., driving in a crime-ridden part of town, are individually or in the aggregate, a crime by any stretch of the law. As long as they are obeying the rules of the road, the police have no business stopping them. If white were substituted for black in the above sentence, there would rightfully be an uproar. The police do not have the power to determine what behavior is lawful or not; we the people retain that power. Is it covering your wallet (or ccw as the case may be) as you walk down the street next to a herd of gangbanger-looking thug-types? View Quote You are not a police officer, and your covering your own wallet does not constitute any interference with said characters. You are minding your own business and trusting your own intuition in looking out for your own safety. More power to you. All of us have done this at some point or another in our lives. Is this racial profiling? I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm just at a bit of a loss as to what racial profiling really is. View Quote It is a good question, and I think a good discussion has resulted. I don't think that the use of race or color in the decision-making process of police officers should always be ruled out, as long as race is used [b]in conjuction[/b] with other factors of behavior that are [b]actually suspicious[/b]. On the other hand, singling out people for attention only because of their race or color is wrong and will surely sour the relationship between the police officers and the citizens that they have sworn to protect. |
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Hey Paul, how in the fuck could someone tell a serial killer or a child molester from anyone else just by driving down the road. Unless of course he fit a (((profile or description.)))
And I don't know if your stats take into account the difference in population either. If the police can get those white bastards by profiling or any other method I don't care. It's not a color thing with me, it's a becoming a victim thing. You read the papers? Criminals today are able to ply their trade without fear of being caught or getting punished proportionally for their crimes because of the feely touchy loving hearts of the enlightened amongst us. Turn on your TV news tonight and come back with that criminal enabling bullshit your spewing. |
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Let's see.
A Red-Headed White-Boy in a musclecar is cruising through the Central District. He gets pulled over by the nice police officer who says: "What are YOU doin' in this neighborhood, boy?" Would [i]that[/i] be racial profiling? [;D] |
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Quoted: Criminals today are able to ply their trade without fear of being caught or getting punished proportionally for their crimes because of the feely touchy loving hearts of the enlightened amongst us. Turn on your TV news tonight and come back with that criminal enabling bullshit your spewing. View Quote Am-O-Tramp, maybe you're watching too much TV news. |
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Quoted: Let's see. A Red-Headed White-Boy in a musclecar is cruising through the Central District. He gets pulled over by the nice police officer who says: "What are YOU doin' in this neighborhood, boy?" Would [i]that[/i] be racial profiling? [;D] View Quote |
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Quoted: Criminals today are able to ply their trade without fear of being caught or getting punished proportionally for their crimes because of the feely touchy loving hearts of the enlightened amongst us. Turn on your TV news tonight and come back with that criminal enabling bullshit your spewing. View Quote Ahhh... TV News. The only rule about crime reporting on TV news is.... If it bleeds, it leads. TV News' crime reporting is one of the [b]major reasons[/b] why so many people are scared of guns and associate guns with only crime and criminals. When was the last time TV News told you about the use of a gun for lawful self-defense? Considering that this use happens about 2.5 million times a year, you'd think they'd tell you about them a lot more often. |
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I'll tell you all you need to know about racial profiling. If you want a tart apple do you pick a red one or a green one? A green one!? WHY?! Because it happens to be green or because you know, through your life's experiences, that a green apple is most likely tart...? You'd be a fool to ingnore what you have learned throughout your entire life.
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Quoted: A Red-Headed White-Boy in a musclecar is cruising through the Central District. He gets pulled over by the nice police officer who says: "What are YOU doin' in this neighborhood, boy?" Would [i]that[/i] be racial profiling? [;D] View Quote Jokes apart, it would. And it would be just as wrong. If there is no reason to suspect white-boy of a specific crime, there is no reason to [b]stop[/b] him. Certainly, being in "this" neighborhood is really his own business. That is the way it should be in a republic of free citizens. The police exist to protect citizens, not to tell them where they should or should not be. Now if the cop wants to discreetly keep an eye on white-boy, that is one thing, but [b]stopping him[/b] without probable cause is another thing entirely. |
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Quoted: I'll tell you all you need to know about racial profiling. If you want a tart apple do you pick a red one or a green one? A green one!? WHY?! Because it happens to be green or because you know, through your life's experiences, that a green apple is most likely tart...? You'd be a fool to ingnore what you have learned throughout your entire life. View Quote You are comparing apples and oranges. Sorry, I couldn't resist [}:D]. If you, as a private citizen, use your own life's experiences to avoid interaction with certain groups of people, that is your own business. But you don't have the right to use a uniform and the power of the state to [b]stop or search[/b] other people who are minding their own business and not visibly committing or appearing to be committing any crime. |
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As our State Police said...blacks sell crack, bikers sell meth, so I guess jews own the banks, white guys drink beer and really cute blondes with long legs and short skirts don't get tickets
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Profiling is real. One afternoon on my off day I was riding my Harley and I managed to take a few wrong turns and ended up in the worst part of Atlanta. Granted I felt very uncomfortable about riding through a neighborhood on a motorcycle worth more than any 2 houses down there combined. I was telling a friend of mine about this lovely trip, and he told me not worry about it. He is a Zone One APD seargent and was kind enough to let me know I was in no danger because every undercover guy in the zone would be watching me because a white guy on a Harley down there is either lost or buying drugs. That made me feel much better![;)]
[beer] |
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Quoted: Profiling is real. One afternoon on my off day I was riding my Harley and I managed to take a few wrong turns and ended up in the worst part of Atlanta. Granted I felt very uncomfortable about riding through a neighborhood on a motorcycle worth more than any 2 houses down there combined. I was telling a friend of mine about this lovely trip, and he told me not worry about it. He is a Zone One APD seargent and was kind enough to let me know I was in no danger because every undercover guy in the zone would be watching me because a white guy on a Harley down there is either lost or buying drugs. That made me feel much better![;)] [beer] View Quote So you were lost?[BD] |
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What is "racial profiling ?"
The answer must be that individuals are singled-out because of their race and because of their race alone. Thankfully, as to whether this is good or bad wasn't the question. |
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Profiling isn’t so bad as long as it’s someone else being profiled.
I doubt any of its defenders here would support profiling of gun owners. |
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Quoted: Profiling isn’t so bad as long as it’s someone else being profiled. I doubt any of its defenders here would support profiling of gun owners. View Quote This is already starting to happen, albeit in small amounts. During the Y2K scare, the FBI released a report called Project Meggido, which, among other things, suggested that gun owners, people with RKBA bumper stickers, people carrying copies of the Constitution (!) and others like them were "more likely" to be capable of domestic insurrection and violence. In some of the most anti-gun states, being a (suspected) gun owner probably ranks way up with being black. |
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That started with AG Reno in about 1995. She published a list of "terrorist suspect" profiles for LEO's to be aware of--RKBA bumper stickers, camo clothing, etc. This is not new.
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Once, only once in my life was I knowingly subjected to profiling - not racial profiling but profiling.
Turns out I was asked to step out of line and answer some questions because I was (1) Young and (2) Had on sunglasses. How do I know ? Because I got in their face (literally) and made them tell me. Only one was a US Marshall the other was an air line employee. I reacted badly; very badly. |
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