I Believe and I fear, I have a funny feeling about this, that something will happen during New Years celebration maybe even in Times Square.

If Osama has a nuke or other extremely nasty weapon it will be New Years Eve that will be the biggest and best target. Think about Times Square at the stroke of midnight with all those people, and what it would be like if a suitcase nuke were to be detonated. Over one million dead, and you might just as well say good by to NYC for a few years at least. And how about the EMP effect. I have told everyone I can to not go to Times Square or even to any first night celebration for New Years. New Years Eve, all those parties filled with potential victims. If I was a terrorist I might even give up on a couple of those virgins just to take out Times Square. It is a very tempting target. And as to if Osama actually has a nuke well I certainly don’t know any more then if I am going to me attacked when I go to the store, but it is always best to be at least mindful of what might happen. And he might have one and it may already be in place just waiting for the timer to read 01-01-02 00:00. What we do not know can certainly kill us. By the way I wonder what effect if any a small nuclear Weapon and EMP would have on my area Rhode Island.

Well I hope we all Survive the New Years Eve and then we can all argue about how it was ridiculous to think that Osama’s people could actually nuke NYC. Have a safe and happy New Years everyone.

thats the kind of thing that starts ugly rumors that stupid people belive as fact.

More BS for me to look forward to. VVV

One thought: If it is a terrorist's intention to spread  'terror' amongst his victims, why dog NYC again? Why not LA, DC, where ever else they celebrate?

You might get the most bang for your buck by nuking NY, but the terror factor would be dimininshed.

JMHO

I don't think any other terrorist "attacks" will happen. I've always thought that since Sept. 11th, and for some reason, am sure I'm correct.

Notice how Anthrax has all the sudden disappeared? I also don't believe that that was the work of terrorists.




You know in malls where everbody can drop a bunch of gifts in bags off? Usally around the holidays every mall has one, and people leave presents their in bags or packages for the needy people. If I was a terrorist, I'd leave a nice big bomb in a bag in one of those drop offs, in a crowded popular mall. Probably kill at least 200, maybe more, and with lots of injured people. The mall would also close down, and probably others in fear of the same happening.

That wouldnt do anything for our economy either.

Well the facts are to the best of my knowledge that the attack on the WTC was well planned, and they had plenty of time to set up a second strike if they wished. What type of attack who knows. Osama wants a nuke and he can afford to purchase one or several if they were to come on the market or be available. The Soviet Union had Suitcase Nukes available and some in the United States. One high ranking ex-Soviet military officer said that some of the Suitcase Nukes were unaccounted for, as many as 100 maybe missing, I may be wrong on the number. So to state that it is impossible for Osama to have acquired any Nukes is foolish just as foolish as laughing at someone who would tell you that a terrorist might turn his shoes into a bomb. If something happens then it was not a foolish idea it is now reality.

So what are the odds that NYC will be Nuked well not very high but it is still within the realm of possibility, and stranger things have happened, have they not.

Better to be safe then sorry

At this juncture, I wouldn't rule anything out.  Scumbags are plentiful.

But if your scenario does happen, I think a certain group will be re-targeted.  You know what I mean.

No more attacks well lets see. I believe that there have been attempted attacks but the FBI etc have prevented them for happening, like the one at the Galaria Mall in Cambridge Mass. And lets not forget about the latest one with the Shoe Bomb.








And think about this right now NYC should be the safest place as far as another terrorist attack goes. Just look at all the security in place and if even that level of security is not enough to be safe then what city can ever be safe. And what happens if more then one city is targeted for Nuclear Hell, like Washington D.C.

I am not saying that malls will not be targets but why waste a nuclear weapon if you have one on a mall.

Regardless of what you've heard, I'll still be in NYC doing my job. Terrorists be damned.[X]

Which is why I say let's keep the heat on these SOBs.

I truly believe that one very good reason that there was no 'second wave' of attacks after the Sept 11th attack is because of the roundup of suspected terrorists by the FBI!

These 1,000+ people taken off the streets may have put a serious obstacle to a whole lotta follow-up attacks.

Just think, ringleaders, drivers, look-outs, explosive experts, communications experts, and a whole raft of such folks taken out of circulation would put the kabosh on any well laid out plans.

I say, Attorney General Ashcroft, keep it up!

Eric The(SorryForAnyInconvenience,ButThisIsWAR!)Hun[>]:)]

he, he, you go boy!

