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Posted: 1/22/2002 10:39:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2002 10:47:54 AM EDT by Chimborazo]
Alright, I'm tired of hearing the argument that evil black rifles cause children to grow up in an unhealthy environment. I think it's crap, but I have a hard time arguing it. So, let me play devil's advocate, and present the following argument: [b][i]I think it's okay to have one gun in the house for protection, but only one handgun. Having "assault weapons" is totally unnecessary, and creates an unhealthy environment for kids. It creates feelings of paranoia and fosters violent tendencies.[/b][/i] As I think of more, I'll add them into this post.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 11:01:43 AM EDT
There was actually a study done by some group on kids who were JDs. They looked at who went hunting & who didn't. The "didn't" portion was overwhelmingly part of the JD bunch versus the "did". I think Am Rifleman listed this study a few months ago.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 11:39:20 AM EDT
So only one gun in the home is the handgun? Or you get a gun in the home and a handgun i.e. Two weapons? I agree “assault weapons" are unnecessary in the home because it’s a defensive position and is not a good place to assault from. Ideally you should repel assaults from your home and wait for reinforcements (the cops). As far as an AR-15 making someone paranoid I don’t understand the logic. They have a rifle what do they need to be paranoid about? It is imperative that one should teach children from a very early age what death is and what the responsibilities are for taking life. But no we condemn the tool and teach children CQB tactics on computer “games”.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 12:00:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By BobCole: There was actually a study done by some group on kids who were JDs. They looked at who went hunting & who didn't. The "didn't" portion was overwhelmingly part of the JD bunch versus the "did". I think Am Rifleman listed this study a few months ago.
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At the risk of sounding like an idiot, what is "JD"? 308wood, One gun total in the home.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 12:06:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2002 12:07:15 PM EDT by gunman0]
Well, kids like to put things in their mouths and swallow things. So, I'd make sure you use a non-toxic CLP on your guns. Also, make sure to use only jacketed bullets. Don't want your kids swallowing lead rounds, they could be poisoned. Also, guns are heavy and hard, and could break glass, causing great harm to the children, if children get them near windows or glass tables. Make sure to remove all glass from your house as that could injure your child.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 12:09:53 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Chimborazo:
Originally Posted By BobCole: There was actually a study done by some group on kids who were JDs. They looked at who went hunting & who didn't. The "didn't" portion was overwhelmingly part of the JD bunch versus the "did". I think Am Rifleman listed this study a few months ago.
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At the risk of sounding like an idiot, what is "JD"?
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Try [b]J[/b]uvenile [b]D[/b]elinquent.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 12:10:15 PM EDT
I think JD is juvinille delinquient sorry for the horrible spelling Keving67
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 12:47:39 PM EDT
Thank you...that post is a lot more meaningful now. I guess what I'm curious about is whether there have been studies done on the relationship between firearms in the home and a child's propensity for violence.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 3:18:30 PM EDT
There was a study (which I cannot find now, of course) that studied juveniles and gun useage. Those who were given guns and instructed in their proper use, regardless of whether they hunted, were more law-abiding, and less likely to use drugs that those who had no exposure to guns except in relation to their friends. I'll try to find it. No mention, however, was made about [i]type[/i] of weapon. IMHO, a kid with a Match AR is probably a good kid.
Link Posted: 1/22/2002 6:19:32 PM EDT
My dad taught me gun safety and how to shoot when I was about 4 years old. He had 3 or 4 pistols and rifles in the house that I knew were off-limits. I turned out OK and have a healthy respect for weapons to this day. No, it's not unhealthy. What's unhealthy is disrespect and/or ignorance of guns.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 5:46:12 AM EDT
Anyone have any links to these studies? I'll try NRA first. Thanks for the input.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 9:52:35 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 9:56:03 AM EDT
THAT'S IT!
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 9:57:23 AM EDT
Isn't the question really whether or not the kids respect the [u]parents[/u]? Put guns in every home, and ask yourself my question..... I don't think it's the guns at all. -kid
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:11:03 AM EDT
Of course it's not the guns, they are inanimate objects. Like a knife, or a baseball bat. It's the user, not the tool. I think it's only fair to quote the entire section from that report- see pg. 18, [url]http://www.ncjrs.org/pdffiles/urdel.pdf[/url]
Gun ownership and delinquency Adolescent ownership and use of firearms is a growing concern, and results from the Rochester study suggest the concern is well founded. By the ninth and tenth grades, more boys own illegal guns (7 percent) than own legal guns (3 percent). Of the boys who own illegal guns, about half of the whites and African-Americans and nearly 90 percent of the Hispanics carry them on a regular basis. Figure 13 shows a very strong relationship between owning illegal guns and delinquency and drug use. Seventy-four percent of the illegal gunowners com-mit street crimes, 24 percent commit gun crimes, and 41 percent use drugs. Boys who own legal firearms, however, have much lower rates of delinquency and drug use and are even slightly less delinquent than nonowners of guns. The socialization into gun ownership is also vastly different for legal and illegal gunowners. Those who own legal guns have fathers who own guns for sport and hunting. On the other hand, those who own illegal guns have friends who own illegal guns and are far more likely to be gang members. For legal gunowners, socialization appears to take place in the family; for illegal gunowners, it appears to take place “on the street.”
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Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:23:28 AM EDT
It's a tough read, but I would suggest reviewing this article- "Firearm-Related Injuries Affecting the Pediatric Population" AMERICAN ACADEMY OF PEDIATRICS [url]http://www.aap.org/policy/re9926.html[/url] For instance, this is a quote from the article:
UNINTENTIONAL FIREARM-RELATED DEATHS In 1997, 306 (7.2%) children and adolescents younger than 20 years killed by firearms died as a result of unintentional firearm-related injuries. Only 6.5% (20/306) of these deaths involved children younger than 5 years of age. However, deaths from unintentional firearm-related injuries account for a large proportion of firearm-related deaths of younger children. Twenty-four percent of firearm-related deaths in children younger than 5 years of age are attributable to unintentional shootings; 26% for children 5 through 9 years of age; 21% for children 10 through 14 years of age; and 5% for adolescents 15 through 19 years of age. The rates for males are higher than those for females, and the rates for blacks are higher than those for whites.1 Most unintentional shootings occur among children left unsupervised at home.37-39 Unintentional shootings in rural areas are more likely to occur outdoors with shotguns or rifles, in contrast to urban areas, where they are more likely to be indoors with handguns.40 However, handguns account for ~70% of all unintentional firearm-related injuries and deaths.17,40,41
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Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:28:54 AM EDT
Originally Posted By MustangMan: My dad taught me gun safety and how to shoot when I was about 4 years old. He had 3 or 4 pistols and rifles in the house that I knew were off-limits. I turned out OK and have a healthy respect for weapons to this day. No, it's not unhealthy. What's unhealthy is disrespect and/or ignorance of guns.
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Ditto here. I cut my teeth on a 22 barrel and have always had guns in my home. They were unloaded but NEVER locked up! I had 3 kids. By the time they could understand they were taught to respect them and to LEAVE THEM ALONE. I taught them all to shoot when they were ready. My son still shoots and one of my daughters still enjoys shooting but the younger daughter was never really interested. SO BE IT! Shes not an advocate to disarm the the public because she does not like to shoot though and all grew up to be responsible citizens.[shock] All education belongs in the home, unfortunately there are morons amongst us and THEY ARE WINNING.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:33:56 AM EDT
Thanks for all the input. Let me further clarify what it is I'm trying to accomplish. I'm not arguing gun safety, I'm strictly trying to argue that the mere presence of "evil black rifles" in the household [i]do not have a negative psychological impact[/i] on children. Of course there are many variables, but for the sake of argument let us say that this is a stable family. I've heard arguments that it makes them feel insecure or paranoid, or that they should be scared all the time.
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:42:33 AM EDT
Education. Food makes them feel secure. Heat makes them feel secure. A home makes them feel secure...................
Link Posted: 1/23/2002 10:57:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Chimborazo: ...I've heard arguments that it makes them feel insecure or paranoid, or that they should be scared all the time.
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No that's adult gunowners! Just kidding. [:)] Seriously, there are some among us who are "paranoid and insecure", and seek guns as a way to feel stronger and safer. As evidence, I'd suggest looking at all the SHTF fantasies we like to kick around. Some people seriously prepare by planning to carry 35 pounds of weapons and ammo, forgetting about simple things like water, maps, and toilet paper. That, and the statistics quoted above that delinquent boys (especially) are much more likely to have and carry guns than non-delinquent boys makes me worry. I don't think they're feeling all that secure, do you? I do not think that guns themselves create that feeling, how could they? But guns are seen as an easy answer to reducing that feeling, doncha know. As someone noted above, security and stability come from the family structure, having enough to eat, and other basics. The reality is that guns in the home increase the risk of accidental and intentional injury and death. How do we deal with that fact? My answer is hold gun-owners accountable for keeping guns secure and out of the hands of kids who shouldn't have them.
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