Ok I hate to say it but the old quote about nothing to fear but fear it's self would come into play about now.  I like fact that up to this point there hasn't been any real bad rumors spread other than the ones the media is put out. I have no intention of traveling to NYC...never have never will and i think most people don't either, not because Sept.11 but just I/they don't care for the city life.  I must say I would agree that i find it highly unlikely NYC would be targeted again so soon.  LA-SAN FRAN-DALLAS etc... or maybe some little town with less than 1,000 people I mean after all big cities can absorb lots of damage and survive but what if they killed a whole town? Every man,woman,child,dog,cow,cat or bird?  Wouldn't that be something for the arabs to rejoice over!  Dang! I think i saw a dark haired man with a funny accent at the local stop and rob...i better go dig my hole in the back yard and retrieve the Y2K gear until this blows over.  [:D]  Well i just said alot of nut'n

RIGHT ON SNIPER!!!!

Good call. I agree with you 100% and evidently the NYPD and the U.S. government does, too. Check out this story at [url]http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/37585.htm.[/url] (cut and paste).

This articles states that many NYPD officers will be carrying "radiation sensors" on New Years Eve. At $15,000 each, these government issued devices don't come easy and there must be something the general public is being kept in the dark about for them to be issued by the FEDS. (so whats new?)

We're upstate, 4 hours from ground zero and have an ample supply of Potassium Iodate tablets (just in case).

Let the ignorant naysayer's flame you (and me) at will, they are only proving that their lack of caution and common sense is the reason we got into this mess to begin with.

God forbid that anything will happen in NYC on New Years Eve, BUT if it does and a million people lose their lives as NYC is rendered uninhabitable for the next 1000 years, well......I guess we'll just have to call it "evolution". The smartest and most wary of all species are those that survive and claim the opportunity to continue to breed.

Hang tough and stay alert, WE will survive.

Ginseng...If what you say does happen, you better avenge our asses!!![heavy]

Here's hoping I don't glow-in-the-dark soon![beer]

[<]:)][<]:)][<]:)]Happy New Year![<]:)][<]:)][<]:)]

hey, i have tritium (H3) in my military watch, will that set off those radiation sensors???

[shock]

Let's first get our heads out of the newspapers and into reality.
Suitcase nukes are by the physical requirements of a nuclear device an iffy proposition at best. If they had been planted without sufficient lead covering they certainly would have been discovered by now. If such a device does exist it will be limited in scope that is to say nothing like an H-bomb and probably with the capacity to take out a few city blocks. But unless someone shows that they actually exist by physical evidence then I am skeptical. Not unprepared just skeptical.
For the "if we don't then the terrorists win" crowd lets think about that for a minute. I work in NYC in the shadow of the WTC so I am there everyday. The destruction was enormous, one for the terrorists.
The Patriot Bill was passed, a bill that the members of congress did not read prior to voting on it because it was not available to anyone outside committy. One more for the terrorists.
Air port security is now going over to another federal agency and a few more tax dollars and a little more liberty lost. One more for the terrorist.
National ID's and chips are being discussed and seriously considered. Gosh, another one for the terrorists.
From listening to talk shows and reading papers it appears that the overall consensus is that the government is responsible for the protection of our lives. Well, according to a dozen or so SC cases the responsibility for our protection lies in our own hands and I agree. So if our mindset has gone over to we need more government then I think that is one more for the terrorists.
There are a number of things going on that I have not touched upon and there is more anti-terrorist legislation that is being discused that will infringe on our rights. Sounds like more wins for the terrorits to me.
Be prepared. You can enjoy you life but don't have the attitude that nothing has changed.

I wonder if joe-average cop(me) will be able to get my hands on one of those toys...

Always, always, ALWAYS keep this in mind:

If a nuke, even a little one is popped in a major US city, there will be martial law. There will then be a "suspension" of Constitutional rights, as has never before been seen.

Also, the world economy will go into a depression that makes "The Depression" seem like a joke.
There will be famine.

So, if in safeguarding our freedoms, we allow this to happen, it will result in the end of the United States AND those freedoms.

What a situation.

I wish this were true but unfortunately, there is some validity to the ugly rumor.
Some weeks ago, the press learned from unnamed sources in the government (CIA/DoD/FBI) that there was a real threat of a small tactical nuclear weapon being used against the United States.  Not much detail was provided but this much we know:
The Russians have reportedly been unable to account for as many as 48 small tactical nukes.  These weapons come in two sizes.  One is the size of a large suitcase.  This is not too much of a threat since it takes several men to hump it around and set up.  The other is the size of a fairly large backpack.  The backpack weapons were reportedly once in the custody of the Soviet Spetnatz forces and the KGB.  They were to be used against key NATO installations in Europe and the United States in case of all out war with NATO.  The weapons were small third generation (most likely boosted implosion) bombs in cylindrical containers.  They were light enough to be carried by one man.  If the backpack weapons are in the hands of our enemy, AND they do not have a permissive action link (PAL), a cypher lock requiring two person control built in by the Soviets, then they do pose a very serious threat to us and our allies.
The bomb physics packages are limited life components.  That is, they degrade over time.  Reportedly these bombs started out life with a max yield of up to 10kt.  That is 1/2 the yield of the Hiroshima bomb.  Even if the bomb had aged to 1/2 of its nominal yield, that is still a fearsome weapon if detonated in Times Square at midnight.  I can't remember the degradation curves but even after 5 years, they should be very powerful.
Although the Russians claim that the number of lost bombs is false, they still can't account for all of the missing ones.  Some may be missing only on paper.  Problem for us is that it only takes one real one to do the job.
Now for the intel indicators:
UBL and his deputies have publicly declared that there would be further fierce attacks against the United States.  Others have been seen discussing future more violent attacks ‘en camera’ when they didn’t expect us to get the tapes.  Only the quick work of Atty. Gen. Ashcroft in ordering the blanket roundup of all suspicious characters has prevented more such attacks.  There are indicators on UBL's tapes and from captured enemy that another attack has been planned.  We know we haven't caught up with all of these scumbags yet.  There may be more sleeper cells out there waiting until midnight of the 31st.
Just yesterday, the local DC papers reported that NYPD has issued nuclear detectors to the cops working Times Square.  This is a pager-like device that vibrates, sounds an alarm and lights a light if the officer comes in proximity of a nuke.
I’m sure the Nuclear Emergency Search Teams (NEST) are out scouring every potential location for a nuke too.
Put all of this together and you have a mix for disaster.  Will it happen?  The only people who can answer that question are the ones who may be about to attack.  I fervently hope it is all BS but I then I never thought the enemy would use planes to take out buildings either.  They do have the capability and the will...I'm just not sure they have the means.
Bottom line, we can’t just dismiss this threat out of hand.  It is real.

He may have a nuke who knows.  Question is, does it even work, would they have any clue as to how to opporate it?

The *real* end of the millenium is coming that New Years Eve- better get your bunkers ready!

If you want to see the effects of a 1 megaton or 25 megaton blast in NYC, see this link .  How far is far enough away?

[url]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/bomb/sfeature/mapablast.html[/url]

IIRC Most "backpack nukes" had yields of less than 5kT...Specifically 1 kT yields as standard were mentioned. Tritium has a 12.3 Year Half life, but depending on how the weapon was designed, only a fractional half life degradation of the Tritium within the weapon may render it useless. Tritium in a Fission weapon can be used as a booster for an Energy yield increase, or as an enhancer for the Pit itself (to use less Plutonium). If it is used as an enhancer, the weapon may fail to establish a chain reaction at all if the Tritium is too old. Let's not forget the explosives that will collapse the pit, or the electronics that govern the detonators. All of these can fail with the passage of time.

People think Nuclear Warheads, once built, are there like small arms ammunition, ready for use whenever needed. Not so. They require a hell of a lot of maintenance.



 

The above two posts are excellent information on the worst case sceneario, that being a nuclear device.  Judging from the collapse of the command and control, there is little now to be worried over.

IMHO, Richard Reid, the shoe bomber, was one of their last operatives as the best were used first in the 4 planes.  Mr. Reid bought the concocted explosive over the Internet.  The explosive wasn't PETN based, it was peroxide derived, unstable and unpredictable.  Still dangerous but showing how effectively the threat has been attacked.

I recommend against going to Times Square, not out of fear but out of the reasoning I will be up early on the 1st to go to the range!

Yes,this is true.
Just the other day I had a AC-130 jamed up my a$$ and God knows I had time to plan.

Just cuz the cops have over 200 people dose not mean we are safer,binny boy still has 2 or 3 more over here.
just cuz he is now more white than the rag on his head dose not mean he can't still fight the evil Americans. [rolleyes]

Great link! If the blast don't kill us the fallout will. Let's just make sure this[-=(_)=-]and these guys[marines]get the job done

Amount of maintenance very relative in a temporal sense.  I know for a fact that some all up rounds were deployed for years without being returned to depots for maintenance.  Field maintenance consisted of nothing more than keeping the toys clean and dry.
As stated, tritium is a radioactive isotope of Hydrogen (H-3) used in gas form as booster for nukes.  It is used in virtually all sophisticated nukes to greatly enhance the nuclear burn by supplying a huge number of very energetic neutrons to the fission process...during the few microseconds (shakes) that the physics package is going supercritical.
Since the tritium ages at a rate of 5.5%/year, it might take a number of years to degrade the weapon to the point of making it a complete "fizzle".  More likely, with the more sophisticated weapons, what you would get is a limited fizzle, in which the net yield was somewhat less than you wish.  Of course, that is exactly what we wish in this case, if we can't get a total failure of the weapon or capture of the terrorists ahead of time.
I agree, the most likely nominal yield of one of these is on the order of 5kt.  Even if that number is somewhat reduced by time, that is really scary if it is detonated in a crowded Times Square.  I really hope this is all BS.

Two cities in Japan were nuked in 1945 and neither one was "uninhabitable" for anything close to a thousand years.

[url]http://ki4u.com/[/url]

Me and the Wife attended(well I got to see one class)a seminar on surviving a limited nuke exchange.
Potassium Iodide link above.

Actually, I was playing with one of those radiation detectors today.  Its a little bigger than an old motorola pager, and it has and on/off button, and a noise/vibrate button.  It also has a one digit LED (LCD?) display, that can display a number from 1-9.  

We tried to set it off with the tritium on our nightsights, but no good.  They told us that it was ultra-sensitive, but apparently not that sensitive or the nightsights 1" away would have set it off.

Anyways, what the hell am I supposed to do if the thing goes crazy, that means that there is radiation in the vincinity.  What do I do, shoot the guy in the U-Haul truck?  What if we find out he just got back from Chemotherapy?? OOPS!!!!!

BTW Ray, As of one hour ago, I am on vacation!!!! 10 days baby!!!!  No Times Square Detail for me!!!  It took me 5 years, but I finally got a New Years Off!!!!!

I will be heading to Atlantic City for New Years Eve.  I Have been trying to get a room since a month ago.  No Luck, it looks like Ill be sleeping in the Jeep.  Boy is the girlfriend gonna be pissed!!    Later Ray, call me tonight,  Steven

... I bought one!
[img]http://www.radmeters4u.com/cdv715-new.jpg[/img]

Never hurts to be prepared.

Ummm, IANAS  (I am not a scientist) but my limited amount of schooling taught me that everything is radioactive.  Therefore everything loses atoms, electrons, nuetrons, stuff... whatever, all the time.  Some things just do it at weapons grade.. hehehe

Keep in mind that the US has already demonstrated that it can pick up individual, encrypted, cell phone calls in 'real-time' while identifying both the sender and receiver using voice recognition,decrypting on the fly using satellites tens of thousands of miles away from the earth.

I highly doubt that we cannot track the HUGE amount of radiation that is given off by weapons grade uranium, plutonium, et al.

TheRedGoat

ps, I will  sleep just fine on 12/31/01.   Four rib, standing roast and bottle of red wine to ring it in!

OK Renamed, maybe I exagerated the length of time that the soil, remaining buildings, food, corpses etc. would be contaminated. You're right, I'm wrong. No need to be concerned.

Maybe the higher than average cancer rates in those 2 cities are just a coincidence.

If you post your mailing address, I'll see if I can get you some of those famous glowing potatoes from Chernobyl, Russia.

Hey, you're not the guy that bought all the "bargain priced" homes around Three Mile Island are you?

Open up an old style smoke detector (probably has a rad symbol or warning label on it some where and hold near the source (small metal can with slots in it) that might set it off that used to work on those yellow civil defense geiger counters like the one shown above. Actually over the past few weeks NYC shouldve issued dosimeter's (about the size of a pen)to all of its employees whose movements could be tracked retroactivly -Police-maybe firemen-sanitation workers-MTA people -anyone who gets around specific areas of the city and looked at those on a daily basis to see if anyone came up as having been exposed to any moderate radiation along thier travels this would have been usefull in detecting source materiels for a bomb being assembled here. even on just a spot check level throughout the bouroughs the chances of picking something up before the fact would have been greater --by the time your personal monitor goes off in times square new years night its too late. The same with the Biowar agent sensors once the analysis is done if an agent is detected --what do you do? quarrantine 2 million people in Times square propper --"Uh Im sorry folks you will all have to remain here "-- Its too late once the release is detected the genie is out of the bottle.

New Years Eve off? Ladies and Gentlemen, this guy is quite possibly the luckiest cop on Earth right now! Steve, you suck...

Im sure its just a mistake.  I took this coming week as my annual vacation pick, and so they cannot touch me for the New Years Eve Detail.

They havetried though.  4 Lt's have already approached me with written notifcations with MY name on it.  and all 4 times I said, sorry Its my annual Pick.

Now they are trying to tell me that my annual picks are not effective until Jan 1 st.  And since the detail is on Dec 31, Im supposed to work.

I cant wait to see how piised off they are all going to be when Im not there. Hehehe


Steven

He doesn't even need a real nuke, just some sort of irradiated material and some regular explosives for a nice "dirty" bomb. But, I don't think it's gonna happen. I bet 250,000 of the million people at Times square will be LEO/Military undercovers!(G)

[red][size=4]Great Call.[/red][/size=4]

Face it, they already shot their load.  They are resorting to kludged up shoe bombs from France.

I certainly hope so.....Steven

Once again, much ado about nothing...